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Stokes v Woakes

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brandon said:
That's true, but then who would you say are currently our best four bowlers? Out of interest??

Regarding the keeping situation - both of those are in their thirties and perhaps they didn't want someone so old to come in, seeing how Prior is being talked of no longer being a spring chicken. As a side note I quite like the look of that Simpson at Middlesex.
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Onions (when fit), Finn and Panesar are all better bowlers than Stokes, Woakes, Moeen

The reason ECB want bairns is so they don't rock the boat and don't break down after playing 14 tests a year.
 

johnson said:
Finn is nowhere ready to play, so has nothing to do with anything, have to consider selection from who is available.

Apparently wakes has gained a yard of pace, so I wouldn't judge him until you have seen him again.



I just don't get the batting stuff like, he is playing a number 8, so his batting is totally irrelevant, it only becomes an issue, when they want to drop a batsman to play a spinner and play woakes or Stokes at 6 or 7.

Currently we should pick our best 4 seamers, based on their bowling and nothing else.

Who would they be?
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Tough call. I think this England setup seems to be picking a lot all rounders in the hope that a long batting line up and plenty of bowling options will see us through. I agree with your approach and would like to see it expanded to the entire 11 - best 6 batsmen, wicketkeeper, best four bowlers

Anderson, Broad (despite recent struggles), Plunkett and........? Not convinced Stokes, Woakes or Jordan are good enough. The huge chasm caused by Swann's retirement has caused this imbalance (not to mention Panesar's ill timed journey off the rails...)
 
smoker said:
Onions (when fit), Finn and Panesar are all better bowlers than Stokes, Woakes, Moeen

The reason ECB want bairns is so they don't rock the boat and don't break down after playing 14 tests a year.
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At their best yes. The fact is Onions hasn't been fit and is sadly now past it as an England bowler in almost all conditions. Finn by his own admission has been unselectable until possibly now and Monty cant get a game for his county most of the time.

The fact is we haven't had good enough bowlers to choose from full stop.
 
smoker said:
Onions (when fit), Finn and Panesar are all better bowlers than Stokes, Woakes, Moeen

The reason ECB want bairns is so they don't rock the boat and don't break down after playing 14 tests a year.
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That still doesn't answer the question though.

CURRENTLY, who are our four best bowlers?
 
TopCat said:
Tough call. I think this England setup seems to be picking a lot all rounders in the hope that a long batting line up and plenty of bowling options will see us through. I agree with your approach and would like to see it expanded to the entire 11 - best 6 batsmen, wicketkeeper, best four bowlers

Anderson, Broad (despite recent struggles), Plunkett and........? Not convinced Stokes, Woakes or Jordan are good enough. The huge chasm caused by Swann's retirement has caused this imbalance (not to mention Panesar's ill timed journey off the rails...)
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Why can't they just go to Monty and say we will help you through mate, give him all the support he needs. He should in the side like IMO, sport is all about managing different personalities.

Telegraph hinting it might be Woakes and Jordan in for Plunkett and Stokes.

I am happy for Jordan to play, I don't think he is ready with the red ball , but he bowled well last week so worth a go.

Very very harsh dropping Plunkett, has taken 16 wickets this summer, they reckon it might be to rest him for old trafford, but Broad needs a rest.


We can't afford to waste the new ball again or we could be out of this series before we know it
 
johnson said:
Why can't they just go to Monty and say we will help you through mate, give him all the support he needs. He should in the side like IMO, sport is all about managing different personalities.

Telegraph hinting it might be Woakes and Jordan in for Plunkett and Stokes.

I am happy for Jordan to play, I don't think he is ready with the red ball , but he bowled well last week so worth a go.

Very very harsh dropping Plunkett, has taken 16 wickets this summer, they reckon it might be to rest him for old trafford, but Broad needs a rest.


We can't afford to waste the new ball again or we could be out of this series before we know it
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So the best two bowlers from Lords will be dropped and the worst two left in...... Jobs for the boys.
 
brandon said:
That still doesn't answer the question though.

CURRENTLY, who are our four best bowlers?
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'Currently' based on what? Based on county form you would have to pick Ryan Sidebottom. Based on natural talent you should pick Steve Finn.
 
Broad needs to be taken out of this team like, his knee is fucked and he's in no form whatsoever as it is.

Would like to see Finn given another go at some point in the near future. Pick him and just tell him to bowl as quick and hostile and possible, it's a disgrace England tried to curb that and make him into a pitch it up swing bowler a few years back.
 
Saw Finn bowl in a limited overs game the other night, he looks good, back bowling quick and hostile.
 
smoker said:
'Currently' based on what? Based on county form you would have to pick Ryan Sidebottom. Based on natural talent you should pick Steve Finn.
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Based on whatever you want mate, it's just with a previous post you said players are being picked for their ability to bat rather than solely on bowling - I agree with you. However I just wondered who you felt should be picked instead - based on bowling alone.

Finn can't be picked based on his own admission that he's pretty much lost the plot. Panesar can't be picked because he's got no interest (seemingly) in playing cricket at all at the moment.
 
brandon said:
Based on whatever you want mate, it's just with a previous post you said players are being picked for their ability to bat rather than solely on bowling - I agree with you. However I just wondered who you felt should be picked instead - based on bowling alone.

Finn can't be picked based on his own admission that he's pretty much lost the plot. Panesar can't be picked because he's got no interest (seemingly) in playing cricket at all at the moment.
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Finn has been in good form this season. Get him in for Broad who needs a rest.

Plunkett has done enough to keep his place.

Stokes has been disappointing, give Meaker a shot.

We are in a transitional phase as a team, so we can afford some chopping and changing in pursuit of the next lineup.
 
johnson said:
Why can't they just go to Monty and say we will help you through mate, give him all the support he needs. He should in the side like IMO, sport is all about managing different personalities.

Telegraph hinting it might be Woakes and Jordan in for Plunkett and Stokes.

I am happy for Jordan to play, I don't think he is ready with the red ball , but he bowled well last week so worth a go.

Very very harsh dropping Plunkett, has taken 16 wickets this summer, they reckon it might be to rest him for old trafford, but Broad needs a rest.


We can't afford to waste the new ball again or we could be out of this series before we know it
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Suppose it depends whether Monty is showing any signs of wanting to help himself. If he is in some sort of destructive, downward spiral then exposing him to the pressures if top level cricket could be disastrous
 
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