Our turnover of playing staff since our last promotion must be the highest.
- Thread starter Scary nuns
- Start date
- Status
poisson
Winger
Turner never recovered fully from that knee injury
D
Deleted member 27897
Guest
Its been that long I've forgotten half of them
But seen as I forgot those players, there must have been a very good reason why....
Scary nuns
Midfield
A whole new team here and see how much they cost us.
Season 07/08
Michael Chopra£5,000,000
Kieran Richardson£5,500,000
Dickson Etuhu£1,500,000
Paul McShane£2,500,000
Craig Gordon£9,000,000
Andy ColeFree
Kenwyne Jones£6,000,000
Ian HarteFree
Danny Higginbotham£2,500,000
Jean-Yves Mvoto Mv£300,000
Phil Bardsley£2,000,000
Rade Prica£2,000,000
Andy Reid£4,000,000
Total£40,300,000
Season 07/08
Michael Chopra£5,000,000
Kieran Richardson£5,500,000
Dickson Etuhu£1,500,000
Paul McShane£2,500,000
Craig Gordon£9,000,000
Andy ColeFree
Kenwyne Jones£6,000,000
Ian HarteFree
Danny Higginbotham£2,500,000
Jean-Yves Mvoto Mv£300,000
Phil Bardsley£2,000,000
Rade Prica£2,000,000
Andy Reid£4,000,000
Total£40,300,000
andymcnish
Striker
Cost of Keano's team... £40m.
Staying in the Premier League...priceless.
I don't forget for one second how we were looking at the 3rd tier before Keano turned up.
He gave us the single best season I can remember followed by one that laid the groundwork for our longest post war top tier stay...8 years and counting now...
Staying in the Premier League...priceless.
I don't forget for one second how we were looking at the 3rd tier before Keano turned up.
He gave us the single best season I can remember followed by one that laid the groundwork for our longest post war top tier stay...8 years and counting now...
Lord Alfred
Striker
I seem to recall that was the fee we were quoted but from what i gather Short offered the cash up front to Hull.......£4m.....so on that basis we got decent service from him but dropped a couple of million when we sold him.
Perryqhill
Striker
Name someone other than Mig who Bruce signed who gave value for money, didn't fuck off straight away and had a resale value. Most of the shit you aim towards Keane can be used with Bruce too, Bruce spent around £30m in each of his three seasons, where's the quality?
We also let McShane go for 500k as a sweetner to keep the fee down, as Turner had a sell on fee to Brentford / Charlton.
Last edited:
Darren Bent gave value for money and made us a profit. Villa offered him a potful of money and he done what we'd all do and moved on.
Oshea has given value as has larrsson . Gyan got double figures in his only season and got us our money back. Cattermole has given value. Sess was good and got our money back. McLean made a profit.
May be able to scrutinise Bruce's ability to put a team together and gel them but his record in transfer market was pretty good all things considered.
T
theinediblebulk
Guest
Turner was 4mil, not 8.
Perryqhill
Striker
Bent went straight away, what about the problems the sales of him and Gyan caused us? Bad choices, certainly nothing built when you rely on them so heavily. and did Bent actually give us a good profit? He went for £18m, with add ons. We had to stump up £16.5m to Spurs for him eventually.
O'Shea and Larsson are questionable though, I'll take O'Shea even though he's average. and Cattermole come on ffs, still questioning his worth three seasons on he spent the first two injured or suspended.
Bruce's record in the transfer market wasn't good though, Westwood, Angeleri, Riveros, Da Silva, Benjani and an over reliance on loans, whilst the fee's we paid to agents in his time here rocketed.
How can you mention players like McClean, who he never even played and you ignore the likes of Meyler under Keane?
Sess gave value, but then players like Gordon, Bardsley, Richardson, Malbranque and Jones were all signed by Keane, all used by Bruce and gave some good service. You forget that.
When have I ever knocked bardsley,Richardson or jones? Malbranque 7m for a 5 a side player I question mind. The ultimate flatter to deceive player. And regardless of Gordon being unlucky with injury he was never a 9m keeper in a million years.
Bent and Gyan were offered more money than we were prepared to offer that's hardly Bruce's fault mind. What was his fault was paying 8m for whickham.
Westwood,Angeleri,Da Silva and Riveros cost us about 2m tops in fees. His only major outlay that has been a waste was Gardner. Whickham is still a bit of a work in progress.
Even if Bent cost is 16.5m and went for 18.5m it's a 2m profit plus a boatload of goals.
Irrelevant. We're still here, and this has been our most successful period in decades. Why posters need to bleat on about how we got here is more about their own personal agendas, than actually relevant to our current situation.
I think it's very relevant as if Keane had spent the money more wisely then our current plight could well be a lot healthier. Other managers have made errors as well mind and keane certainly wasn't all bad but his record in transfer market was appalling given the unprecedented backing he received.
Perryqhill
Striker
Malbranque was excellent first season. In his later seasons he kept and moved the ball brilliantly and started many attacks even if he wasn't at the end of them. Funny how you play his worth down, yet suggest the likes of O'Shea and Larsson have gave good service, when much of the time O'Shea has been weak as piss and Larsson garbage.
As for Gordon 'not being a 9 million pound keeper' - do you think Borini is a £14m pound forward or is it just an indication of market forces at each time?
All those were Bosmans barring Angeleri, they're still signings clogging up the wage bill. You do realise in Bruce's first season he doubled the amount we spent on Agent fees (over £5m) and then it increased the season later? These 'free' players aren't always 'free'.
So profit is good, regardless of the cost?
f***ing bollocks and you know it. He moved us on massively and wasted some, then couldnt take us any further. We signed in most cases the only reasonable players who would come. The man who wasted the real chance to move us on when there was a base of players there was Bruce. Bruce had a free reign to move in and out who he wanted and top them off with some big signings. He had a big squad to wheel and deal with and for a while he done well, but wasted a real opportunity to move on.
Last edited:
S
Sebasaurus II
Guest
We paid half of that. I wasn't a fan of his either.
We have absolutely no way of knowing that. To bleat on about "the maybe would have" gets you nowhere, and leaves a never ending bitter taste. I've supported Sunderland since the 1950's, and seen all sorts of shocking decisions made in that time. There's really no point in dwelling on stuff like that, when you are doing ok. The lower leagues are full of once very successful clubs, who would give anything to be where we are. All of those clubs have made profligate errors in their past, which have led to their demise. We however, are still up here, and trying to stay that way. We have no definite guarantees that changes to any decisions we made in the past would leave us in a better position. You can't change the past, so why poison your brain by continually brooding on your mistakes.
Not true. If I remember, Angeleri was £2 mil alone. Riveros was undisclosed and I can't remember Da Silva. Add then you're not factoring in wages and other fees. Along with those, you've got Gardner, Vaughan, Ji and Kilgallon. He spent a decent amount on Campbell. The only reason we got our money back on Elmo was because Bruce loves him and signed him again. When you add all those up, it's probably around 10-15 million with a whole lot more on wages.
Larsson didn't cost 7m though. As far as freebies go he's been ok although I'm by no means his biggest fan. Malbranque was a complete myth in my opinion. Ok in first season after that he pulled wool over a lot of eyes.
Oshea gets a rough deal for some reason. By no means a world beater but he's been value for the 5m we've paid.
I don't think Borini is a 14m player at all but I don't think a few others who are knocking about are value either. Gordon at 9m nearly ten year ago was Barmy for a steady away keeper who's since become a superstar since injury curtailed him.
Of course his Bosmans were still signings and took up wages but certainly shouldn't be condemned like the ferdinands,mccartneys,Chopras and reids of this world.
You keep talking about Bruce having this free reign as if Keane was under some kind of supervision! Keane was a complete law into himself and as soon as Short tried to bring him into line his toys went out the pram!
Bruce isn't blameless but I believe it's Keane who wasted the real opportunity.
Perryqhill
Striker
Keep hearing the same people say we got no value out of Keane's spend (Quinn said it was about £67m iirc) so lets take the generic £80m everyone tells us it was. Now this is from http://www.transferleague.co.uk/premiership-transfers/sunderland-transfers.html which most people use and for me isn't that accurate anyway, but here is a list of most of the players Keane signed and approximate values of what they were sold for, even if it wasn't Keane selling them all.
Roy O Donovan Free
Marton Fulop Undisclosed
Kenwyne Jones£8,000,000
Andy Reid£1,000,000
Rada Prica Undisclosed
Greg Halford£2,000,000
Michael Chopra£4,000,000
Anthony Stokes£1,000,000
Paul Mc Shane£2,000,000
Carlos Edwards£2,000,000
Danny Higginbotham£2,500,000
Dickson EthuUndisclosed(believed to be £1.5m)
Ross WallaceSigned(believed to be 650k)
Pascal Chimbonda Signed(believed to be £3m)
El Hadji Diouf£2,000,000
Stern JohnSigned
(believed to be 500k)
Steed Malbranque£1,500,000
George McCartneyUndisclosed (believed to be £1m)
David Myler£1,500,000
Kieran Richardson£2,000,000
Anton Ferdinand£1,000,000
A quick count up comes to around £35m. Now we know a lot was wasted but he inherited next to nothing, got us up, stayed up and then scraped up again. Some of those players played well over 100 games for us and contributed to us staying up in those first two seasons, some like Richardson played 130 odd times, keeping us in the league for 5 seasons ffs!
Why compare Larson to Steed? Malbranque was a far superior player, regardless of what you think of Steed who was a very good footballer.
O'Shea's a very average footballer, but decent talker and organiser. He's had as many poor spells as he has good.
Gordon was signed in 2007, was extremely highly rated at the height of a transfer boom when Villa were paying £10m for Curtis Davies ffs, £8m fo Reo Coker etc, that's why at the same point we paid more for Ferdinand and McCartney. That's the thing though, either you have a selective memory or you can't remember. It's like comparing Bent a few years ago to signing Borini now and thinking we're vastly overpaying.
Like I said before, all Bruce had to do was ad a bit of quality. He had backing and he failed, that was a bigger opportunity. Keane had to get us there and get us taken seriously.
This. Basically Bruce is a wheeler dealer and initially he had shitloads of players here, money and more or less a free reign to do what he wanted. But as we paid loans, signings, agents etc for bigger deals and had players tied up on deals money eventually ran low. He inherited a Premiership side and still spent about £30m per season (some generated by his own sales) and ended up with a bloated squad with little or no value in it.
It'll be more than £15 million before you get to agents, wages etc.
Angeleri £2m
Gardner £6m
Riveros undisclosed (rumour was a £2m agent fee, but I wont count that)
Ji £2m
Kilgallon £1.75m
Campbell £3.5m rising to £6m (only take the lower fee)
Roy O Donovan Free
Marton Fulop Undisclosed
Kenwyne Jones£8,000,000
Andy Reid£1,000,000
Rada Prica Undisclosed
Greg Halford£2,000,000
Michael Chopra£4,000,000
Anthony Stokes£1,000,000
Paul Mc Shane£2,000,000
Carlos Edwards£2,000,000
Danny Higginbotham£2,500,000
Dickson EthuUndisclosed(believed to be £1.5m)
Ross WallaceSigned(believed to be 650k)
Pascal Chimbonda Signed(believed to be £3m)
El Hadji Diouf£2,000,000
Stern JohnSigned
(believed to be 500k)
Steed Malbranque£1,500,000
George McCartneyUndisclosed (believed to be £1m)
David Myler£1,500,000
Kieran Richardson£2,000,000
Anton Ferdinand£1,000,000
A quick count up comes to around £35m. Now we know a lot was wasted but he inherited next to nothing, got us up, stayed up and then scraped up again. Some of those players played well over 100 games for us and contributed to us staying up in those first two seasons, some like Richardson played 130 odd times, keeping us in the league for 5 seasons ffs!
Why compare Larson to Steed? Malbranque was a far superior player, regardless of what you think of Steed who was a very good footballer.
O'Shea's a very average footballer, but decent talker and organiser. He's had as many poor spells as he has good.
Gordon was signed in 2007, was extremely highly rated at the height of a transfer boom when Villa were paying £10m for Curtis Davies ffs, £8m fo Reo Coker etc, that's why at the same point we paid more for Ferdinand and McCartney. That's the thing though, either you have a selective memory or you can't remember. It's like comparing Bent a few years ago to signing Borini now and thinking we're vastly overpaying.
Like I said before, all Bruce had to do was ad a bit of quality. He had backing and he failed, that was a bigger opportunity. Keane had to get us there and get us taken seriously.
This. Basically Bruce is a wheeler dealer and initially he had shitloads of players here, money and more or less a free reign to do what he wanted. But as we paid loans, signings, agents etc for bigger deals and had players tied up on deals money eventually ran low. He inherited a Premiership side and still spent about £30m per season (some generated by his own sales) and ended up with a bloated squad with little or no value in it.
It'll be more than £15 million before you get to agents, wages etc.
Angeleri £2m
Gardner £6m
Riveros undisclosed (rumour was a £2m agent fee, but I wont count that)
Ji £2m
Kilgallon £1.75m
Campbell £3.5m rising to £6m (only take the lower fee)
Last edited:
As I've said Keane did some good here. I'm not dismissing him as a failure by any means just pointing out the unprecedented amount of money he had really should have taken relegation out of the equation not have us in 18th and staring down the barrel at time of his departure!
You seem unable to give Bruce any credit yet he had to almost start from scratch given we stayed up by skin of teeth season before he arrived thanks to the side that Keane had assembled so to claim all it took was a couple of quality arrivals to turn it round is frankly ridiculous Perry and I'd expect better.
I could be wrong but I don't remember ever being in the bottom 3 at any point under Bruce.
The manager who saw fit to spend that on Reo Coker and Davies also decided it would be a good idea to spend 5m on Graham and thought that Cahill wasn't good enough for his Villa side!
My overall point is that I can't understand for life of me (well I can actually but I can't be chewed to argue toss again) how Keane is some kind of hero whilst Bruce is despised!
A good post, however I am by no means brooding or getting myself all irate at what has gone on just discussing it.
You're right we have no way of knowing how anything could pan out but the joy of supporting a club like Sunderland is the not knowing and then speculating on it wether over a beer with friends or on here with good people like you.
Last edited:
- Status
