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Would Ball have got an England cap


Superkenwynejones said:
Wasn’t even that good in the championship man. The man the myth the legend
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He started decent at centre half but was never really that dominant due to height etc, he was a decent Division 2 (later division one before Champ) player.

Played briefly at right back, centre back again and briefly in midfield before staying in midfield.

There was no doubt in Reids first promotion and PL seasons he was worthy of a place, but after that we had better players at the club and when we had Rae, Clark and Summerbee and Johnston he shouldn't have been in the team. On too many occasions Reid reshaped the midfield to get him in.

I liked him as a man and a footballer but it was only till I got on this forum when I saw how revered he was as I wasn't really that much of a fan. Still not sure I really get it tbh.
rentaghost said:
Absolutely and made better by those on here who have given serious replies :lol:
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I'm just replying to a reply. But the opening post is obviously a piss take.
 
BucketBiff said:
Wipe the rose tinted glasses off. He was crap
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In what sense, was he crap? He had a key role for nigh on a decade, in a team that consistently stayed in the PL. He had one of the best pass completion rates, best interceptions made rates, most tackles completed amongst the English players playing at the top level during his time here. Do you not think that deserved recognotion by England when the likes of ageing Gareth Barry, Scott Parker and such greats of Barton and Shelvey were picked?
 
HeroHurley said:
In what sense, was he crap? He had a key role for nigh on a decade, in a team that consistently stayed in the PL. He had one of the best pass completion rates, best interceptions made rates, most tackles completed amongst the English players playing at the top level during his time here. Do you not think that deserved recognotion by England when the likes of ageing Gareth Barry, Scott Parker and such greats of Barton and Shelvey were picked?
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Barry was ten times the player with more ability than Ball, Parker too. Barry was an excellent footballer.

Barton had a up and down career but it was mostly PL and he deserved the cap the time.

There is always an argument to be had when there's names like Shelvey in there, but Shelvey is a talented player who had something England didn't really have a while back. Ultimately he wasn't ever good enough but you can see why he got capped.

Even the likes of Gavin Mccann deserved his cap and was far superior to Ball.There isn't a point in history where Ball should have been near a cap. Bally barely played that much PL football either and only played regularly in central midfield from 96 onwards. F*ck sake you're talking about Cattermole not Ball!
 
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Perryqhill said:
Barry was ten times the player with more ability than Ball, Parker too. Barry was an excellent footballer.

Barton had a up and down career but it was mostly PL and he deserved the cap the time.

There is always an argument to be had when there's names like Shelvey in there, but Shelvey is a talented player who had something England didn't really have a whole back. Ultimately he wasn't ever good enough but you can see why he got capped.

Even the likes of Gavin Mccann deserved his cap and was far superior to Ball.There isn't a point in history where Ball should have been near a cap.
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I agree. Ball was nowhere near international clase. I was replying to the post about Cattermole mate. Barry was still playing for England when an oil tanker could have turned around quicker. Catts deserved recognition but not Ball.
 
HeroHurley said:
In what sense, was he crap? He had a key role for nigh on a decade, in a team that consistently stayed in the PL. He had one of the best pass completion rates, best interceptions made rates, most tackles completed amongst the English players playing at the top level during his time here. Do you not think that deserved recognotion by England when the likes of ageing Gareth Barry, Scott Parker and such greats of Barton and Shelvey were picked?
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He was largely a one paced plodder. Don’t get me wrong had some decent enough games. Gave his all but his all overall wasn’t good enough. Hampered us massively when trying to bring in new players due to his massive wage. I don’t blame him for his wage by the way. We had a habit of rewarding players that weren’t good enough or past it with massive contracts. If I was offered his terms I d sign it. As would every one else.
 
HeroHurley said:
I agree. Ball was nowhere near international clase. I was replying to the post about Cattermole mate. Barry was still playing for England when an oil tanker could have turned around quicker. Catts deserved recognition but not Ball.
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My mistake. I didn't read it correctly and thought you were talking about Ball!
 
BucketBiff said:
Hampered us massively when trying to bring in new players due to his massive wage.
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Not sure how much that's true mind. We kept on signing players like Rodwell on a damn site more than him or tried to replace him about 5 times. He kept on being better than those replacements and he was one we could have sold and got near to selling only to realise his importance and then give him a new bumper deal as a result. I'd say he mostly performed better than the majority of midfielders at the club over those PL years - blame the shit replacements like Bridcutt, Rodwell, Ndong, Cabral, N'Diaye, Gibson, Gardner or the decisions not to sign Mvila, Muntari (as he was shit and not really a central player).
 
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BucketBiff said:
He was largely a one paced plodder. Don’t get me wrong had some decent enough games. Gave his all but his all overall wasn’t good enough. Hampered us massively when trying to bring in new players due to his massive wage. I don’t blame him for his wage by the way. We had a habit of rewarding players that weren’t good enough or past it with massive contracts. If I was offered his terms I d sign it. As would every one else.
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He had a role in a team that was consistently a PL side. He did that role well, consistenly. His wages and the fact that the club didn't improve the squad doesn't come into it. Di Canio tried to push him out, Cattermole was close to leaving and stayed years after he was removed.
 
No, he was good and really committed. Could have played more in the top flight imo but not England class. Shaun Elliott could have imo and maybe Craddock.
 
Kevin Ball was a great leader, stong in the tackle and great at doing what he did, break play up and give it to someone more creative. Technically, as a footballer he wasn't great though. He himself would tell you that. Underrated by people outside of Sunderland I would imagine but nowhere near international quality.

Mind, Jack Rodwell has 3 caps for England so I suppose there would have been hope for Bally if Rodwell is the level required :lol:
 
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