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SoL To Undergo Multi-Million-Pound Investment Programme

Sgt Pepper said:
Agree mate they do. Mags are going absolutely leet at the minute about what their fanbase has become, home and away - and it’s hilarious. Only thing I would slightly disagree on is on us being any different. I honestly don’t think any of them would get the crowds we have if their history mirrored ours. We get mocked for empty seats and I do think we’re somewhat at a ceiling with the crowds we do get so on that basis yes the ground can appear too big by a few thousand, but there isn’t a club in the country imo would get the crowds we do after the decades and recent years we’ve had. Which is what makes me even more want to limit capacity in any future hypothetical scenario to what we have already got so we keep it for the people, so to speak.

Wouldn’t fill it and at the first sign of trouble any newcomers would be gone again so the ground would have more empty seats.
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Disagree completely, with a decent side in the top 10 we'd fill it. I think 55k is our ceiling, we just haven't got the catchment area like the mags (for example).
 

Julio Mackemo said:
Disagree completely, with a decent side in the top 10 we'd fill it. I think 55k is our ceiling, we just haven't got the catchment area like the mags (for example).
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Fair enough mate, all about opinions. Our crowds last time in the Prem make me think we wouldn’t because we weren’t consistently selling out what we have now. Obviously take your point that you’ve said if we were a top 10 side, whereas when we were last up there we were absolutely dog shit and had a team and ownership group the fans were split on to say the least. I just think going off history and as you say, catchment area, plus the other usual factors that all feed into football attendance, I reckon about 46k is our ceiling. I’m more than comfortable with that, like I’ve said before, give me 46k proper supporters packed in any day than 55k diluted with day trippers.
 
Sgt Pepper said:
Fair enough mate, all about opinions. Our crowds last time in the Prem make me think we wouldn’t because we weren’t consistently selling out what we have now. Obviously take your point that you’ve said if we were a top 10 side, whereas when we were last up there we were absolutely dog shit and had a team and ownership group the fans were split on to say the least. I just think going off history and as you say, catchment area, plus the other usual factors that all feed into football attendance, I reckon about 46k is our ceiling. I’m more than comfortable with that, like I’ve said before, give me 46k proper supporters packed in any day than 55k diluted with day trippers.
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It's a funny one, we get p!ssed off quicker than other fans :lol: but we averaged 47k twice in the early noughties. Football is more popular now and I think we'd fill the other few thousand. We just need to price it properly, we had 44k last week versus Hull for example.....
 
Weststand said:
Knew you were going to come back with the premier league not sold out bit - thats why I noted that football has grown massively in them years since we were last there...even our support in these dark last 10 years or so. There is no way we can reduce the stadium capacity in any shape or form - the City is growing at a phenomenal rate, this needs to be mirrored in all areas including the football club
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I don’t think having the extra couple or thousand seats for when people can be arsed to turn for a couple of games a season is worth the extra revenue we’re missing out on through lack of corporate availability.

The premier league may have grown whilst we’ve not been there but there’s not much to suggest our fanbase has. We’ll always be able to sell out for playoff semis and wear Tyne derbies but that’s it.

I’d rather have the ground full snd the club maximising its revenue streams every week than have spare capacity to cater for people who only turn up every now and then or in a league we may never get back to.
 
Julio Mackemo said:
It's a funny one, we get p!ssed off quicker than other fans :lol: but we averaged 47k twice in the early noughties. Football is more popular now and I think we'd fill the other few thousand. We just need to price it properly, we had 44k last week versus Hull for example.....
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We did, but it was the first time since about the 50s and then where did they all go when shit hit the fan? Which is my point in many ways. Unless you become a Liverpool, Arsenal or Man Utd where you cement your place at the top over a number of decades (which realistically isn’t going to happen) and therefore hugely inflate your fanbase, the additional ones are just fair weather and will be gone at the first sign of trouble again. Which imo isn’t worth the thousands of empty seats it would bring in the aftermath. It is more popular, but other factors such as the availability to watch games easily at home now and tv schedules threaten that long term as prices will continue to increase (I’m speaking broadly about football here not just SAFC).

I don’t think there’s an example in English football yet where a 45k+ plus stadium has resulted in a packed ground of ‘proper’ supporters and a good atmosphere. Skunks, West Ham, Spurs, Arsenal, Man Utd, Liverpool, Man City and any others I’ve missed are all absolutely slating the experience and type of crowds they’re getting in their grounds these days.
 
Julio Mackemo said:
In the championship :lol:
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We averaged just over 40k when we finished 10th in the PL.

We’ve had 3 46k averages in 27 years at the SOL and all were over 20 years ago. At no point during our 10 year spell there did we get close to averaging 45k.
If people thought they were going to struggle to buy match day tickets they might be more inclined to buy a season ticket.
 
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Sgt Pepper said:
We did, but it was the first time since about the 50s and then where did they all go when shit hit the fan? Which is my point in many ways. Unless you become a Liverpool, Arsenal or Man Utd where you cement your place at the top over a number of decades (which realistically isn’t going to happen) and therefore hugely inflate your fanbase, the additional ones are just fair weather and will be gone at the first sign of trouble again. Which imo isn’t worth the thousands of empty seats it would bring in the aftermath. It is more popular, but other factors such as the availability to watch games easily at home now and tv schedules threaten that long term as prices will continue to increase (I’m speaking broadly about football here not just SAFC).

I don’t think there’s an example in English football yet where a 45k+ plus stadium has resulted in a packed ground of ‘proper’ supporters and a good atmosphere. Skunks, West Ham, Spurs, Arsenal, Man Utd, Liverpool, Man City and any others I’ve missed are all absolutely slating the experience and type of crowds they’re getting in their grounds these days.
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Aye it's a fair point tbh.... fans slate the atmosphere at West Ham and Arsenal tbf. I've been to old Trafford and a large number seemed to be tourists and business folk. It would be interesting to see what crowds they'd get in the championship.
 
DonaldDownTheWing said:
We averaged just over 40k when we finished 10th in the PL.

We’ve had 3 46k averages in 27 years at the SOL and all were over 20 years ago. At no point during our 10 year spell there did we get close to averaging 45k.
If people thought they were going to struggle to buy match day tickets they might be more inclined to buy a season ticket.
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Understand but we've averaged circa 40k the past few seasons in the championship and over 30k in league one. We averaged over 41k finishing bottom of the premier league in 2017.
I really believe with a half decent top 10 team, we'd need over 50k seats imho.
 
Julio Mackemo said:
Aye it's a fair point tbh.... fans slate the atmosphere at West Ham and Arsenal tbf. I've been to old Trafford and a large number seemed to be tourists and business folk. It would be interesting to see what crowds they'd get in the championship.
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I went to West Ham’s new ground our one and only time there under Moyes and it’s the biggest downgrade in football history. Their fans are rightly pissed off about it. Great arena if you wanted to go and watch the athletics with popcorn in your hand, but shit for a football crowd. Upton Park was the best away day of the calendar as well. If the likes of Man Utd went to the Championship I’ve no doubt they’d get good crowds initially, in the same way them up the road did (albeit first time they went down under Ashley 52k went to 36k overnight). However, give them the run and decades we have had and then see what they’d get - completely different kettle of fish and that’s where I think we differ. We’ve haven’t had even a smidge of the good times those clubs have had, and I include the mags in that with their title challenges, top half finishes, European campaigns and whatnot. Not one of them fanbases has the bottle and steel that ours do.
 
Sgt Pepper said:
I went to West Ham’s new ground our one and only time there under Moyes and it’s the biggest downgrade in football history. Their fans are rightly pissed off about it. Great arena if you wanted to go and watch the athletics with popcorn in your hand, but shit for a football crowd. Upton Park was the best away day of the calendar as well. If the likes of Man Utd went to the Championship I’ve no doubt they’d get good crowds initially, in the same way them up the road did (albeit first time they went down under Ashley 52k went to 36k overnight). However, give them the run and decades we have had and then see what they’d get - completely different kettle of fish and that’s where I think we differ. We’ve haven’t had even a smidge of the good times those clubs have had, and I include the mags in that with their title challenges, top half finishes, European campaigns and whatnot. Not one of them fanbases has the bottle and steel that ours do.
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Agree mate.
 
Julio Mackemo said:
Understand but we've averaged circa 40k the past few seasons in the championship and over 30k in league one. We averaged over 41k finishing bottom of the premier league in 2017.
I really believe with a half decent top 10 team, we'd need over 50k seats imho.
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We’re not talking about reducing it to below 40k though. A reduction to 45k and we’re unlikely to be seeing anyone stuck outside other than games against Newcastle.

The club are never going to extend the ground until we’ve had a sustained period of success, it would probably take European football before they saw it as worthwhile on a cost benefit analysis.

They don’t do anything unless they view the benefit as potentially outweighing the cost.
 
Julio Mackemo said:
It's a funny one, we get p!ssed off quicker than other fans :lol: but we averaged 47k twice in the early noughties. Football is more popular now and I think we'd fill the other few thousand. We just need to price it properly, we had 44k last week versus Hull for example.....
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I’d have that kids for a quid every game personally. We’ve got the space and that quid soon becomes a whole lot more if they become SC holders down the line.
 
wigwams said:
I’d have that kids for a quid every game personally. We’ve got the space and that quid soon becomes a whole lot more if they become SC holders down the line.
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Yep agree with that.
DonaldDownTheWing said:
We’re not talking about reducing it to below 40k though. A reduction to 45k and we’re unlikely to be seeing anyone stuck outside other than games against Newcastle.

The club are never going to extend the ground until we’ve had a sustained period of success, it would probably take European football before they saw it as worthwhile on a cost benefit analysis.

They don’t do anything unless they view the benefit as potentially outweighing the cost.
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Agree, that's more or less what I said. The current capacity is fine, at what, 46500 ?
 
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wigwams said:
I’d have that kids for a quid every game personally. We’ve got the space and that quid soon becomes a whole lot more if they become SC holders down the line.
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The club could definitely do more to get people in, and getting kids in is probably the way to go as you get them hooked.

Bridging from 42m to 47k shouldn’t be that hard really.
Julio Mackemo said:
Yep agree with that.

Agree, that's more or less what I said. The current capacity is fine, at what, 46500 ?
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Year probably about that aye.
 
DonaldDownTheWing said:
We’re not talking about reducing it to below 40k though. A reduction to 45k and we’re unlikely to be seeing anyone stuck outside other than games against Newcastle.

The club are never going to extend the ground until we’ve had a sustained period of success, it would probably take European football before they saw it as worthwhile on a cost benefit analysis.

They don’t do anything unless they view the benefit as potentially outweighing the cost.
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The 'temporary' seats from the back of the NEC to SS could go for a kickoff.
 
Julio Mackemo said:
Disagree completely, with a decent side in the top 10 we'd fill it. I think 55k is our ceiling, we just haven't got the catchment area like the mags (for example).
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It doesn't help that half of the people in County Durham have chosen to support Newcastle. Go into any sports shop in Durham and you'll see Newcastle tops displayed before Sunderland ones.
 
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