Should VAR be for offside decisions and not subjective decisions?

[L1lyBrown]

It's a completely different ballgame watching something in slow motion from different angles and making a decision.
They don't apply the rules as they are meant to, clear and obvious errors.
So back to offside and goal line decisions only for me.
Oh and no attackers allowed in the 6 yard box before a corner is actually taken.

 

[not spavin]

The Raya decision yesterday sums it up for me.

It was a foul in a title-deciding game so VAR worked. But VAR also robbed us of a piece of incredible drama in the moment, and set us up for a far less interesting end to the season.

So even when it works it's a net negative.

Goal line technology is an obvious improvement because it works instantly and near-enough perfectly. VAR makes football worse. I'd accept being on the receiving end of bad decisions every so often if it meant that I can enjoy a game of football as a spontaneous spectacle again.

 

[SAFCftm1986]

The refs make wrong decisions and so do VAR. It’s not clear and obvious if you have to spend 5 mins looking at it in slow motion (which often makes things appear worse). If they insist on keeping it they should get maybe 3 looks at it from different angles at full speed and if they see nothing clear and obvious then the on field decision stands.

Otherwise you may as well remove it altogether and save on the time wasting/cluelessness at the match not knowing what’s happening

 

[Lord Alfred]

The Raya decision yesterday sums it up for me.

It was a foul in a title-deciding game so VAR worked. But VAR also robbed us of a piece of incredible drama in the moment, and set us up for a far less interesting end to the season.

So even when it works it's a net negative.

Goal line technology is an obvious improvement because it works instantly and near-enough perfectly. VAR makes football worse. I'd accept being on the receiving end of bad decisions every so often if it meant that I can enjoy a game of football as a spontaneous spectacle again.

Imagine not winning the title because the ref missed a player cheating. The moment of incredible drama as you put it was stolen from the West Ham (and City) fans by Pablo not VAR.

 

[ATTACK ATTACK ATTACK]

It's a completely different ballgame watching something in slow motion from different angles and making a decision.
They don't apply the rules as they are meant to, clear and obvious errors.
So back to offside and goal line decisions only for me.
Oh and no attackers allowed in the 6 yard box before a corner is actually taken.

The bloke on MOTD must be oblivious to the fact Todibo was outside the box to begin with and barely a step into the 6 yard box as players can still move while the ball is in the air. It would solve nothing as attackers can still end up doing the same thing.

The Raya decision yesterday sums it up for me.

It was a foul in a title-deciding game so VAR worked. But VAR also robbed us of a piece of incredible drama in the moment, and set us up for a far less interesting end to the season.

So even when it works it's a net negative.

Goal line technology is an obvious improvement because it works instantly and near-enough perfectly. VAR makes football worse. I'd accept being on the receiving end of bad decisions every so often if it meant that I can enjoy a game of football as a spontaneous spectacle again.

In my opinion VAR didn't work as it ignored the foul on Pablo by Trossard that was happening the instant the ball was kicked into play and continued throughout. This was well before Raya was even touched by a West Ham player and is covered in loads of waffle in the thread.

*** West Ham United v Arsenal Premier League kick off 1630 Sky Sports Main Event Sky Sports Premier League Sky Sports Ultra HDR***

I don’t see why they can’t issue a decree saying you’re not allowed to use your arms/hands on corners. Anyone grappling or shirt pulls gets an immediate three match ban. Surely that would stop it?

www.readytogo.net

VAR is never going away as it's wrong sometimes but not as much as a single referee and his assistants can be and they won't have decisions worth £millions riding on that any more. It is shit at times with the delay but it can certainly be improved as they should just look at video instantly and make a decision and bin the clear and obvious shite and dragging the ref over.

That decision yesterday could have been done in under 2 minutes even though there were fouls all over the place. They simply focus on the play when the corner ball is being kicked and the time after. There was no foul on Raya and no foul by Rice as there's no contact at that moment so they can quickly be ignored.

They would quickly see that it's Trossard on Pablo who is being fouled before the corner (which doesn't matter) continuing into when the corner was taken but more importantly well after it's taken. It's a foul all day long so a simple decision of a penna to West Ham at the end of the day, yet they way they piss about makes it complicated and they still got it wrong.

 

[defunct]

It might get sorted when a teams takes a decision to court. If that's feasible.

 

[FatDrummer]

In 1971 Jeff Astle scored a HIGHLY contentious goal at Elland Road which ultimately cost Leeds United the League Title.
Was it a mistake by the Ref?
It is still up for discussion amongst Leeds fans of a certain vintage.
No VAR obviously, so the Ref’s decision was final. It caused a ‘riot’ as Leeds fans ran onto the pitch in an attempt to attack Ray Tinkler (the Referee) with Police on the pitch tackling fans.

Mistakes happen that affects the outcome of a football match.
It is annoying, but shit happens.

And these days we have VAR which gets more right than it gets wrong.

That has got to be a step in the right direction.

Hasn’t it?

(Oh and I don’t go along with the “I can’t celebrate a goal because I don’t know if it will stand” nonsense. It has never stopped me from celebrating any goal….or in the case of Sheffield United’s 2nd ‘goal’ at Wembley, uproariously celebrating the VAR decision that ‘chalked it off’)

 

[PJH]

VAR has come in because of all of the tv coverage which highlights all the seemingly glaring errors. Big technology push from FIFA came after Lampard's non goal against Germany. Keep VAR and people will hate the wait, or hate that an almost unnoticeable foul has been spotted. Take it away and people will use clip replays from games to show fouls and so on not getting spotted by the ref and calling cheat and so on. With the amount of money in the game and bet on games I don't see VAR going.

 

[safcforever]

The Raya decision yesterday sums it up for me.

It was a foul in a title-deciding game so VAR worked. But VAR also robbed us of a piece of incredible drama in the moment, and set us up for a far less interesting end to the season.

So even when it works it's a net negative.

Goal line technology is an obvious improvement because it works instantly and near-enough perfectly. VAR makes football worse. I'd accept being on the receiving end of bad decisions every so often if it meant that I can enjoy a game of football as a spontaneous spectacle again.

But it also doesn’t work. Earlier in the season it went the opposite way when Arsenal scored while fouling the keeper.

It give them free reign to find what they want And get the result they want

 

[molthemackem]

The Raya decision yesterday sums it up for me.

It was a foul in a title-deciding game so VAR worked. But VAR also robbed us of a piece of incredible drama in the moment, and set us up for a far less interesting end to the season.

So even when it works it's a net negative.

Goal line technology is an obvious improvement because it works instantly and near-enough perfectly. VAR makes football worse. I'd accept being on the receiving end of bad decisions every so often if it meant that I can enjoy a game of football as a spontaneous spectacle again.

the foul on Raya for me wasn't the first foul. Rice who had his arms wrapped around on e of the WHU players was not looking to play the , which had not even reached the position Raya occupied, was a blatant penalty if VAR are going to interfere in decision making. Good idea for Only offside (even that was a problem over the weekend) and goal line tech. Nothing else. immediate Straight red card for deliberate holding and blocking should also be introduced.

 

[Onlyfoolsrushin]

Offsides not subjective ? What about the interfering with play subjective bit, like the Sheff Utd goal in the play off final?

There are many aspects of VAR i don't like, but it does increase the number of correct decisions overall and Improves the outcomes as a result.

Even though I hate what Arsenal are all about in recent times, the goal was rightly chalked out.

 

[ATTACK ATTACK ATTACK]

the foul on Raya for me wasn't the first foul. Rice who had his arms wrapped around on e of the WHU players was not looking to play the , which had not even reached the position Raya occupied, was a blatant penalty if VAR are going to interfere in decision making. Good idea for Only offside (even that was a problem over the weekend) and goal line tech. Nothing else. immediate Straight red card for deliberate holding and blocking should also be introduced.

Rice's foul is after the foul by Todibo on Raya when he's ragging his shirt. It's clear in the gif I hoyed in the match thread, which foul is first as it's Trossard on #19 Pablo.

Logon or register to see this image

 

[molthemackem]

Rice's foul is after the foul by Todibo on Raya when he's ragging his shirt. It's clear in the gif I hoyed in the match thread, which foul is first as it's Trossard on #19 Pablo.

Logon or register to see this image

Didn't see the first foul by no 25 but I still don't see a penalty due to the number of holding and blocking going on..to pick out Raya seems to be onesided.

 

[southstander]

Rice's foul is after the foul by Todibo on Raya when he's ragging his shirt. It's clear in the gif I hoyed in the match thread, which foul is first as it's Trossard on #19 Pablo.

Logon or register to see this image

f***ing hell there could have been a few cards handed out there.

 

[Onlyfoolsrushin]

The bloke on MOTD must be oblivious to the fact Todibo was outside the box to begin with and barely a step into the 6 yard box as players can still move while the ball is in the air. It would solve nothing as attackers can still end up doing the same thing.


In my opinion VAR didn't work as it ignored the foul on Pablo by Trossard that was happening the instant the ball was kicked into play and continued throughout. This was well before Raya was even touched by a West Ham player and is covered in loads of waffle in the thread.

*** West Ham United v Arsenal Premier League kick off 1630 Sky Sports Main Event Sky Sports Premier League Sky Sports Ultra HDR***

I don’t see why they can’t issue a decree saying you’re not allowed to use your arms/hands on corners. Anyone grappling or shirt pulls gets an immediate three match ban. Surely that would stop it?

www.readytogo.net

VAR is never going away as it's wrong sometimes but not as much as a single referee and his assistants can be and they won't have decisions worth £millions riding on that any more. It is shit at times with the delay but it can certainly be improved as they should just look at video instantly and make a decision and bin the clear and obvious shite and dragging the ref over.

That decision yesterday could have been done in under 2 minutes even though there were fouls all over the place. They simply focus on the play when the corner ball is being kicked and the time after. There was no foul on Raya and no foul by Rice as there's no contact at that moment so they can quickly be ignored.

They would quickly see that it's Trossard on Pablo who is being fouled before the corner (which doesn't matter) continuing into when the corner was taken but more importantly well after it's taken. It's a foul all day long so a simple decision of a penna to West Ham at the end of the day, yet they way they piss about makes it complicated and they still got it wrong.

Pablo also had Trossards shirt with his other hand which negates the foul by Trossard, as they were both at it. The main issue was Pablo and Todibo preventing the goalkeeper getting to the ball. They made the right call.

 

[ATTACK ATTACK ATTACK]

Didn't see the first foul by no 25 but I still don't see a penalty due to the number of holding and blocking going on..to pick out Raya seems to be onesided.

Do you not think Trossard's holding is excessive given he's clearly holding the arm of Pablo and Trossard's other arm around Pablo and he keeps hold all the time? I broke this down at the point the ball was actually kicked into play from the corner making fouls possible. The link to it is in post #5 of this thread. Even looking at the image below with the kick taken, you can see just how much Trossard is 'fouling' Pablo and continues to do it yet Raya and Pablo are nowhere near yet even though that's the foul VAR decided to focus on. This ignores that Pablo was wanting to challenge for the ball and even jumps off the deck with Trossard still hanging onto him.

Logon or register to see this image

f***ing hell there could have been a few cards handed out there.

Aye though they happen in order from the moment the corner is taken so VAR should by the laws of the game look at the first one which is Pablo being fouled, yet the one actually picked up by VAR was the last foul of the lot. As you see above, Trossard's holding is clearly for an excessive amount of time and starts before the kick, still happening after it kicked up until the 'foul' on Raya.

Pablo also had Trossards shirt with his other hand which negates the foul by Trossard, as they were both at it. The main issue was Pablo and Todibo preventing the goalkeeper getting to the ball. They made the right call.

He doesn't have his shirt, he has his open hand on Trossard's arm but that's irrelevant as it happens before the kick. You can see the image above when the ball is in play, that it's after the arm touching happened but Trossard is still holding on for dear life with both hands.

 

[southstander]

Do you not think Trossard's holding is excessive given he's clearly holding the arm of Pablo and Trossard's other arm around Pablo and he keeps hold all the time? I broke this down at the point the ball was actually kicked into play from the corner making fouls possible. The link to it is in post #5 of this thread. Even looking at the image below with the kick taken, you can see just how much Trossard is 'fouling' Pablo and continues to do it yet Raya and Pablo are nowhere near yet even though that's the foul VAR decided to focus on. This ignores that Pablo was wanting to challenge for the ball and even jumps off the deck with Trossard still hanging onto him.

Logon or register to see this image

Aye though they happen in order from the moment the corner is taken so VAR should by the laws of the game look at the first one which is Pablo being fouled, yet the one actually picked up by VAR was the last foul of the lot. As you see above, Trossard's holding is clearly for an excessive amount of time and starts before the kick, still happening after it kicked up until the 'foul' on Raya.


He doesn't have his shirt, he has his open hand on Trossard's arm but that's irrelevant as it happens before the kick. You can see the image above when the ball is in play, that it's after the arm touching happened but Trossard is still holding on for dear life with both hands.

It does look like the ref is ball watching though, rather than watching the full on wrestling going on in the goal mouth.

 

[Fray Bentos]

Referees have created this whole problem imo. I think it was the Russia World Cup where they were giving loads of penalties and it virtually eliminated the pulling/wrestling in the box for corners for the remainder of the tournament.

This was the brought into the Premier League/EFL and it worked but as per usual with our PGMOL they only utilise these new rules for 3 or 4 weeks and forget about them (same as the adding on of loads of additional time to stop time wasting).

In this case we have Raya being fouled, Trossard fouling someone and Rice fouling someone and having to analysis which foul is first or completely ignore the defenders fouls in this case.

Now we are left with this absolute mess on corners. The refs need to also stop wasting time warning players before a corner is taken. Just let the corner be taken and make a decision if there's a foul.

Get back to giving fouls both ways and it will stop, as we have evidence to prove it works.

 

[contrarian]

The way Arsenal are sucking the joy and sportsmanship out of football with their set piece shithousery is a disgrace quite frankly.
The rules on shirt pulling, wrestling, jostling are at best opaque and at worst an utter joke.
But let’s blame it on VAR
Were there no VAR how on earth is a single ref going to untangle the prevailing mess when there are myriad side shows playing out?
There would still be outcries
I hope PSG absolutely batter and humiliate them as they did Inter last year and do the game à favour