SAFC - Fan Ban & Ticket Cancellations

[Disco_Pants93]

Last week I went to a concert at the dark side .first thing I bought 2 tickets 3 days before from a man who could not go .as happens in life .he was over the moon to get 80 quid and transferred the qr codes straight away .illegal in football away tickets .so we went in no drugs dogs sniffing my balls .and nobody patting me up and down just about assaulting me ha.lone behold I could drink the dreaded beer actually in my seat .there was nobody checking my ticket 3 or 4 times and I actually found my way to my seat .imagine that .at anfield this year there was 3 security checks and took 30 mins just to get in .what has happened to paul and the 65 fans just shows us how shit footy fans are treated by clubs .most of the time being treated like animals and the attitude of our club towards away fans is scandalous. They do not care .they do not help anybody .this is the best time football wise we have had in 30 years and still our ticket office and customer service are abysmal

What on earth has going to a gig and the experience being completely different to a football match got to do with the club? Security checks and ID checks for tickets are a premier league wide situation. Getting into Elland road was a nightmare but that isn’t the clubs fault.
The customer service side of the club is obviously very poor at the moment but your post makes little sense and has no relevance to the situation.

You’ve never required loyalty points to go to a gig man, that’s why you can pass the tickets on if you can’t go.

 

[tunstallhill]

What on earth has going to a gig and the experience being completely different to a football match got to do with the club? Security checks and ID checks for tickets are a premier league wide situation. Getting into Elland road was a nightmare but that isn’t the clubs fault.
The customer service side of the club is obviously very poor at the moment but your post makes little sense and has no relevance to the situation.

You’ve never required loyalty points to go to a gig man, that’s why you can pass the tickets on if you can’t go.

there was practically zero checks yesterday. there was a sniffer dog hanging about, and very lame 'pat down' that half the people were just walking past, and straight into the ground.

despite it being 20 mins before kick off and 1000s of people around, it took us about 3 or 4 mins from back of queue to inside the ground and having a pint

at liverpool away we arrived about 25 mins before kick off, and missed the first 5 minutes of the game

at our home games there are zero searches, but the queues are huge and take ages

at leeds away, one queue was being searched to be allowed into the outside drinking area, but there was a walkway the home fans were using that bypassed this and went straight into our outside drinking area - which we used to get in quicker

so there isn't a 'league wide standard' - every club just seems to make it up

 

[Disco_Pants93]

there was practically zero checks yesterday. there was a sniffer dog hanging about, and very lame 'pat down' that half the people were just walking past, and straight into the ground.

despite it being 20 mins before kick off and 1000s of people around, it took us about 3 or 4 mins from back of queue to inside the ground and having a pint

at liverpool away we arrived about 25 mins before kick off, and missed the first 5 minutes of the game

at our home games there are zero searches, but the queues are huge and take ages

at leeds away, one queue was being searched to be allowed into the outside drinking area, but there was a walkway the home fans were using that bypassed this and went straight into our outside drinking area - which we used to get in quicker

so there isn't a 'league wide standard' - every club just seems to make it up

Aye I wasn’t meaning a standard as such but I can’t remember the last away game I went to where there wasn’t an ID check. I’d be more surprised now if there wasn’t one versus if there is. Home games as you say there aren’t any checks at all for the home fans. But there are thorough checks for away fans at our ground.

 

[Hank Scorpio]

Aye I wasn’t meaning a standard as such but I can’t remember the last away game I went to where there wasn’t an ID check. I’d be more surprised now if there wasn’t one versus if there is. Home games as you say there aren’t any checks at all for the home fans. But there are thorough checks for away fans at our ground.

The funny thing is, the clubs don’t actually care about someone passing on an away ticket to a mate etc. There is a general acceptance it happens.

Obviously there is a question about whether it’s fair on other fans but that tends to be an issue pushed by fans rather than the clubs.

What is pissing off the clubs though, and this is what I was told by an official at another club, is fans openly selling tickets either on social media or via a third party at inflated prices.

Apparently it’s a really big issue with the big clubs and they hate the idea of them missing out on more income. This is what is driving the id checks.

 

[tunstallhill]

What is pissing off the clubs though, and this is what I was told by an official at another club, is fans openly selling tickets either on social media or via a third party at inflated prices.

maybe i am being thick here, but surely there is a quick, direct, fool-proof method of dealing with that....? simply buy the ticket off the fan selling it, check the seat number, and ban the season ticket holder that bought it originally?

Aye I wasn’t meaning a standard as such but I can’t remember the last away game I went to where there wasn’t an ID check. I’d be more surprised now if there wasn’t one versus if there is. Home games as you say there aren’t any checks at all for the home fans. But there are thorough checks for away fans at our ground.

do you mean searches?

i've only been ID checked once this season and have hardly heard of anyone getting checked, relative to the 3000 or so that are going every two weeks.

i've obviously read about the checks on here, and 3 of my group have been checked since last december, but it must be a tiny, tiny percentage of fans

 

[Disco_Pants93]

The funny thing is, the clubs don’t actually care about someone passing on an away ticket to a mate etc. There is a general acceptance it happens.

Obviously there is a question about whether it’s fair on other fans but that tends to be an issue pushed by fans rather than the clubs.

What is pissing off the clubs though, and this is what I was told by an official at another club, is fans openly selling tickets either on social media or via a third party at inflated prices.

Apparently it’s a really big issue with the big clubs and they hate the idea of them missing out on more income. This is what is driving the id checks.

Aye, common sense should be applied because in this thread you’ve got people saying passing on tickets to whoever you want should be allowed in some circumstances. Then you’ve got people pointing out it’s unfair on people who are missing out when people on less loyalty points end up with tickets. Tickets being passed around in a branch versus me passing my ticket on to a mate is apparently a different situation but the end result is the same - I’d get a point and not to go to the match as would branch members who didn’t actually attend but a ticket bought on their account.

I think anyone ripping another SAFC fan off by selling a ticket at an inflated price is a joke let alone a third party doing it.

maybe i am being thick here, but surely there is a quick, direct, fool-proof method of dealing with that....? simply buy the ticket off the fan selling it, check the seat number, and ban the season ticket holder that bought it originally?


do you mean searches?

i've only been ID checked once this season and have hardly heard of anyone getting checked, relative to the 3000 or so that are going every two weeks.

i've obviously read about the checks on here, and 3 of my group have been checked since last december, but it must be a tiny, tiny percentage of fans

Sorry mate yeah I mean searches more than ID checks. I only know of one mate who’s been ID checked but I’m sure the club said they only do 10 per away game. 5 targeted v 5 random. So it’s minuscule.

 

[Hank Scorpio]

maybe i am being thick here, but surely there is a quick, direct, fool-proof method of dealing with that....? simply buy the ticket off the fan selling it, check the seat number, and ban the season ticket holder that bought it originally?


do you mean searches?

i've only been ID checked once this season and have hardly heard of anyone getting checked, relative to the 3000 or so that are going every two weeks.

i've obviously read about the checks on here, and 3 of my group have been checked since last december, but it must be a tiny, tiny percentage of fans

I believe some clubs have done that. I also seem to think that Utd have gone to the lengths of using CCTV to see who is sitting where.

Sadly, it’s all being driven by money.

 

[one footed wonder]

Aye, common sense should be applied because in this thread you’ve got people saying passing on tickets to whoever you want should be allowed in some circumstances. Then you’ve got people pointing out it’s unfair on people who are missing out when people on less loyalty points end up with tickets. Tickets being passed around in a branch versus me passing my ticket on to a mate is apparently a different situation but the end result is the same - I’d get a point and not to go to the match as would branch members who didn’t actually attend but a ticket bought on their account.

I think anyone ripping another SAFC fan off by selling a ticket at an inflated price is a joke let alone a third party doing it.

Sorry mate yeah I mean searches more than ID checks. I only know of one mate who’s been ID checked but I’m sure the club said they only do 10 per away game. 5 targeted v 5 random. So it’s minuscule.

Let’s not forget as well we have the club treating people differently.

We have the combo of the PL rules re tickets and the internal club rules around the loyalty point system

• The above sees the club looking to ensure that people with required points not going, selling the ticket to someone without required points and keeping the point by enforcing id checks is prevented
• Yet at the same time the club are happy to publicise celebrity fans and former players in away ends when clearly they won’t have the required loyalty points.
• They are also, seemingly based on post in here, offering corporate customers tickets for the mags out the 65 they cancelled without them having the required loyalty points (as well as some of those cancellations having no supporting rationale)

There will be a raft of other issues as it’s a complex picture.

However even just taking the above it’s easy to see why people are getting frustrated and angry with away ticketing.

I’ve said it before but tickets with the current demand are always going to be an emotive issue however they are making this more difficult with their hastily and poorly thought out decisions and actions.

It really needs someone at the club to get a grip on this

 

[Disco_Pants93]

Let’s not forget as well we have the club treating people differently.

We have the combo of the PL rules re tickets and the internal club rules around the loyalty point system

• The above sees the club looking to ensure that people with required points not going, selling the ticket to someone without required points and keeping the point by enforcing id checks is prevented
• Yet at the same time the club are happy to publicise celebrity fans and former players in away ends when clearly they won’t have the required loyalty points.
• They are also, seemingly based on post in here, offering corporate customers tickets for the mags out the 65 they cancelled without them having the required loyalty points (as well as some of those cancellations having no supporting rationale)

There will be a raft of other issues as it’s a complex picture.

However even just taking the above it’s easy to see why people are getting frustrated and angry with away ticketing.

I’ve said it before but tickets with the current demand are always going to be an emotive issue however they are making this more difficult with their hastily and poorly thought out decisions and actions.

It really needs someone at the club to get a grip on this

Agree with you entirely mate. If we had rules in place, however much people agree or disagree, and it was the same for everyone then we'd know where we stand. At the minute there's no place you can go to see the rules and punishments from person to person seem to differ. As you say, it's very complex but the club aren't helping themselves one bit.

 

[Hank Scorpio]

Let’s not forget as well we have the club treating people differently.

We have the combo of the PL rules re tickets and the internal club rules around the loyalty point system

• The above sees the club looking to ensure that people with required points not going, selling the ticket to someone without required points and keeping the point by enforcing id checks is prevented
• Yet at the same time the club are happy to publicise celebrity fans and former players in away ends when clearly they won’t have the required loyalty points.
• They are also, seemingly based on post in here, offering corporate customers tickets for the mags out the 65 they cancelled without them having the required loyalty points (as well as some of those cancellations having no supporting rationale)

There will be a raft of other issues as it’s a complex picture.

However even just taking the above it’s easy to see why people are getting frustrated and angry with away ticketing.

I’ve said it before but tickets with the current demand are always going to be an emotive issue however they are making this more difficult with their hastily and poorly thought out decisions and actions.

It really needs someone at the club to get a grip on this

For the first time, I do think demand is easing a little. Next season, if we consolidate as mid table club, I can see a lot more aways dropping to 10+ points.

 

[ATTACK ATTACK ATTACK]

maybe i am being thick here, but surely there is a quick, direct, fool-proof method of dealing with that....? simply buy the ticket off the fan selling it, check the seat number, and ban the season ticket holder that bought it originally?

For those on Facebook etc then yes they'd have to buy it but then they could find out who it was.

For the ticket sites that are selling tickets for £100s, they shouldn't even have to buy the ticket and simply request the location of the seat if the ticket isn't authorised for resale.

Or they buy the ticket and then if confirmed that it's an invalid and illegal resale they just get their money back after they know which seat it is.

It could be clamped down in some way that's for sure. Though saying that, clubs like Arsenal, Chelsea and Liverpool have cancelled memberships and STs so maybe behind the scenes they are doing it. Though a lot of those will be bots and fake accounts buying on purpose to resell for teams with huge demand or even just being in the PL.

You must be logged on to see external links

 

[SAFC_FTM]

Agree with you entirely mate. If we had rules in place, however much people agree or disagree, and it was the same for everyone then we'd know where we stand. At the minute there's no place you can go to see the rules and punishments from person to person seem to differ. As you say, it's very complex but the club aren't helping themselves one bit.

Yeah prettyuch what I've been saying for a while. The club have no proper T&C's in place so don't really help themselves at all.
There was some utter drivel on the AskSAFC section which has since been removed, my 12 year old could have produced a better article.
There is also quotes from fans meetings which we know they don't follow for what certain rules are, but meeting minutes shouldn't represent proper T&Cs

 

[Roker-73]

Any tickets listed for sale online should be bought by the club and then the individual who owns the seat investigated

Some resale sites list tickets they don’t even have though so you’d have to properly investigate and not just assume

 

[Grumpy Old Man]

Any tickets listed for sale online should be bought by the club and then the individual who owns the seat investigated

Some resale sites list tickets they don’t even have though so you’d have to properly investigate and not just assume

Some even list seats that don't exist. I've seen tickets for rows that are alphabetic, where the real ones are numbered, and vice versa.

 

[Lagger]

For the first time, I do think demand is easing a little. Next season, if we consolidate as mid table club, I can see a lot more aways dropping to 10+ points.

No doubt about it. I know a few who’ve been to 90%+ of games this season, who won’t do anywhere near that next season, me included.

 

[Roker-73]

Some even list seats that don't exist. I've seen tickets for rows that are alphabetic, where the real ones are numbered, and vice versa.

Yeah exactly. So whilst it should be a fairly easy process for an organisation the size of SAFC to try to buy any tickets listed online and then follow up and see if a fan has touted their ticket (and deal with them appropriately if they have), it would need to be done properly/thoroughly with appropriate checks and balances and no assumptions

 

[tunstallhill]

For those on Facebook etc then yes they'd have to buy it but then they could find out who it was.

For the ticket sites that are selling tickets for £100s, they shouldn't even have to buy the ticket and simply request the location of the seat if the ticket isn't authorised for resale.

Or they buy the ticket and then if confirmed that it's an invalid and illegal resale they just get their money back after they know which seat it is.

It could be clamped down in some way that's for sure.

it just seems to obvious, i'd love to know their reasoning behind not doing it. they'd literally go direct to the source, first time, every time.

instead they are waiting to check 5 targeted people every time, so over the season they get to target, what, 100 people? slowly, drip by drip. and if they do ID check a suspect at one away game, there's always the chance the person is actually using it that game so they bypass the check

it just seems so clunky and inefficient.

why only target 5 per game? if they have suspicions about certain people, then target them straight away, 100 on the first game. just make sure to put a public statement out saying there'll be enhanced ID checks and urge everyone to bring along acceptable forms of ID

the reason i don't think they go after the ones that are for sale online is because they'll be worried that the ticket is traced back to a coorperate partner, a club member of staff or a players family. in my opinion

 

[Hank Scorpio]

Any tickets listed for sale online should be bought by the club and then the individual who owns the seat investigated

Some resale sites list tickets they don’t even have though so you’d have to properly investigate and not just assume

I posted about it earlier on the thread bud but the reason why these sites charge so much for tickets is often down to the fact they don’t actually have them at the point of sale.

The price is determined by how much the company will need work/pay to source the tickets.

I dare say yesterday, some sites would have been charging over £1k for a ticket in the Arsenal end at City. They wouldn’t have had a ticket to sell but they would have hoped that £500 would be enough to find and pay for a ticket. The rest is profit to them.

One of the lads in my team is a Rangers fan and he was approached to see if he would be willing to sell his ticket for Celtic park earlier in the season. IIRC he was offered £650 for it and was told someone had already paid in excess of a £1k and they were now desperate to source a ticket. He said no, but quickly received another offer of £800. He again didn’t sell and they moved on.

No doubt about it. I know a few who’ve been to 90%+ of games this season, who won’t do anywhere near that next season, me included.

Unless we are pushing for Europe, I can actually see a few hundred going to 10+ points for Everton away. Although it’s a good trip, 8000 of us have already been

 

[Provider]

Aye I wasn’t meaning a standard as such but I can’t remember the last away game I went to where there wasn’t an ID check. I’d be more surprised now if there wasn’t one versus if there is. Home games as you say there aren’t any checks at all for the home fans. But there are thorough checks for away fans at our ground.

You're pretty unlucky if you're getting ID checked every away game. Me and my mates have been to most this season and none of us have been ID checked once.

 

[DonaldDownTheWing]

Apparently there’s an echo article coming out about this either today or in the near future.