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NUFC/Sportwashing

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The Fish said:
We don't need to catch the top 6, we just need to get ahead of the likes of Palace, Southampton, Brighton, Burnley, et al. Also, as we've seen with Arsenal this season and previously the likes of Spurs and Everton. Those top clubs can still have bad seasons and falter down the league. It isn't a closed shop.
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"You're talking, what 4-5 seasons of gradual improvement to get close to top 6?" isnt that catching the top 6? your words.
 

Bear Heed said:
:lol:

5 seasons!

The bedsheets would be out after 2.

NUFC has been on sale for years, no takers.

Your only excuse is that Ashley wants too much which I and, ironically you, have just shown isn't quite the case. The purchase price isn't that significant and could be recouped according to you.
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That's not true. Progress on the pitch and around the facilities would see support renew.
There've been plenty of interested parties, but only the Saudis have met Ashley's asking price and got to the O&D test (which they then withdrew from). Ashley could have sold us had he accepted a lower bid, but he didn't want to.

I also think Ashley wants things that some interested parties couldn't agree to. Rumours that he wanted to retain merchandising rights through Sports Direct, that the SD signage stays up for a period, etc.
Squat said:
"You're talking, what 4-5 seasons of gradual improvement to get close to top 6?" isnt that catching the top 6? your words.
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Getting close to, is not the same as catching. Catching means (to me at least) being level with or overtaking. Getting close to, does not.
 
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The Fish said:
We don't need to catch the top 6, we just need to get ahead of the likes of Palace, Southampton, Brighton, Burnley, et al. Also, as we've seen with Arsenal this season and previously the likes of Spurs and Everton. Those top clubs can still have bad seasons and falter down the league. It isn't a closed shop.
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That would be the Palace, Southampton, Burnley and Brighton you finished ahead of last season.
 
Binxy said:
That would be the Palace, Southampton, Burnley and Brighton you finished ahead of last season.
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You might have come in halfway through. I was saying that we need to finish ahead of them 'et al' which means 'and others'. Effectively I was saying we need to consistently finish among the best of the rest, rather than needing the final day of the season to lurch 5-6 places up the league.
 
The Fish said:
You might have come in halfway through. I was saying that we need to finish ahead of them 'et al' which means 'and others'. Effectively I was saying we need to consistently finish among the best of the rest, rather than needing the final day of the season to lurch 5-6 places up the league.
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Changing the goalpost there.

Take away the top 6 and maybe Leicester and Everton and you're finishing among the best of the rest.
 
The Fish said:
You might have come in halfway through. I was saying that we need to finish ahead of them 'et al' which means 'and others'. Effectively I was saying we need to consistently finish among the best of the rest, rather than needing the final day of the season to lurch 5-6 places up the league.
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You were best of the rest of the rest last season. The 'and others' you talk about are Leicester, West Ham, Everton, Leeds & Villa who finished above you. You need to accept you're just an also ran and once in a while you'll get a few decent players have a canny season getting around top 10 but mainly living in the bottom half.
 
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Binxy said:
Changing the goalpost there.

Take away the top 6 and maybe Leicester and Everton and you're finishing among the best of the rest.
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Not consistently and not with any conviction. Newcastle United are regularly among the favourites for relegation now. We're managed by a man who, over a decade ago was criticised by a Sunderland supporting journalist as being behind the times. Last season we finished 12th when, in reality, we were terrible for the majority of the season. Currently we're on a run of 7 wins in 37.

We're not likely to be finishing among the best of the rest, certainly not on footballing merit.
 
The Fish said:
Not consistently and not with any conviction. Newcastle United are regularly among the favourites for relegation now. We're managed by a man who, over a decade ago was criticised by a Sunderland supporting journalist as being behind the times. Last season we finished 12th when, in reality, we were terrible for the majority of the season. Currently we're on a run of 7 wins in 37.

We're not likely to be finishing among the best of the rest, certainly not on footballing merit.
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Do you seriously not get sick of posting the same shit day on day on day. You just keep repeating yourself on here with the same arguments.

It's frightening tbh how a grown man spends the amount of time you do on a rivals forum basically posting the same shite.

Get a life man you utterly sad embarrassing freak
 
Grumpy Old Man said:
The extra money per place is only around £2m. To get from where you are into what some of your fans think is pushing for Europe would bring in around £15m more, but cost at least 10 times that to achieve. And once there, you have to keep up with the Jones's or be left behind. You can only do that with, guess what, zero net spend. Ashley has concluded, rightly, that the game isn't worth the candle. The only way to square the circle is by generating consistently making large profits on players - negative net spend. To do that, you have to be supremely good at spotting and developing talent, and not wasting money on players where you'll need to recoup investment. In other words don't buy Joelintons and Almirons. You need the recruitment skills to sell St Maximin, and buy two replacements who'll be as good, then rinse and repeat. It's actually a virtuous circle, because you should end up improving the squad. All it needs is a bit a patience ............. oh.
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Aye finishing a few places higher up the league isn't great money at all. To stay up the top half consistently needs constant bankrolling (unless you keep finding hidden gem players) but the gap between the big 6 revenue and the rest is huge so there's not much room top hald! Last season, even with COVID affecting gate revenue of the big clubs, it was nearly double comparing Arsenal to Everton and well over double when you compare Everton etc to Spurs and above! In fact, when you add up the big 6 revenues it totals more than the other 14 teams. Although rare over the last 15 or so years, the big teams can have a bad season but will soon recover given the money they can invest in bringing in better players than the also rans in the league. It's only when they mess up and buy a few duds that they suffer but it isn't a long term thing.

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This was 2019 revenues before COVID affected revenue showing the bigger gap. It will only be bigger again in the future as crowds are back though Arsenal may be missing a few millions due to no European action this season.

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Leicester have done well with players coming in and going out for big money but their finances have shot up chasing success from what I've seen (
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). I think they're gonna struggle in coming seasons to maintain the high level. They haven't got off to a great start in their Europa League venture this season and league position doesn't look good either. Though even winning the Europa League is a fraction of what the Champions League generates and is possibly the fee to invest in a player. If goes wrong and they get knocked out in the league stage and get a few million extra but then nowhere near Europe this season then who knows what will happen. Leicester are a team going for it but I don't think they'll be there long term unless they keep pullling great players into the squad to replace the ones they lose.

I wish Ashley had went for it and spent a shit load chasing Europe but the Mags failed to get anywhere and ended up financially fucked rather than just tick along playing it safe. Even if they get taken over by PIF they'll be in for a shock as they won't be bankrolled like some think.


 
The Fish said:
That's not true. Progress on the pitch and around the facilities would see support renew.
There've been plenty of interested parties, but only the Saudis have met Ashley's asking price and got to the O&D test (which they then withdrew from). Ashley could have sold us had he accepted a lower bid, but he didn't want to.
Click to expand...

I also think Ashley wants things that some interested parties couldn't agree to. Rumours that he wanted to retain merchandising rights through Sports Direct, that the SD signage stays up for a period, etc.
The Fish said:
We've heard rumours of the Orleggi group who own Santos, GACP who own Bordeaux, and various others.
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You won't win an argument with endless speculation and rumours.

And making up facts doesn't help either.

All you really have is a massively biased, some would say deluded, opinion and see what you want to see.

MackemX and Grumpy post facts, you ignore them and just carry on regardless, the Sid James of RTG.
 
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Bear Heed said:
You won't win an argument with endless speculation and rumours.

And making up facts doesn't help either.

All you really have is a massively biased, some would say deluded, opinion and see what you want to see.
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I'm not trying to win with rumours and speculation. It has been said in the CAT Hearing that there are 'credible bidders'. There are numerous reports of bidders.

It is biased speculation to claim counter to those things that there aren't any interested parties.
 
The Fish said:
I'm not trying to win with rumours and speculation. It has been said in the CAT Hearing that there are 'credible bidders'. There are numerous reports of bidders.

It is biased speculation to claim counter to those things that there aren't any interested parties.
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Anyone can say there are credible bidders if they don't have to provide proof, as you've just done.
 
MackemX said:
Aye finishing a few places higher up the league isn't great money at all. To stay up the top half consistently needs constant bankrolling (unless you keep finding hidden gem players) but the gap between the big 6 revenue and the rest is huge so there's not much room top hald! Last season, even with COVID affecting gate revenue of the big clubs, it was nearly double comparing Arsenal to Everton and well over double when you compare Everton etc to Spurs and above! In fact, when you add up the big 6 revenues it totals more than the other 14 teams. Although rare over the last 15 or so years, the big teams can have a bad season but will soon recover given the money they can invest in bringing in better players than the also rans in the league. It's only when they mess up and buy a few duds that they suffer but it isn't a long term thing.

Logon or register to see this image


This was 2019 revenues before COVID affected revenue showing the bigger gap. It will only be bigger again in the future as crowds are back though Arsenal may be missing a few millions due to no European action this season.

Logon or register to see this image


Leicester have done well with players coming in and going out for big money but their finances have shot up chasing success from what I've seen (
You must be logged on to see external links
). I think they're gonna struggle in coming seasons to maintain the high level. They haven't got off to a great start in their Europa League venture this season and league position doesn't look good either. Though even winning the Europa League is a fraction of what the Champions League generates and is possibly the fee to invest in a player. If goes wrong and they get knocked out in the league stage and get a few million extra but then nowhere near Europe this season then who knows what will happen. Leicester are a team going for it but I don't think they'll be there long term unless they keep pullling great players into the squad to replace the ones they lose.

I wish Ashley had went for it and spent a shit load chasing Europe but the Mags failed to get anywhere and ended up financially fucked rather than just tick along playing it safe. Even if they get taken over by PIF they'll be in for a shock as they won't be bankrolled like some think.


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Think we have had this discussion before, especially relating to Leicester. The thing is even with investment, whilst you spend other clubs do as well. Any success would also come down to a huge slice of luck and getting your ducks in a row elsewhere. Recruitment, facilities, manager and coaching team etc etc. It's a huge mountain to climb for any team.
 
Has the result of last week's hearing been released? I'm sure the judge was going away with them two clampetts, who sat motionless through the hearing, to review the submissions.
 
The Fish said:
Not consistently and not with any conviction. Newcastle United are regularly among the favourites for relegation now. We're managed by a man who, over a decade ago was criticised by a Sunderland supporting journalist as being behind the times. Last season we finished 12th when, in reality, we were terrible for the majority of the season. Currently we're on a run of 7 wins in 37.

We're not likely to be finishing among the best of the rest, certainly not on footballing merit.
Click to expand...
But you are consistently among the best of the rest. Barring the big 6 and Leicester.

Average position last 4 seasons (since you've been back in the prem)

Everton 9.5
West Ham 11.25
NEWCASTLE 12
Burnley 12.25
Palace 12.75
Villa 14 (2 seasons)
Southampton 14.5
Brighton 14.5
Add the yo-yo teams like Watford, Norwich, West Brom, Bournemouth and Fulham and your definitely among the best of the rest.
 
Bear Heed said:
Anyone can say there are credible bidders if they don't have to provide proof, as you've just done.
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Wouldn't there be repercussions for the legal case if the lawyers claimed there were credible bidders, in court, when there aren't? And aside from reports, how could I provide proof that would satisfy you?

Also, anyone can claim there are not credible bidders.
 
Binxy said:
But you are consistently among the best of the rest. Barring the big 6 and Leicester.

Average position last 4 seasons (since you've been back in the prem)

Everton 9.5
West Ham 11.25
NEWCASTLE 12
Burnley 12.25
Palace 12.75
Villa 14 (2 seasons)
Southampton 14.5
Brighton 14.5
Add the yo-yo teams like Watford, Norwich, West Brom, Bournemouth and Fulham and your definitely among the best of the rest.
Click to expand...
brighton cant be right, will be a couple lower
 
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