Newcastle thread Oct and Nov 2020

[rentaghost]

We seem to be contradicting ourselves here. We're saying Bruce is a shit manager ( which I don't think), but the mags should be happy with him.

People have different opinions i don’t think Bruce is a good manager but he has done a decent job and as it stands a better one than the previous manager. It’s just laughing at the hypocrisy of giving every excuse in the world for the previous manager when results and performances are poor while blaming the current manager at every turn despite doing a better job. I mean compare the reaction to Newcastle winning at Newport to Rafa getting hammered away to Oxford? It’s hard to believe tbh

 

[Qwerty]

People have different opinions i don’t think Bruce is a good manager but he has done a decent job and as it stands a better one than the previous manager. It’s just laughing at the hypocrisy of giving every excuse in the world for the previous manager when results and performances are poor while blaming the current manager at every turn despite doing a better job. I mean compare the reaction to Newcastle winning at Newport to Rafa getting hammered away to Oxford? It’s hard to believe tbh

Only glanced through the thread but I've read mags saying Bruce is shit, ours saying Bruce is shit, then arguing withe each other when their both on the same side.

 

[rentaghost]

Only glanced through the thread but I've read mags saying Bruce is shit, ours saying Bruce is shit, then arguing withe each other when their both on the same side.

There is points of view on all sides regarding Bruce tbh however all Sunderland fans and some Newcastle fans are pretty much united in being astonished at the lengths some Newcastle fans will go to to defend Rafa and slaughter Bruce. The likes of The Fish are this type of poster who is a figure of fun for all Sunderland and some Newcastle fans.

 

[Exile 1968]

Must not watch a lot of football then sir. We are by no means an entertaining watch however i have seen far worse. Fulham and Burnley immediately spring to mind.


Do you work in Yokohama with me?

I was talking to a Liverpool fan in the pub last night and said that, almost verbatim. Spooky!


And had virtually nothing to do with his tactics.


Apologies sir but that is bollocks.

No it isnt bollocks. It's a fact

 

[rentaghost]

Must not watch a lot of football then sir. We are by no means an entertaining watch however i have seen far worse. Fulham and Burnley immediately spring to mind.


Do you work in Yokohama with me?

I was talking to a Liverpool fan in the pub last night and said that, almost verbatim. Spooky!


And had virtually nothing to do with his tactics.


Apologies sir but that is bollocks.

There's never an all size fits all with these type of statements. We have a section of fans who think we should piss every game in this league because 'We are Sunlun' but not enough to make it a trait typical of our fanbase. You seem well balanced and I know some lads who are similar. I think NUFC have more than your normal share of self entitled wankers and it is a trait associated rightly with your fanbase IMO. The Fish is your stereotypical mag.

 

[Biffo The Bear]

There's never an all size fits all with these type of statements. We have a section of fans who think we should piss every game in this league because 'We are Sunlun' but not enough to make it a trait typical of our fanbase. You seem well balanced and I know some lads who are similar. I think NUFC have more than your normal share of self entitled wankers and it is a trait associated rightly with your fanbase IMO. The Fish is your stereotypical mag.

That is fair enough mate. I try to be honest. Seems daft to be otherwise. Perhaps I am lucky in that my mates all see it how it is. We are in the very large groups of 'also rans' and, barring the odd year or two, always have been. Did I want Bruce, No. Is he doing a good job. In my opinion yes he is doing as well as I would expect. I think Rafa had us better organised however the end results were no better than those which Bruce is achieving. There is an argument that Bruce is doing better as we are making a better attempt at Cup success. Given that this is the only possible source of success for Newcastle then I am relatively happy. I appreciate some feel differently.

 

[Metro Man]

Are we now having an official 'Newcastle United' League Cup run thread?

 

[naughtynose]

Bet the fish actually stinks of fish.

 

[Benjamin]

That is fair enough mate. I try to be honest. Seems daft to be otherwise. Perhaps I am lucky in that my mates all see it how it is. We are in the very large groups of 'also rans' and, barring the odd year or two, always have been. Did I want Bruce, No. Is he doing a good job. In my opinion yes he is doing as well as I would expect. I think Rafa had us better organised however the end results were no better than those which Bruce is achieving. There is an argument that Bruce is doing better as we are making a better attempt at Cup success. Given that this is the only possible source of success for Newcastle then I am relatively happy. I appreciate some feel differently.

Lot of truth in that. Though as ever direct comparisons are hard to make in reality. Bruce took over a team that Benitez had managed the difficult part in establishing us as a team coming up from Championship that could consistently get over 40 Premier points in a season. Having this basis and all the extra money he has been given it not unreasonable to expect development rather than stasis.

 

[rentaghost]

Lot of truth in that. Though as ever direct comparisons are hard to make in reality. Bruce took over a team that Benitez had managed the difficult part in establishing us as a team coming up from Championship that could consistently get over 40 Premier points in a season. Having this basis and all the extra money he has been given it not unreasonable to expect development rather than stasis.

Really - when you take 40 million on Joelinton out of the equation brought in the day after Bruce came and replacing the excellent strike force Benitez had the season before is it really fair to use the 'extra money' argument. I mean last season would you rather have had Joelinton or would you rather have had Rondon and Perez. Which manager had the greater advantage?

 

[Binxy]

Really - when you take 40 million on Joelinton out of the equation brought in the day after Bruce came and replacing the excellent strike force Benitez had the season before is it really fair to use the 'extra money' argument. I mean last season would you rather have had Joelinton or would you rather have had Rondon and Perez. Which manager had the greater advantage?

Aye but net spend.

 

[Deleted member 47406]

Again missing the point. I’m not saying Bruce has done a great job at Newcastlenot even a good one. I think he is a bog standard, past it manager who top clubs shouldn’t touch with a barge pole. He has however done a better job at Newcastle than Benitez did though and did so without having the quality front two that Benitez had in his last season. My issue is more how moderate Rafa was at a mediocre club and that when things were going badly under Rafa all you ever heard was ‘what is he supposed to do with these idiots’. Well Bruce did just as well with Joelinton at his disposal rather than Perez and Rondon.

Wait, so what's your rationale for Bruce doing a better job?

What I find interesting is Ashley has given Bruce more control over who he signs. I had a friend in football that told me they were going after Tammy Abraham when they came up but Ashley played funny buggers with some things that stopped it happening so they had to go for Joselu instead. He's not a mag either before people think he's pumping propaganda in my ears.

FWIW, I think in literal terms, aye they achieved about the same (mid-table same number of points) but I think if were talking about actual tacticians it's not really much of a contest. Benitez has demonstrable success throughout his career, although I don't think he'll win another trophy in his career because football hs moved on. That doesn't mean he couldn't take an Everton or a Wolves into the Champions League. He's not good at being a pro-active manager, he prefers being given a situation and working out how to stop it or limit it.

Big Stevie B just throws them a ball and puts an arm around them.

As I said before you can't really compare the squads, and even if you do I'm not sure Bruce comes out well. Perez had his best PL season under Benitez same with Rondon. Shelvey had his joint best goal return out of Shelvey so he seemed to get a tune out of him, so deserves credit for that, but I think he was also their lowest top goal-scorer in their PL history or something daft like that.

The great irony for me was watching Benitez politic against Ashley, and for the first time in his career you could say, aye maybe he's being done wrong, but he'd cried wolf so much no **** believed him.

There's also clearly a double standard with Bruce and Benitez, but I think any club that appoints Bruce is basically admitting 'we're not trying'.

 

[Binxy]

Wait, so what's your rationale for Bruce doing a better job?

What I find interesting is Ashley has given Bruce more control over who he signs. I had a friend in football that told me they were going after Tammy Abraham when they came up but Ashley played funny buggers with some things that stopped it happening so they had to go for Joselu instead. He's not a mag either before people think he's pumping propaganda in my ears.

FWIW, I think in literal terms, aye they achieved about the same (mid-table same number of points) but I think if were talking about actual tacticians it's not really much of a contest. Benitez has demonstrable success throughout his career, although I don't think he'll win another trophy in his career because football hs moved on. That doesn't mean he couldn't take an Everton or a Wolves into the Champions League. He's not good at being a pro-active manager, he prefers being given a situation and working out how to stop it or limit it.

Big Stevie B just throws them a ball and puts an arm around them.

As I said before you can't really compare the squads, and even if you do I'm not sure Bruce comes out well. Perez had his best PL season under Benitez same with Rondon. Shelvey had his joint best goal return out of Shelvey so he seemed to get a tune out of him, so deserves credit for that, but I think he was also their lowest top goal-scorer in their PL history or something daft like that.

The great irony for me was watching Benitez politic against Ashley, and for the first time in his career you could say, aye maybe he's being done wrong, but he'd cried wolf so much no **** believed him.

There's also clearly a double standard with Bruce and Benitez, but I think any club that appoints Bruce is basically admitting 'we're not trying'.

So Ashley gives a f***ing useless buffoon like Bruce full control over transfers but dictates to a world class manager like Rafa who he signs.

Aye reetio.

 

[Deleted member 47406]

So Ashley gives a f***ing useless buffoon like Bruce full control over transfers but dictates to a world class manager like Rafa who he signs.

Aye reetio.

Check the Athletic fella. Caulkin wrote a piece on how Jeff Hendrick came about. Bruce basically said he didn't want Bentaleb he wanted Hendrick. I'm sure they had a rule too about now signing lads over 26/27 when they came up.

 

[mr chuckles]

Wait, so what's your rationale for Bruce doing a better job?

What I find interesting is Ashley has given Bruce more control over who he signs. I had a friend in football that told me they were going after Tammy Abraham when they came up but Ashley played funny buggers with some things that stopped it happening so they had to go for Joselu instead. He's not a mag either before people think he's pumping propaganda in my ears.

FWIW, I think in literal terms, aye they achieved about the same (mid-table same number of points) but I think if were talking about actual tacticians it's not really much of a contest. Benitez has demonstrable success throughout his career, although I don't think he'll win another trophy in his career because football hs moved on. That doesn't mean he couldn't take an Everton or a Wolves into the Champions League. He's not good at being a pro-active manager, he prefers being given a situation and working out how to stop it or limit it.

Big Stevie B just throws them a ball and puts an arm around them.

As I said before you can't really compare the squads, and even if you do I'm not sure Bruce comes out well. Perez had his best PL season under Benitez same with Rondon. Shelvey had his joint best goal return out of Shelvey so he seemed to get a tune out of him, so deserves credit for that, but I think he was also their lowest top goal-scorer in their PL history or something daft like that.

The great irony for me was watching Benitez politic against Ashley, and for the first time in his career you could say, aye maybe he's being done wrong, but he'd cried wolf so much no **** believed him.

There's also clearly a double standard with Bruce and Benitez, but I think any club that appoints Bruce is basically admitting 'we're not trying'.

Any Chinese club appointing Benitez will start thinking the same as he's doing f***ing shite

 

[Benjamin]

Really - when you take 40 million on Joelinton out of the equation brought in the day after Bruce came and replacing the excellent strike force Benitez had the season before is it really fair to use the 'extra money' argument. I mean last season would you rather have had Joelinton or would you rather have had Rondon and Perez. Which manager had the greater advantage?

If you comparing the two managers it impossible to take joelinton out of argument. Benitez had chance to buy at £20m & turned it down for a start. He was right-lad is not worth that never mind double. Nor was Rafa allowed £40m on a single player. Also misleading to compare joelinton with Rondon & Perez-Rafa desperately wanted club to sign Rondon at £16m. The club decided to pass & pay £40m for an inadequate replacement. Benitez made the Rondon/Perez combination & the club dismantled it. So far Bruce has been unable to better it.

 

[rentaghost]

If you comparing the two managers it impossible to take joelinton out of argument. Benitez had chance to buy at £20m & turned it down for a start. He was right-lad is not worth that never mind double. Nor was Rafa allowed £40m on a single player. Also misleading to compare joelinton with Rondon & Perez-Rafa desperately wanted club to sign Rondon at £16m. The club decided to pass & pay £40m for an inadequate replacement. Benitez made the Rondon/Perez combination & the club dismantled it. So far Bruce has been unable to better it.

i agree Joelinton is absolutely part of the argument in fact central to it. He’s utter shite cost 40 million, Bruce had him with no choice of his own and Rafa had superior players at his disposal. You can’t use a 40 million dud forced on a manager as evidence of that manager having an advantage. Ludicrous argument

 

[Roker Mackem]

West Ham signing Benrahma. The luck continues....

 

[rentaghost]

If you comparing the two managers it impossible to take joelinton out of argument. Benitez had chance to buy at £20m & turned it down for a start. He was right-lad is not worth that never mind double. Nor was Rafa allowed £40m on a single player. Also misleading to compare joelinton with Rondon & Perez-Rafa desperately wanted club to sign Rondon at £16m. The club decided to pass & pay £40m for an inadequate replacement. Benitez made the Rondon/Perez combination & the club dismantled it. So far Bruce has been unable to better it.

Yet still done better overall. Astonishing really given that he’s done so by your own admittance a worse strike force and not being able to organise team structure. I must admit I know a lot of Nufc fans who are similar to Biffo and Cyril and see things as they are but there are loads of starry eyed, self entitled fans who try to argue black is white.

 

[Deleted member 47406]

i agree Joelinton is absolutely part of the argument in fact central to it. He’s utter shite cost 40 million, Bruce had him with no choice of his own and Rafa had superior players at his disposal. You can’t use a 40 million dud forced on a manager as evidence of that manager having an advantage. Ludicrous argument

Tbh, the fact Bruce and Benitez didn't want Joelinton just reinforces how defensive they are. Nagelsmann got a tune out of him because he wants to play modern football.

Any Chinese club appointing Benitez will start thinking the same as he's doing f***ing shite

Oh aye, but then that's because you can't really change many of the players. Mind you I don't know how big his Chinese club are but I don't imagine they aspire to be bottom feeders.