New test players under Whitaker

[chunkyshanhawk53]

article in the excellent Cricket Paper today

Read this lot

Stokes, Woakes, Modern - successful

Wood, Hameed, TRJ, Malan, Overton, Stoneman - jury still out

And the rest

Jennings, Westley, Hales, Ballance, Robson, Duckett, Lyth, Borthwick, Rankin, Dawson, Kerrigan, Rashid, Ansari, Ball, Jordan, Vince

you could not make it up

 

[brandon]

article in the excellent Cricket Paper today

Read this lot

Stokes, Woakes, Modern - successful

Wood, Hameed, TRJ, Malan, Overton, Stoneman - jury still out

And the rest

Jennings, Westley, Hales, Ballance, Robson, Duckett, Lyth, Borthwick, Rankin, Dawson, Kerrigan, Rashid, Ansari, Ball, Jordan, Vince

you could not make it up

How many of the successful ones was he actually responsible for though? To me they all would've found success without his help (if he even gave them any).

How long has he been in post btw? Cause I'm sure he's the idiot who was watching Bunny EVERY week in 2013, taking wickets for fun at an average of about 15 and he STILL didn't get in the Ashes team.

Mind, maybe a few of us owe him a pint, cause if he'd done his job properly we probably wouldn't have won the Championship.

 

[chunkyshanhawk53]

How many of the successful ones was he actually responsible for though? To me they all would've found success without his help (if he even gave them any).

How long has he been in post btw? Cause I'm sure he's the idiot who was watching Bunny EVERY week in 2013, taking wickets for fun at an average of about 15 and he STILL didn't get in the Ashes team.

Mind, maybe a few of us owe him a pint, cause if he'd done his job properly we probably wouldn't have won the Championship.

2013, Stokes was his first pick

It’s a disastrous list

 

[The Rat]

article in the excellent Cricket Paper today

Read this lot

Stokes, Woakes, Modern - successful

Wood, Hameed, TRJ, Malan, Overton, Stoneman - jury still out

And the rest

Jennings, Westley, Hales, Ballance, Robson, Duckett, Lyth, Borthwick, Rankin, Dawson, Kerrigan, Rashid, Ansari, Ball, Jordan, Vince

you could not make it up

Bit harsh like, he was a key selector when the likes of Trott and Swann were called up.

That list above is horrendous like,

Blame Strauss though, he came in to manage English cricket, done a brilliant job in the white ball but done horrendous in the test. Just let things slide, no imagination, and it was the already established players who did the job.

Who is the last real selection success in tests? Malan maybe, before that you are going back to Mo Ali etc

 

[chunkyshanhawk53]

Bit harsh like, he was a key selector when the likes of Trott and Swann were called up.

That list above is horrendous like,

Blame Strauss though, he came in to manage English cricket, done a brilliant job in the white ball but done horrendous in the test. Just let things slide, no imagination, and it was the already established players who did the job.

Who is the last real selection success in tests? Malan maybe, before that you are going back to Mo Ali etc

That’s since he was head selector, but aye fair point

 

[brandon]

Who is the last real selection success in tests? Malan maybe, before that you are going back to Mo Ali etc

I would say Stokes personally, but again, I wouldn't put that down to him because a player of Stokes ability would've got in anyway eventually.

Malan hasn't cemented a place yet.

We must also remember he's responsible for leaving Stokes out of the World Cup.

 

[The Rat]

I would say Stokes personally, but again, I wouldn't put that down to him because a player of Stokes ability would've got in anyway eventually.

Malan hasn't cemented a place yet.

We must also remember he's responsible for leaving Stokes out of the World Cup.

There are some really poor call ups in the top list, I mean Ansari, Dawson, Rankin, Duckett etc

But some like Jennings, Hameed, Lyth etc. Not his fault is it.

I find it most annoying the way they have treated spin bowlers

Not sure who is responsible, but the obsession of finding an "x factor" bowler, or a spinner who can also bat. Just muddled thinking picking half way house players

Pick a front line spin bowler, who can bowl all day. There are spin bowlers in England, Leach, Rayner etc. They may not be world beaters but they can bowl.

Australia did it for years trying to find a new Shane Warne, when the answer was Lyon, a decent spinner with a good mentality.

You can't always find players who rip through teams, so therefore you need someone who can bowl a lot of overs

When we go to Asia, our spin bowlers are so so expensive, we end up having Broad and Anderson bowling dry all day, feel sorry for them

Sorry got sidetracked there!

 

[YES WE GYAN]

Someone had to be picked, who are the better players who have missed out?

 

[chunkyshanhawk53]

Someone had to be picked, who are the better players who have missed out?

Northeast, Hain, Burns, Leach. I could go on but I can’t be arsed

 

[Bri]

article in the excellent Cricket Paper today

Read this lot

Stokes, Woakes, Modern - successful

Wood, Hameed, TRJ, Malan, Overton, Stoneman - jury still out

And the rest

Jennings, Westley, Hales, Ballance, Robson, Duckett, Lyth, Borthwick, Rankin, Dawson, Kerrigan, Rashid, Ansari, Ball, Jordan, Vince

you could not make it up

Not sure this proves anything.

Whittaker's job is to bring likely players to the attention of the coach and other selectors etc. so if you're looking at failures you should look at who he didn't identify. Whether they were selected was not solely up to him and neither was whether they were successful.

And we know that the coach's approach is to get likely players into a squad and have a look at them in the nets and so forth - hopefully watch a few videos before putting them into the team.

tldr;

luck plays a part, injuries etc.
some of those in that list are good players who have done well for England, but perhaps not in the Test team
it's not all down to Whittaker
his failures are not the ones he picked it's the ones he didn't and the Leach situation recently is a (possible) example of this
case not proven imho

 

[The Rat]

Not sure this proves anything.

Whittaker's job is to bring likely players to the attention of the coach and other selectors etc. so if you're looking at failures you should look at who he didn't identify. Whether they were selected was not solely up to him and neither was whether they were successful.

And we know that the coach's approach is to get likely players into a squad and have a look at them in the nets and so forth - hopefully watch a few videos before putting them into the team.

tldr;

luck plays a part, injuries etc.
some of those in that list are good players who have done well for England, but perhaps not in the Test team
it's not all down to Whittaker
his failures are not the ones he picked it's the ones he didn't and the Leach situation recently is a (possible) example of this
case not proven imho

Whoever has been picking the spin bowlers needed sacking

 

[TopCat]

We must also remember he's responsible for leaving Stokes out of the World Cup.

Players should be picked on form.

 

[rentaghost]

2013, Stokes was his first pick

It’s a disastrous list

I'm no fan of Whtaker but if they weren't picked who should have been picked instead?

Northeast, Hain, Burns, Leach. I could go on but I can’t be arsed

There's just as much chanced they would have failed as the ones that got selected and failed. All of the openers deserved their shot before Burns who is only now been talked about because the others have failed. Leach has only come onto the scene if the last 15 months bowling on bunsens at Taunton. I hadn't even thought of hain but a young lad averaging 30 in first class record isn't exactly smashing the door down.

 

[chunkyshanhawk53]

I'm no fan of Whtaker but if they weren't picked who should have been picked instead?


There's just as much chanced they would have failed as the ones that got selected and failed. All of the openers deserved their shot before Burns who is only now been talked about because the others have failed. Leach has only come onto the scene if the last 15 months bowling on bunsens at Taunton. I hadn't even thought of hain but a young lad averaging 30 in first class record isn't exactly smashing the door down.

It’s difficult obviously. As you don’t know who would have succeeded. It’s about spotting those with the ability to step up and you just don’t know sometimes