Haven't seen a thread on this yet. Ryanair tolerates racism

[Morse]

When judging the punishment for this kind of incident, context should play a strong part.
The fact he called her an ugly, black bastard isn’t really the point, IMO. He created a scene on an aircraft, used offensive and threatening language and no doubt upset many people on the plane, some of whom were likely stressed about flying anyway. He should have been removed immediately. Those passengers would have been dreading him kicking off again once airborne, particularly the victim.

Ugly, black bastard is highly offensive, but not extremely racist, IMO. It’s a shame that it’s dominated the aftermath of the incident.

 

[Alcoholic_Author]

If it was up to me I'd have people who use racial slurs without apology put in a room with a jury of 12 randomly selected people of that race and have the accussd explain to them how what they did wasn't racist and then give the jury a chance to share their opinions on it. Depending on the severity it could be a one off or it could be frequent. I think that would provide more justice for racial minorities and cause racists to have to confront the consequences properly and give them the show of good faith that with the opportunity to consider how it affects others they will stop doing it.

Dont think prison will do owt to change someone's views if they're a racist besides making them more resentful.

This would be awful and would only polorise and entrench group thinking further.

Imagine a black fella who said something about whitey sitting infront of an all white jury trying to plead for forgiveness. Ooof.

 

[sonson]

This would be awful and would only polorise and entrench group thinking further.

Imagine a black fella who said something about whitey sitting infront of an all white jury trying to plead for forgiveness. Ooof.

Whereas letting people be racist while pretending not to be makes the world a big happy melting pot.

I don't really give a fuck about group thinking, part of the reason it exists is because racists demand that people keep to their own. Group thinking isn't going to go away while said groups have the evidence that people can publicly offend them without issue. At least in this situation there's the chance to call people to account.

When judging the punishment for this kind of incident, context should play a strong part.
The fact he called her an ugly, black bastard isn’t really the point, IMO. He created a scene on an aircraft, used offensive and threatening language and no doubt upset many people on the plane, some of whom were likely stressed about flying anyway. He should have been removed immediately. Those passengers would have been dreading him kicking off again once airborne, particularly the victim.

Ugly, black bastard is highly offensive, but not extremely racist, IMO. It’s a shame that it’s dominated the aftermath of the incident.

Would he have called her an ugly white bastard? Love to know how using someone's race as an insult isn't racist like

 

[Cockney Mackem]

When judging the punishment for this kind of incident, context should play a strong part.
The fact he called her an ugly, black bastard isn’t really the point, IMO. He created a scene on an aircraft, used offensive and threatening language and no doubt upset many people on the plane, some of whom were likely stressed about flying anyway. He should have been removed immediately. Those passengers would have been dreading him kicking off again once airborne, particularly the victim.

Ugly, black bastard is highly offensive, but not extremely racist, IMO. It’s a shame that it’s dominated the aftermath of the incident.

I don't think racist abuse on its own is a jail offence, you'd be looking for aggravating factors. And as you say the fact that this is happening on a plane and disruptive and threatening is the aggravating factor.

At the same time he may have some underlying condition that made him behave in that way, and unless he's notified the airline beforehand of some kind of cognitive or medical condition they are going to find that a challenge. If they were to deal with him in too heavy-handed a way and he turns out to be a vulnerable individual that's not good either.

But there's got to be a threshold where someone's behaviour is enough for Ryanair to say "you're out of there," and IMHO his behaviour crossed that threshold. Their response was inadequate and the response since then has been inadequate as well. The reason for this is obviously that all they care about is profitably and quickly turning round the plane. But it amounts to tolerating horrendous behaviour, and total disregard for a passenger being subjected to abuse.

 

[Alcoholic_Author]

Whereas letting people be racist while pretending not to be makes the world a big happy melting pot.

I don't really give a fuck about group thinking, part of the reason it exists is because racists demand that people keep to their own. Group thinking isn't going to go away while said groups have the evidence that people can publicly offend them without issue. At least in this situation there's the chance to call people to account.

The problem is we have blown "Racism" into this huge scary monster where the perp must be hung or jailed when it is just another form of discrimination based on an immutable characteristic. The power we give "Racism" makes it the strong tool that it is and in turn the masses become seething zombies at the thought of it.

People will not stop being offended and you cannot stop "thought crimes", so we can choose to empower "Racism" or deflate it.

 

[sonson]

The problem is we have blown "Racism" into this huge scary monster where the perp must be hung or jailed when it is just another form of discrimination based on an immutable characteristic. The power we give "Racism" makes it the strong tool that it is and in turn the masses become seething zombies at the thought of it.

People will not stop being offended and you cannot stop "thought crimes", so we can choose to empower "Racism" or deflate it.

I disagree. I think people are more concerned about being labelled racist than they are with actually opposing racism.

 

[Alcoholic_Author]

I disagree. I think people are more concerned about being labelled racist than they are with actually opposing racism.

Sure and that's a product of how frothing people get at the thought it. We're a narcissistic society and care deeply about what others think about us, being labelled a "racist" is utterly abhorrent to most people because they're lost in the malaise of liberal groupthink.

 

[sonson]

Sure and that's a product of how frothing people get at the thought it. We're a narcissistic society and care deeply about what others think about us, being labelled a "racist" is utterly abhorrent to most people because they're lost in the malaise of liberal groupthink.

My views on racism are not a product of liberal group think. They're a product of being married into a non whote family and witnessing and listening to their experience. Most white people have never experienced racism either themselves or seem ofher peole experience it, they don't understand it and won't until they speak to the people who have

 

[Morse]

Love to know how using someone's race as an insult isn't racist like

I’d love to know where I said it isn’t racist.

 

[sonson]

Being called a racist would be a cakewalk compared to experiencing racism.

I’d love to know where I said it isn’t racist.

Sorry I don't differentiate between degrees of racism and I've never heard anyone from a minority race doing so either. If something is racist that's intolerable.

You say it isn't extremely racist, so what is it then? Moderately racist, benignly racist, a bit racist? What's that scale? And what makes you think you're in a good position to determine whether something is "extremely" racist or otherwise?

 

[Morse]

Being called a racist would be a cakewalk compared to experiencing racism.


Sorry I don't differentiate between degrees of racism and I've never heard anyone from a minority race doing so either. If something is racist that's intolerable.

You say it isn't extremely racist, so what is it then? Moderately racist, benignly racist, a bit racist? What's that scale? And what makes you think you're in a good position to determine whether something is "extremely" racist or otherwise?

You could’ve just said you misread my post. Never mind.

 

[Alcoholic_Author]

My views on racism are not a product of liberal group think. They're a product of being married into a non whote family and witnessing and listening to their experience. Most white people have never experienced racism either themselves or seem ofher peole experience it, they don't understand it and won't until they speak to the people who have

Like you I am also married into a non-white family.

None the less "Racism" has largely become a tool to invoke hysteria at what is in most cases uncouth wankerish behavior, such as in this Ryanair example.

 

[OOOSH YEAH]

Looks like he was pissed tbf

 

[Horatio Pugwash]

I don't think racist abuse on its own is a jail offence, you'd be looking for aggravating factors. And as you say the fact that this is happening on a plane and disruptive and threatening is the aggravating factor.

At the same time he may have some underlying condition that made him behave in that way, and unless he's notified the airline beforehand of some kind of cognitive or medical condition they are going to find that a challenge. If they were to deal with him in too heavy-handed a way and he turns out to be a vulnerable individual that's not good either.

But there's got to be a threshold where someone's behaviour is enough for Ryanair to say "you're out of there," and IMHO his behaviour crossed that threshold. Their response was inadequate and the response since then has been inadequate as well. The reason for this is obviously that all they care about is profitably and quickly turning round the plane. But it amounts to tolerating horrendous behaviour, and total disregard for a passenger being subjected to abuse.

Or the staff didn't want to inconvenience a plane full of passengers (including the offended lady) by delaying the plane any longer than was absolutely necessary and wanted the racist prick dealt with later.

 

[Cockney Mackem]

The problem is we have blown "Racism" into this huge scary monster where the perp must be hung or jailed when it is just another form of discrimination based on an immutable characteristic. The power we give "Racism" makes it the strong tool that it is and in turn the masses become seething zombies at the thought of it.

People will not stop being offended and you cannot stop "thought crimes", so we can choose to empower "Racism" or deflate it.

It's a bit of a fallacy that racism only gained any power once people started disapproving of it. It's not like world history only started in 1965

Or the staff didn't want to inconvenience a plane full of passengers (including the offended lady) by delaying the plane any longer than was absolutely necessary and wanted the racist prick dealt with later.

Except they didn't deal with him at all

 

[Alcoholic_Author]

It's a bit of a fallacy that racism only gained any power once people started disapproving of it. It's not like world history only started in 1965

What is Racism?

If it's discrimination based on Race, it is as old as the hills, the biggest debate is what is race? Race is arbitrary, you as a white Briton are likely closer to me than a Finnish or Nigerian person and of course it's gradient.

Racism as it exists now in a multicultural society has been fundamentally broken down and we're dealing with dregs and remnants, it has more power now than ever before simply because we do not acknowledge it as a innate and natural response to what has existed since time eternal.