Do you ever worry?

[Chewit]

That the club ownership is so ruthless, so relentless (to use their own term) to deliver success that

1. They will alienate huge numbers of loyal supporters by a. Pricing them out of the SOL b. Turfing supporters out of their seats they have sat in for decades c. making demands that season ticket holders buy Europe / Domestic Cup Tickets at inflated prices d. Largely remove concession pricing e. Kill the community feel and heritage of the club of generations of families supporting the club.

2. They will sell the club at the first opportunity to make a huge gain leaving us at the mercy of Chelsea like owners

3. Thst this is all about money rather than glory

These are consequences and experiences fans of other clubs have had.

One of the things I always find strange is how the owners don’t ever come out and spell out their vision for the club and how they are going to achieve it.

I watched the interim CEO being interviewed and he said all the right things but did he mean it, are we all a bit gullible lapping up all the positive engaging PR.

They are bloody good, bloody clever and done bloody well. But does anyone worry they might lose their club as they know it.

Which club can we hope we will emulate to have what is success but also ensures that the club is primarily for the people and most importantly not the fan who watches on TV but the one who attends rain , hail and shine.

Bob Murray did everything for the fans, not himself, but delivered limited success.

Is the future for us or despite us ??? Will success be worth it.

Only really interested in views of people who actually go to games … for anyone else what do they care…. And there’s the rub. 40000 people may be sensitive to change but for millions we are just performing seals creating an atmosphere and feeding their entertainment.

Do we feel German football is more wholesome more in tune with supporters?

I think Chelsea, Mags, West Ham, Man Utd have all been destroyed as clubs.
Daft as it might sound I am glad I don’t support Man City, I think it’s lost its soul.
Probably only Liverpool has kept in touch with its roots. Can we do that?

 

[Dodgy]

TL;DR

 

[OtLeYmAcKeM]

That the club ownership is so ruthless, so relentless (to use their own term) to deliver success that

1. They will alienate huge numbers of loyal supporters by a. Pricing them out of the SOL b. Turfing supporters out of their seats they have sat in for decades c. making demands that season ticket holders buy Europe / Domestic Cup Tickets at inflated prices d. Largely remove concession pricing e. Kill the community feel and heritage of the club of generations of families supporting the club.

2. They will sell the club at the first opportunity to make a huge gain leaving us at the mercy of Chelsea like owners

3. Thst this is all about money rather than glory

These are consequences and experiences fans of other clubs have had.

One of the things I always find strange is how the owners don’t ever come out and spell out their vision for the club and how they are going to achieve it.

I watched the interim CEO being interviewed and he said all the right things but did he mean it, are we all a bit gullible lapping up all the positive engaging PR.

They are bloody good, bloody clever and done bloody well. But does anyone worry they might lose their club as they know it.

Which club can we hope we will emulate to have what is success but also ensures that the club is primarily for the people and most importantly not the fan who watches on TV but the one who attends rain , hail and shine.

Bob Murray did everything for the fans, not himself, but delivered limited success.

Is the future for us or despite us ??? Will success be worth it.

Only really interested in views of people who actually go to games … for anyone else what do they care…. And there’s the rub. 40000 people may be sensitive to change but for millions we are just performing seals creating an atmosphere and feeding their entertainment.

Do we feel German football is more wholesome more in tune with supporters?

I think Chelsea, Mags, West Ham, Man Utd have all been destroyed as clubs.
Daft as it might sound I am glad I don’t support Man City, I think it’s lost its soul.
Probably only Liverpool has kept in touch with its roots. Can we do that?

dinnar

 

[sunlandlad88]

That the club ownership is so ruthless, so relentless (to use their own term) to deliver success that

1. They will alienate huge numbers of loyal supporters by a. Pricing them out of the SOL b. Turfing supporters out of their seats they have sat in for decades c. making demands that season ticket holders buy Europe / Domestic Cup Tickets at inflated prices d. Largely remove concession pricing e. Kill the community feel and heritage of the club of generations of families supporting the club.

2. They will sell the club at the first opportunity to make a huge gain leaving us at the mercy of Chelsea like owners

3. Thst this is all about money rather than glory

These are consequences and experiences fans of other clubs have had.

One of the things I always find strange is how the owners don’t ever come out and spell out their vision for the club and how they are going to achieve it.

I watched the interim CEO being interviewed and he said all the right things but did he mean it, are we all a bit gullible lapping up all the positive engaging PR.

They are bloody good, bloody clever and done bloody well. But does anyone worry they might lose their club as they know it.

Which club can we hope we will emulate to have what is success but also ensures that the club is primarily for the people and most importantly not the fan who watches on TV but the one who attends rain , hail and shine.

Bob Murray did everything for the fans, not himself, but delivered limited success.

Is the future for us or despite us ??? Will success be worth it.

Only really interested in views of people who actually go to games … for anyone else what do they care…. And there’s the rub. 40000 people may be sensitive to change but for millions we are just performing seals creating an atmosphere and feeding their entertainment.

Do we feel German football is more wholesome more in tune with supporters?

I think Chelsea, Mags, West Ham, Man Utd have all been destroyed as clubs.
Daft as it might sound I am glad I don’t support Man City, I think it’s lost its soul.
Probably only Liverpool has kept in touch with its roots. Can we do that?

All of the above could happen, but what is the point in worrying about it. It wont change a single thing, and right now we have just qualified for Europe. Just enjoy it. Worrying achieves nothing in reality, it doesnt prepare you any better, and it takes the shine off good times.

If we had a good European run and then ended back down in the championship in 10years time, so be it. Football is a mad game and nothing is guaranteed so just enjoy these moments as they wont last forever

 

[contrarian]

Very few softies prevail in business and football

 

[Chewit]

TL;DR

ADHD?

All of the above could happen, but what is the point in worrying about it. It wont change a single thing, and right now we have just qualified for Europe. Just enjoy it. Worrying achieves nothing in reality, it doesnt prepare you any better, and it takes the shine off good times.

If we had a good European run and then ended back down in the championship in 10years time, so be it. Football is a mad game and nothing is guaranteed so just enjoy these moments as they wont last forever

You are of course right I just hate the thought we go down the same road as other clubs only to lose our identity

Very few softies prevail in business and football

I am as sure as I can be they will be successful…. But does success have to include selling your soul. If they have their heads screwed on they will recognise that the traditional Sunderland fan is their secret weapon, their joker, the magic dust, the drive.

 

[Vauxie]

1. Aye
2. Aye
3. Aye

 

[contrarian]

The notion that Murray was some patrician altruistic aw shucks businessman owner of Safc is at odds with the reality of the man and his career
He started with very little and he built a substantial national business . He was ruthless and very very competitive
He built the SOL with grants from local, national and Euro grants ( taxpayer money ) and fair play for him knowing how to ‘work the system ‘. He still walked away with almost 6m trousered which was more than he bought the club for, and in comparison with the much and unfairly maligned Ellis Short it was a steal
Businesses are about extracting the maximum amount of money in as short à possible time from punters. KLD especially knows both the fickleness and passion of football from his family’s experience with Marseilles and he is from à very wealthy business oriented family. He is not from Sunderland
He wants to grow the business and the brand.
Everything else is just background noise

 

[Wakoro]

If they wanted to they would have sold the club the moment we got promoted as that was their "first opportunity" to make a 300m + return.

They kept prices frozen for this first season, shows some care about the fans no? Gave people born in the 1700s a free ST didn't they?

If you watch that interview with our acting CEO on the Charlie Methveg podcast, he was on about how general admission tickets bring negliable revenue compared to premium/corporate offerings. I think they'll keep the GA seats reasonable for the premier league, while increasing the fancy seats more.

If you look at clubs revenues general ticket sales are a relatively small part of them, that's why the CEO was on about our expansion and was saying it's only worth doing if we are to have 15% of seats premium, which is comparable to new stadiums like Spurs and Everton. That's where stadiums make real money. THAT'S WONGA!

We need to expand the concourses! more bars! more restaurants! more merch! SAFC everything from microwaves to prophylactics! TV shows! SAFC anime! SAFC soap opera! Stadium museum! Stadium tours! SAFC weddings & funerals with our own SAFC priest! International memberships for Chinese, Japanese, who can't get here but want to be part of us! Give them a badge with a number, first to sign get lower numbers (FOMO STATUS SYMBOL I am not a name I'm a number) Exponential growth, reinvest, sell stadium bricks then remove them without telling anyone! Rinse, repeat! ABC always be closing!

 

[yossarian31]

I agree with you on most of your points but you only have to witness Man Utd away support to realise they havent had their soul ripped out. I put man Utd and liverpool as different frm the rest

 

[contrarian]

If they wanted to they would have sold the club the moment we got promoted as that was their "first opportunity" to make a 300m + return.

They kept prices frozen for this first season, shows some care about the fans no? Gave people born in the 1700s a free ST didn't they?

If you watch that interview with our acting CEO on the Charlie Methveg podcast, he was on about how general admission tickets bring negliable revenue compared to premium/corporate offerings. I think they'll keep the GA seats reasonable for the premier league, while increasing the fancy seats more.

If you look at clubs revenues general ticket sales are a relatively small part of them, that's why the CEO was on about our expansion and was saying it's only worth doing if we are to have 15% of seats premium, which is comparable to new stadiums like Spurs and Everton. That's where stadiums make real money. THAT'S WONGA!

We need to expand the concourses! more bars! more restaurants! more merch! SAFC everything from microwaves to prophylactics! TV shows! SAFC anime! SAFC soap opera! Stadium museum! Stadium tours! SAFC weddings & funerals with our own SAFC priest! International memberships for Chinese, Japanese, who can't get here but want to be part of us! Give them a badge with a number, first to sign get lower numbers (FOMO STATUS SYMBOL I am not a name I'm a number) Exponential growth, reinvest, sell stadium bricks then remove them without telling anyone! Rinse, repeat! ABC always be closing!

Clearly à lot of tongue in cheek there but bottom line is KLD and co will do what it takes to maximize our bottom line and if it means putting the noses out of some traditionalists they won’t lose any sleep

 

[sunlandlad88]

You are of course right I just hate the thought we go down the same road as other clubs only to lose our identity

I think that is an issue, but sadly our 'identity' over the last 15years has been lower end of the premier league and then the lower leagues. A team that plays terrible football and has no hope.

I think the club will develop and feel a bit different, but its what comes with success, and if you dont want your club to be successful, then whats the ultimate aim of supporting them.

 

[Milton no nez]

Totally agree about Man city

 

[Geras]

If they wanted to they would have sold the club the moment we got promoted as that was their "first opportunity" to make a 300m + return.

They kept prices frozen for this first season, shows some care about the fans no? Gave people born in the 1700s a free ST didn't they?

If you watch that interview with our acting CEO on the Charlie Methveg podcast, he was on about how general admission tickets bring negliable revenue compared to premium/corporate offerings. I think they'll keep the GA seats reasonable for the premier league, while increasing the fancy seats more.

If you look at clubs revenues general ticket sales are a relatively small part of them, that's why the CEO was on about our expansion and was saying it's only worth doing if we are to have 15% of seats premium, which is comparable to new stadiums like Spurs and Everton. That's where stadiums make real money. THAT'S WONGA!

We need to expand the concourses! more bars! more restaurants! more merch! SAFC everything from microwaves to prophylactics! TV shows! SAFC anime! SAFC soap opera! Stadium museum! Stadium tours! SAFC weddings & funerals with our own SAFC priest! International memberships for Chinese, Japanese, who can't get here but want to be part of us! Give them a badge with a number, first to sign get lower numbers (FOMO STATUS SYMBOL I am not a name I'm a number) Exponential growth, reinvest, sell stadium bricks then remove them without telling anyone! Rinse, repeat! ABC always be closing!

" 2nd prize ? A set of f*ckin' steak knives "

 

[lN5]

That the club ownership is so ruthless, so relentless (to use their own term) to deliver success that

1. They will alienate huge numbers of loyal supporters by a. Pricing them out of the SOL b. Turfing supporters out of their seats they have sat in for decades c. making demands that season ticket holders buy Europe / Domestic Cup Tickets at inflated prices d. Largely remove concession pricing e. Kill the community feel and heritage of the club of generations of families supporting the club.

2. They will sell the club at the first opportunity to make a huge gain leaving us at the mercy of Chelsea like owners

3. Thst this is all about money rather than glory

These are consequences and experiences fans of other clubs have had.

One of the things I always find strange is how the owners don’t ever come out and spell out their vision for the club and how they are going to achieve it.

I watched the interim CEO being interviewed and he said all the right things but did he mean it, are we all a bit gullible lapping up all the positive engaging PR.

They are bloody good, bloody clever and done bloody well. But does anyone worry they might lose their club as they know it.

Which club can we hope we will emulate to have what is success but also ensures that the club is primarily for the people and most importantly not the fan who watches on TV but the one who attends rain , hail and shine.

Bob Murray did everything for the fans, not himself, but delivered limited success.

Is the future for us or despite us ??? Will success be worth it.

Only really interested in views of people who actually go to games … for anyone else what do they care…. And there’s the rub. 40000 people may be sensitive to change but for millions we are just performing seals creating an atmosphere and feeding their entertainment.

Do we feel German football is more wholesome more in tune with supporters?

I think Chelsea, Mags, West Ham, Man Utd have all been destroyed as clubs.
Daft as it might sound I am glad I don’t support Man City, I think it’s lost its soul.
Probably only Liverpool has kept in touch with its roots. Can we do that?

I learnt along time ago that life is too short to worry about things I can’t control.

 

[splorty]

That the club ownership is so ruthless, so relentless (to use their own term) to deliver success that

1. They will alienate huge numbers of loyal supporters by a. Pricing them out of the SOL b. Turfing supporters out of their seats they have sat in for decades c. making demands that season ticket holders buy Europe / Domestic Cup Tickets at inflated prices d. Largely remove concession pricing e. Kill the community feel and heritage of the club of generations of families supporting the club.

2. They will sell the club at the first opportunity to make a huge gain leaving us at the mercy of Chelsea like owners

3. Thst this is all about money rather than glory

These are consequences and experiences fans of other clubs have had.

One of the things I always find strange is how the owners don’t ever come out and spell out their vision for the club and how they are going to achieve it.

I watched the interim CEO being interviewed and he said all the right things but did he mean it, are we all a bit gullible lapping up all the positive engaging PR.

They are bloody good, bloody clever and done bloody well. But does anyone worry they might lose their club as they know it.

Which club can we hope we will emulate to have what is success but also ensures that the club is primarily for the people and most importantly not the fan who watches on TV but the one who attends rain , hail and shine.

Bob Murray did everything for the fans, not himself, but delivered limited success.

Is the future for us or despite us ??? Will success be worth it.

Only really interested in views of people who actually go to games … for anyone else what do they care…. And there’s the rub. 40000 people may be sensitive to change but for millions we are just performing seals creating an atmosphere and feeding their entertainment.

Do we feel German football is more wholesome more in tune with supporters?

I think Chelsea, Mags, West Ham, Man Utd have all been destroyed as clubs.
Daft as it might sound I am glad I don’t support Man City, I think it’s lost its soul.
Probably only Liverpool has kept in touch with its roots. Can we do that?

No

 

[Coeus]

I do worry that relative success comes with a different fan experience, but to be fair we have tried the being so involved we were changing the seats, it wasnt great. Seems par for the course.

I dont really worry that they could sell as I cant do anything about it at all so seems a bit pointless.

 

[fyl2u]

That the club ownership is so ruthless, so relentless (to use their own term) to deliver success that

1. They will alienate huge numbers of loyal supporters by a. Pricing them out of the SOL b. Turfing supporters out of their seats they have sat in for decades c. making demands that season ticket holders buy Europe / Domestic Cup Tickets at inflated prices d. Largely remove concession pricing e. Kill the community feel and heritage of the club of generations of families supporting the club.

2. They will sell the club at the first opportunity to make a huge gain leaving us at the mercy of Chelsea like owners

3. Thst this is all about money rather than glory

These are consequences and experiences fans of other clubs have had.

One of the things I always find strange is how the owners don’t ever come out and spell out their vision for the club and how they are going to achieve it.

I watched the interim CEO being interviewed and he said all the right things but did he mean it, are we all a bit gullible lapping up all the positive engaging PR.

They are bloody good, bloody clever and done bloody well. But does anyone worry they might lose their club as they know it.

Which club can we hope we will emulate to have what is success but also ensures that the club is primarily for the people and most importantly not the fan who watches on TV but the one who attends rain , hail and shine.

Bob Murray did everything for the fans, not himself, but delivered limited success.

Is the future for us or despite us ??? Will success be worth it.

Only really interested in views of people who actually go to games … for anyone else what do they care…. And there’s the rub. 40000 people may be sensitive to change but for millions we are just performing seals creating an atmosphere and feeding their entertainment.

Do we feel German football is more wholesome more in tune with supporters?

I think Chelsea, Mags, West Ham, Man Utd have all been destroyed as clubs.
Daft as it might sound I am glad I don’t support Man City, I think it’s lost its soul.
Probably only Liverpool has kept in touch with its roots. Can we do that?

No.

 

[Longy]

I’ve been there in person & seen many of the club hierarchy talk about the connect with fans, city & club being integral. They could be talking complete shite, but they appear to be saying the right things.

As savvy businessmen, I’m sure they haven’t failed to notice that we’re a bit different in this part of the country where tourists rocking up to pay a premium aren’t on every corner, like they will be in London, or Manchester, or Liverpool. You might get away with it to a certain point while things are going well, but history has shown if you get it wrong, empty seats appear. They are filled by people getting into the habit of going, that’s local people.

As for Bob Murray, he’s put down some things he can take fantastic credit for, but history has been rewritten quite a bit, not least by him. He was looked upon negatively in his time in charge for the vast majority. His book is frustrating in that everything that ever went wrong was never his fault. At worst he was “too trusting”. That’s the only thing he’ll aim at himself.

An example of how you can spin a story was him moving to Jersey. He paints a lovely picture of finding an old unloved building that he & his wife restored with care, attention & detail. Sounds amazing, a romantic notion. Never once mentioned that moving to jersey would save him millions in tax.

Thats not me trying to demonise Bob Murray by the way, but there’s always two versions to every story & we are fed the positive one exclusively these days. I was there when it wasn’t positive.

 

[stevo]

That the club ownership is so ruthless, so relentless (to use their own term) to deliver success that

1. They will alienate huge numbers of loyal supporters by a. Pricing them out of the SOL b. Turfing supporters out of their seats they have sat in for decades c. making demands that season ticket holders buy Europe / Domestic Cup Tickets at inflated prices d. Largely remove concession pricing e. Kill the community feel and heritage of the club of generations of families supporting the club.

2. They will sell the club at the first opportunity to make a huge gain leaving us at the mercy of Chelsea like owners

3. Thst this is all about money rather than glory

These are consequences and experiences fans of other clubs have had.

One of the things I always find strange is how the owners don’t ever come out and spell out their vision for the club and how they are going to achieve it.

I watched the interim CEO being interviewed and he said all the right things but did he mean it, are we all a bit gullible lapping up all the positive engaging PR.

They are bloody good, bloody clever and done bloody well. But does anyone worry they might lose their club as they know it.

Which club can we hope we will emulate to have what is success but also ensures that the club is primarily for the people and most importantly not the fan who watches on TV but the one who attends rain , hail and shine.

Bob Murray did everything for the fans, not himself, but delivered limited success.

Is the future for us or despite us ??? Will success be worth it.

Only really interested in views of people who actually go to games … for anyone else what do they care…. And there’s the rub. 40000 people may be sensitive to change but for millions we are just performing seals creating an atmosphere and feeding their entertainment.

Do we feel German football is more wholesome more in tune with supporters?

I think Chelsea, Mags, West Ham, Man Utd have all been destroyed as clubs.
Daft as it might sound I am glad I don’t support Man City, I think it’s lost its soul.
Probably only Liverpool has kept in touch with its roots. Can we do that?

No ,are you sure somebody else hasnt posted this and put your name to it.I have always said that we given half a chance can be as big as anyone .The club might put a few noses out of joint but we will fill the ground as long as they are ruthless in dragging us back to the team of all the talents.HTLs