Dalian Atkinson - Police on trial

MonkeyLove

Striker
Part of the problem is he sounds like he was having a meltdown of some kind, and most likely he was off his face and causing a noise nuisance rather than being a threat to anyone. It shouldn't have been a matter for the police but that's who gets called. I shouldn't think they had much training for the situation they had in front of them.

My sympathy stops there because there's a procedure for subduing and arresting people that's non lethal, and that clearly wasn't followed

He was covered in blood and had his Dad by the throat saying he was going to kill him. And you don’t want to call the police?
 


Gelan

Central Defender
In a society that had properly funded services and values people's welfare, that's a matter for trained mental health/ medical professionals with experience in dealing with and subduing safely a subject in that condition.
And there you have it! Everything must be properley funded, yet people will vote against a party advocating higher taxes. Valueing peoples welfare has to start at grass roots, we start by taking spirtual care as it is the catalyst for all problems mental and physical.

Good post marra 👍
 
He was covered in blood and had his Dad by the throat saying he was going to kill him. And you don’t want to call the police?

The outcome of any investigation into the incident results in Atkinson going into a medical facility not a criminal one. The police get called because there's no one else, but time and again we see evidence that this isn't the right approach for mental health and medical related incidents like this
 

Gelan

Central Defender
No, wasn't that, I just thought maybe she thought she was protecting her partner/guy.
Got you, but what cannot be known to judge or juror are the emotions felt by all parties at the first moment of confrontation. He's a big guy, covered in blood, you've been told he has intent to murder. If we are allowed to deliberate on the mental state of the victim, then the same must go for the accused, otherwise the kangaroo has won.
 
Part of the problem is he sounds like he was having a meltdown of some kind, and most likely he was off his face and causing a noise nuisance rather than being a threat to anyone. It shouldn't have been a matter for the police but that's who gets called. I shouldn't think they had much training for the situation they had in front of them.

My sympathy stops there because there's a procedure for subduing and arresting people that's non lethal, and that clearly wasn't followed
They'll have had plenty of training.

There appears no justification for the length of time the third taser firing was done for or the kick to the head or the baton strikes. Unless more is revealed obviously.
 

sambantam82

Midfield
Police officers probably panicked and thought if we don't incapacitate this guy swiftly and definitely then we're going to end up in intensive care.

Call me naive but I just don't think the officers at any point decided ' let's kill this bloke for our own sadistic pleasure'.

Like another poster said it's easy to know how you'd behave until you're in their shoes.
 

MonkeyLove

Striker
The outcome of any investigation into the incident results in Atkinson going into a medical facility not a criminal one. The police get called because there's no one else, but time and again we see evidence that this isn't the right approach for mental health and medical related incidents like this

Problem is not all mental health episodes have the same outcome. There have been plenty of occasions where they have turned violent and resulted in serious injury or death.

There have been some spree killers who have been having a mental health episode that have murdered a number of people.

How do you forecast with certainty which party to call in advance without knowing which way it will go.

Surely the answer is just to better train and equip the police to deal with these sort of incidents and ensure that once triaged if non criminal or dangerous they are handed over quickly to a well funded support service.

Putting in another medical service, who may not be able to handle the small proportion of these incidents that do turn serious just seems an unnecessary and complicated approach
 
They'll have had plenty of training.

There appears no justification for the length of time the third taser firing was done for or the kick to the head or the baton strikes. Unless more is revealed obviously.

Plenty of training for arresting an offender, and yes they will rightly be prosecuted if as the court heard today they've grossly breached that to essentially assault someone who pissed them off. But I bet they've got hardly any training in how distressed mentally ill people react to intensive kidney treatment and how a psychiatric professional would talk to him, subdue and restrain him
Problem is not all mental health episodes have the same outcome. There have been plenty of occasions where they have turned violent and resulted in serious injury or death.

There have been some spree killers who have been having a mental health episode that have murdered a number of people.

How do you forecast with certainty which party to call in advance without knowing which way it will go.

Surely the answer is just to better train and equip the police to deal with these sort of incidents and ensure that once triaged if non criminal or dangerous they are handed over quickly to a well funded support service.

Putting in another medical service, who may not be able to handle the small proportion of these incidents that do turn serious just seems an unnecessary and complicated approach

We had a service that did this and it was disbanded in the 1990s. We're not inventing new shit here
 

MonkeyLove

Striker
Police officers probably panicked and thought if we don't incapacitate this guy swiftly and definitely then we're going to end up in intensive care.

Call me naive but I just don't think the officers at any point decided ' let's kill this bloke for our own sadistic pleasure'.

Like another poster said it's easy to know how you'd behave until you're in their shoes.

I don’t believe that as the damage seems to have been done after he was prone on the floor. The scared for their safety excuse doesn’t make sense to keep tasering an unconscious man or kicking him in the head whilst he is not moving
 

ebb

Winger
He was covered in blood and had his Dad by the throat saying he was going to kill him. And you don’t want to call the police?
If you look back to articles at the time he had also told his father that he was going to kill him and he had killed his brother.
Although in an ideal world trained health professionals should be there at the scene, in an emergency it just isn't going to happen.
 

MonkeyLove

Striker
Plenty of training for arresting an offender, and yes they will rightly be prosecuted if as the court heard today they've grossly breached that to essentially assault someone who pissed them off. But I bet they've got hardly any training in how distressed mentally ill people react to intensive kidney treatment and how a psychiatric professional would talk to him, subdue and restrain him


We had a service that did this and it was disbanded in the 1990s. We're not inventing new shit here

Well the problem was it never really worked. The community care act was suppose to enable people with mental health issues to live and be supported in the community and deinstitutionalise.

The reasons why these cases are handled by the police today is that directly after that was implemented there was an increase in sporadic acts of violence by people with mental health issues, hence the knock on that incidents are dealt with by police today.

As a lefty liberal I’m all for decriminalising mental health but it’s tough to justify if their is an increased risk to the public
 

gavinmcant

Winger
More public servants with a badge on a power trip thinking they are above the law

Make an example out of them, meant to be setting an example on how to conduct yourself and murder a clearly troubled man in cold blood

Disgusting behaviour which has become the norm in our corrupt and uneducated police, they need to start employing more educated people because any thicky can get in at present, embarrassing some of the people they take on, I know a few with nothing between the ears who are now “protecting” the public

Wouldn’t trust them with a bucket of water if my pants were on fire, nakas the lot of them

How else did you expect this to go @monkeytassle

Have a word with yourself if you think this is anything other than an abuse of power with a vulnerable person

Bird getting tonked by a copper ^
The outcome of any investigation into the incident results in Atkinson going into a medical facility not a criminal one. The police get called because there's no one else, but time and again we see evidence that this isn't the right approach for mental health and medical related incidents like this

In a man who is covered in blood and has his father by the throat threatening to kill him scenario, who would you send to begin an assessment of the situation and to then determine which agency should deal with it?
 
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