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Conning the ref

Zen Den

Zen Den

Full Back
I know the refereeing has been poor this season, but one thing that seems to be underemphasised is the rampant cheating that’s going on. It’s a hard enough job as it is, but when you throw in the cheating it’s hardly surprising standards are so poor. Seems like the football world is keen to bemoan refereeing standards and VAR, when if players just played like men and didn’t try and con the ref I’m sure standards would be a lot better.

Hardly a hot take but it does me head in how much we just accept the dark arts.
 

They have got worse because on field referees are doing less and less refereeing. So teams are doing whatever they can get away with and as we've seen often VAR will get it wrong.

I'd love to see an on field referee call both captains over before a corner and make it clear he will blow if he sees holding. Give out a couple of yellow cards for persistent offences then it will soon stop. Players will instantly have more respect for the referee as well.

That side of refereeing has gone unfortunately. The ref in the Soton Boro game last night was prime example. He's usually a premier league referee and no longer knows how to manage a game when VAR is not there
 
Blaming the referee for failing to control 22 players trying their best to cheat is a secondary criticism. The primary criticism should aimed at the players, they’re the ones to blame for all the carrying-on which goes on during a game these days, it puts you off watching. Must be a nightmare being a referee.

Watching the Big Match Revisited on ITV at the minute and, even though the quality isn’t at the same level, it’s refreshing to see matches which basically are just games of football; no gamesmanship, no time-wasting and very little cheating.
 
Nathan Gunn said:
They have got worse because on field referees are doing less and less refereeing. So teams are doing whatever they can get away with and as we've seen often VAR will get it wrong.

I'd love to see an on field referee call both captains over before a corner and make it clear he will blow if he sees holding. Give out a couple of yellow cards for persistent offences then it will soon stop. Players will instantly have more respect for the referee as well.

That side of refereeing has gone unfortunately. The ref in the Soton Boro game last night was prime example. He's usually a premier league referee and no longer knows how to manage a game when VAR is not there
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Whether it’s on-field or VAR the job is made many times harder by cheats and yet it seems to just be an accepted part of the game.
Sallycinamon said:
Blaming the referee for failing to control 22 players trying their best to cheat is a secondary criticism. The primary criticism should aimed at the players, they’re the ones to blame for all the carrying-on which goes on during a game these days, it puts you off watching. Must be a nightmare being a referee.

Watching the Big Match Revisited on ITV at the minute and, even though the quality isn’t at the same level, it’s refreshing to see matches which basically are just games of football; no gamesmanship, no time-wasting and very little cheating.
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Agree 100%. It’s the worst thing about the modern game and it’s only really mentioned in passing when evaluating a ref’s decision.
 
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Players are conditioned to cheat now. Just watch any throw in or corner decision. Even if it’s blatantly obvious to everyone in the ground which side’s player kicked the ball out of play, you can guarantee that almost as a default reaction both players will claim it’s their throw or corner.

Then the play acting or diving is farcical. Bruno Fernandes on Saturday gets brushed by the fingers of Angulo as he runs - in what other scenario does such a light contact cause a grown man to fall to the ground clutching his face! Same again in last nights playoff game when the Southampton keeper falls dramatically to the floor as if he’s been poleaxed after a light flick of a finger.
 
It is not the Refs fault.
It is the players.
But to say it is a recent thing is being disengenuous.
It has always gone on.
Pinching 5 yards on a throw, claiming off side when it's not, taking a man out with the ball, niggling behind the refs back, sneaky hand balls, waiting for a challenge, then going down.
I, and many of us, have always done it, going back 50 years in my case.

It's called getting an edge.

You try and get away with it, sometimes you do, sometimes you get caught.

Always happened and always will.
 
Im not being funny, but I want our players to do what they can within reason to win the game. It's up to the referee to officiate if they do it within the rules.

How can you expect someone not to grapple at corners when everyone else is?
 
Georgewhitt said:
It is not the Refs fault.
It is the players.
But to say it is a recent thing is being disengenuous.
It has always gone on.
Pinching 5 yards on a throw, claiming off side when it's not, taking a man out with the ball, niggling behind the refs back, sneaky hand balls, waiting for a challenge, then going down.
I, and many of us, have always done it, going back 50 years in my case.

It's called getting an edge.

You try and get away with it, sometimes you do, sometimes you get caught.

Always happened and always will.
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I know what you’re saying George but do you not think it’s worse now? The feigning injury and diving is an absolute minefield for refs these days.
 
Georgewhitt said:
It is not the Refs fault.
It is the players.
But to say it is a recent thing is being disengenuous.
It has always gone on.
Pinching 5 yards on a throw, claiming off side when it's not, taking a man out with the ball, niggling behind the refs back, sneaky hand balls, waiting for a challenge, then going down.
I, and many of us, have always done it, going back 50 years in my case.

It's called getting an edge.

You try and get away with it, sometimes you do, sometimes you get caught.

Always happened and always will.
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No team, at least in English football, worked those angles to get that edge better than Leeds United, beginning in the early to mid-60s.

The whole notion that a goalie must get rid of the ball quicker was brought in because of Gary Sprake of Leeds, who'd hold onto the ball for minutes at a time if Leeds were winning. Jackie Charlton made a career of standing on the oppsong goal line next to the goalie for corners..see where that has led..to the controversy at the West Ham V Arsenal game this past weekend for example.

The dirty tackling, time wasting, swarming the ref..they were experts. And it worked. So other teams started to do it.

They didn't know where to stop of course. It became a natural progression to bribing the ref, which those of us old enough to have been at Hull for that second replay 60 years ago know only too well.
 
Coeus said:
Im not being funny, but I want our players to do what they can within reason to win the game. It's up to the referee to officiate if they do it within the rules.

How can you expect someone not to grapple at corners when everyone else is?
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This attitude is the problem in my opinion.

Edit: you did say ‘within reason’ which I do agree with. Grappling etc is fine as it’s a contact sport and that’s for the ref to decide, but I think we can allow that without accepting all the pathetic conning thay goes on. I think we all know the difference.
 
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Players cheat. They actively try to deceive the refs into making a mistake. Claim a penalty, a corner a throw when they know it would be a mistake to award one.

As others have said, it's always gone on and probably always will.

What gets me is when a ref actually makes a genuine mistake, its the players and managers on the receiving end that are worked up into a froth - unbelievably forgetting that it is their express intention to deceive that same ref into making false judgements.
 
I simply dont belive that the refereeing has been poor. To claim something like that is poor you need to be able to point to a time when it was better. These officals are fitter, better trained and more professional. I think its at a really good standard. Trouble is now compared to yesteryear the scrutiny is off scale and people are expecting a standard which is in the main unachievable
 
Coeus said:
Idealism without pragmatism is impotent.
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I did edit my reply to you as I do agree with you in part. I think we all know the difference between an earnest and physical attempt to win the ball - which we would encourage and which can sometimes go too far - and the deliberate cheating that goes on.
 
redandwhiterob said:
I simply dont belive that the refereeing has been poor. To claim something like that is poor you need to be able to point to a time when it was better. These officals are fitter, better trained and more professional. I think its at a really good standard. Trouble is now compared to yesteryear the scrutiny is off scale and people are expecting a standard which is in the main unachievable
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You can't point to anyone who is universally agreed with as a ref, as Collina was, so without doing a ridiculous amount of work on case studying the refereeing standard, you can fairly easily point to a time it was better.
 
Zen Den said:
I know what you’re saying George but do you not think it’s worse now? The feigning injury and diving is an absolute minefield for refs these days.
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I agree it's different.

The diving has always happened.
The difference is that the game is less allowing of physicality than it was.

Commentators and pundits saying "There is contact, therefore he is right to go down" is basically saying that in the penalty area, it is a non contact sport.

The rule makers need to address that, cos at the moment the Ref jas one hand tied behind his back.
 
Even with Var it won’t stop poor decisions when players cheat. Take the penalty Leeds were awarded at Spurs the other night. Don’t get me wrong it was a high by the Spurs player, but that boot dint connect with the player and even if it did it was near the Leeds lads cheek, yet he went down and grabbed the top of his head.
 
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