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Any changes for 2nd Test 🤔


Voice of fair play said:
Well yeah most spinners better than Bashir, totally confused by his continuous selection.

However saying that Jack Leach and Hameed are hardly going to give Smith, Head, Starc and Cummins sleepless nights.

It’s says everything about their ability that the other two get selected in front of them.

It’s Hobson’s choice really as the two you mentioned would never make a difference in an Ashes imo.

In fact they both travelled and played last Ashes series down under and were terrible.

Hameed 80 runs in 8 innings last time
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Crawley will be giving Starc wet dreams before Brisbane and a pink ball
 
GordonMuchallNo1Fan said:
I've not suggested they would give anyone sleepless nights. I'm merely suggesting we apply common sense and select players based on merit and the Country Championship is a good merit indicator for selection. Hameed and Leech were top performers this year in th County Championship and therefore in my opinion should be in consideration. None of this England side will worry Australia and they've already demonstrated that with their school kid performance over the weekend. "Face fits" is what this regime is all about, there is no other explanation to it.

I'm not a fan yet however he's in Australia so they obviously think something of him and given your obsession with averages he should be in ahead of Crawley
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Is it a good merit indicator for selection????

Openers such as Robson, Burns, Sibley, Hameed and there has been others had been scoring runs for fun in county cricket but could not cut it at international level.

So not sure it is tbh.

I appreciate and respect you a big county cricket fan mate.

But think the massive difference more than there has been between county cricket and test cricket suggests it’s not a good as indicator as it may have been in the past.

It’s not about ‘ face fits’ for god sake it’s not a school.

It’s about trusting and believing in the group you have rightly or wrongly
chunkyshanhawk53 said:
Crawley will be giving Starc wet dreams before Brisbane and a pink ball
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Ok fair point :lol:
 
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Voice of fair play said:
Is it a good merit indicator for selection????

Openers such as Robson, Burns, Sibley, Hameed and there has been others had been scoring runs for fun in county cricket but could not cut it at international level.

So not sure it is tbh.

I appreciate and respect you a big county cricket fan mate.

But think the massive difference more than there has been between county cricket and test cricket suggests it’s not a good as indicator as it may have been in the past.

It’s not about ‘ face fits’ for god sake it’s not a school.

It’s about trusting and believing in the group you have rightly or wrongly

Ok fair point :lol:
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It’s absolutely a good indicator.

It’s not the only thing of course, but it’s absolutely demonstrates the ability to play at a higher level.

The exceptions exist (Vaughan, Warner etc) but generally a good test record is based on a good first class record. The best players in this England team all had and have strong first class records
 
Voice of fair play said:
Is it a good merit indicator for selection????

Openers such as Robson, Burns, Sibley, Hameed and there has been others had been scoring runs for fun in county cricket but could not cut it at international level.

So not sure it is tbh.

I appreciate and respect you a big county cricket fan mate.

But think the massive difference more than there has been between county cricket and test cricket suggests it’s not a good as indicator as it may have been in the past.

It’s not about ‘ face fits’ for god sake it’s not a school.

It’s about trusting and believing in the group you have rightly or wrongly

Ok fair point :lol:
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CC is no longer a great indicator but before discarding it you have to offer a better Indicator for selection to have any credibility. The 4 day domestic competition remains the primary selection indicator in all other test playing nations.
Why don't you defend your irrational arguments when they're challenged?
 
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Parkside said:
CC is no longer a great indicator but before discarding it you have to offer a better Indicator for selection to have any credibility. The 4 day domestic competition remains the primary selection indicator in all other test playing nations.
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Yet you have people suggesting 3 players from a relegation team
 
chunkyshanhawk53 said:
It’s absolutely a good indicator.

It’s not the only thing of course, but it’s absolutely demonstrates the ability to play at a higher level.

The exceptions exist (Vaughan, Warner etc) but generally a good test record is based on a good first class record. The best players in this England team all had and have strong first class records
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It is not as good an indicator as it was in the past imo, as the difference for a number of reasons between the respective standards has never been wider.

But yes of course I agree it’s a indicator and top class players like Brook and Root for example you could see from a mile off were going to make it at to test level.

For what it’s worth and it’s just my opinion at the moment sadly doesn’t look like many if any stand out candidates to replace any of current batsman.

Although I agree Crawley should still be dropped
 
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Voice of fair play said:
It is not as good an indicator as it was in the past imo, as the difference for a number of reasons between the respective standards has never been wider.

But yes of course I agree it’s a indicator and top class players like Brook and Root for example you could see from a mile off were going to make it at to test level.

For what it’s worth and it’s just my opinion at the moment sadly doesn’t look like many if any stand out candidates to replace any of current batsman apart from obviously Crawley
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I honestly don’t think it’s too different. Hick and Ramprakash are outliers in the previous generation

The only reason we think it’s different is because we have such a focus on attacking cricket, and super quick bowlers (for Australia)
 
Parkside said:
CC is no longer a great indicator but before discarding it you have to offer a better Indicator for selection to have any credibility. The 4 day domestic competition remains the primary selection indicator in all other test playing nations.
Why don't you defend your irrational arguments when they're challenged?
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Yeah that’s kind of my point it’s no longer a great indicator as once was like you say but yeah still the main indicator
chunkyshanhawk53 said:
I honestly don’t think it’s too different. Hick and Ramprakash are outliers in the previous generation

The only reason we think it’s different is because we have such a focus on attacking cricket, and super quick bowlers (for Australia)
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I think the gap between the test cricket and county cricket has never been bigger in terms of standards imo

Also think in the past there were a number of candidates who were more ready to step up to test standard than there is now
 
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If the argument for keeping Crawley is that there's no one else, then we aren't looking hard enough. He currently averages about 0.5 more than the much maligned Burns.

Sibley, Hameed and Lees have all enhanced their games since being dropped by England and given they've taken a punt on players like Bashir, Bethell and Hull, surely there's an opener out there taking a punt on?

McKinney is likely to be next cab off the rank but Haines has been as consistent as anyone in the county game and although age and his style will now count against him, Ben Slater has scored runs in the top division for years.

Gay was very feast or famine this season but still ended up with 10000 runs over 40, when he gets in he usually goes big.

Any new opener has small shoes to fill really, all they need to do is average higher than 30 and they'll already have improved the side.
 
Voice of fair play said:
Yeah that’s kind of my point it’s no longer a great indicator as once was like you say but yeah still the main indicator

I think the gap between the test cricket and county cricket has never been bigger in terms of standards imo

Also think in the past there were a number of candidates who were more ready to step up to test standard than there is now
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Yes,it's a consequence of central contracts not permitting England players being available and overseas players now having more lucrative opportunities elsewhere.Nevertheless the CC remains the best,albeit not an ideal,indicator.Mark back to the old test trials-Probables v Possibles.
England v England Lions was a logical warm up fixture.
 
GordonMuchallNo1Fan said:
What other indicator do you suggest?
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Well there really isn’t much else, just making the point it isn’t as good indicator as the past as standard at test level much greater than ever been.

Pitches and conditions different

And all the openers several of them who scored runs at county level all failed at test level in recent years.
 
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