West Indies Test Series

[Voice of fair play]

Great performance and very convincing series win by England.

And games really good watch played at a good rate scoring wise.

However over rates still leave a lot to be desired

 

[Steak Pie]

Some good cricket played over the series, but the Windies couldn't sustain it over a full day. When the breakdowns came they were brutal, as they often are when there's a gap in quality between two sides.

No first class cricket for 3 weeks now, at the height of summer.

 

[essex boy]

Probably being overly negative but have seen nothing in this series to suggest we are any closer to being the world's best test side

We still look like a one trick pony with that bat and bowling wise bar Wood lack wotld class options

 

[chopsfc007]

Probably being overly negative but have seen nothing in this series to suggest we are any closer to being the world's best test side

We still look like a one trick pony with that bat and bowling wise bar Wood lack wotld class options

Chris woakes is world class in England

 

[Voice of fair play]

Probably being overly negative but have seen nothing in this series to suggest we are any closer to being the world's best test side

We still look like a one trick pony with that bat and bowling wise bar Wood lack wotld class options

So I take it next we don’t do well you will point to our lack of bowling options???

Rather than slating McCullum all the time

 

[Liverpool Beachball]

Chris woakes is world class in England

Atkinson had a fantastic debut series too

 

[nowtgoodeverhappens]

Breaks my heart a little bit to see the weakness of the Windies these days. As a lad growing up in the late 70s and early 80s we all wanted to be WI players in the back lane. Personally as a 4 foot and 6 stone wet through youth I was modelling my bowling action on Joel Garner. Still the best team in Test history in my honest (and anti Aussie) opinion

 

[CW7]

Breaks my heart a little bit to see the weakness of the Windies these days. As a lad growing up in the late 70s and early 80s we all wanted to be WI players in the back lane. Personally as a 4 foot and 6 stone wet through youth I was modelling my bowling action on Joel Garner. Still the best team in Test history in my honest (and anti Aussie) opinion

The Windies were simply the best! Greenidge n haynes, then Richards came in, Lloyd furher down, then Big bird(Garner), Holding, Marshall, Walsh, what a team, all out in a session, Cricket was class as a kid! Windies were best! Hope they can turn this around!

 

[essex boy]

So I take it next we don’t do well you will point to our lack of bowling options???

Rather than slating McCullum all the time

If you read my posts I advocate McCullum being the 1 day coach.

His lack of test coaching experience has been very apprent on occasions. The side ranges from the sublime to the absurd.

His treatment of certain players leaves a lot to be desired

 

[Voice of fair play]

If you read my posts I advocate McCullum being the 1 day coach.

His lack of test coaching experience has been very apprent on occasions. The side ranges from the sublime to the absurd.

His treatment of certain players leaves a lot to be desired

Every player who has played under him has talked about the culture which allows them to flourish.

players get selected or not selected for every team, that does not mean they treated badly you can only pick 11 players.

McCullum has been nothing but a breath of fresh air into this team, and you can see they a great unit.

Apart from getting beat in India ( which everyone does) and was because as you rightly point out our lack of bowling options, especially in the spin department he has been a fantastic test appointment.

They have won games under him that Englands side in the past would not even attempted to win and settled for a draw.

Don’t know whether you did it tongue in cheek but if you really meant it when you started a thread saying he should be sacked it was absolute nonsense.

 

[essex boy]

Every player who has played under him has talked about the culture which allows them to flourish.

players get selected or not selected for every team, that does not mean they treated badly you can only pick 11 players.

McCullum has been nothing but a breath of fresh air into this team, and you can see they a great unit.

Apart from getting beat in India ( which everyone does) and was because as you rightly point out our lack of bowling options, especially in the spin department he has been a fantastic test appointment.

They have won games under him that Englands side in the past would not even attempted to win and settled for a draw.

Don’t know whether you did it tongue in cheek but if you really meant it when you started a thread saying he should be sacked it was absolute nonsense.

"Every player" - players are hardly going to come out and talk negatively about him or they won't get picked. Please don't tell me the likes of Foakes, Jimmy et al are fans of him

"A great unit" - refer to the 2005 Ashes side. Were nothing more than ordinary illustrated by 3 world class players only

 

[chopsfc007]

"Every player" - players are hardly going to come out and talk negatively about him or they won't get picked. Please don't tell me the likes of Foakes, Jimmy et al are fans of him

"A great unit" - refer to the 2005 Ashes side. Were nothing more than ordinary illustrated by 3 world class players only

Root,stokes and Brook are plus woakes in English conditions Atkinson very promising and Bashir let's be happy we lost one series away at a team everyone does, god knows what you would be like if we were actually getting beat lots

 

[Parkside]

So I take it next we don’t do well you will point to our lack of bowling options???

Rather than slating McCullum all the time

As opposed to praising him all the time which is perfectly acceptable? We're going in the right direction but,as yet, we haven't won a series against strong opposition.
Atkinson is promising but hasn't been tested abroad or against strong opposition, like wise our young spinners, both Wood and Archer have fitness issues.There are a lack of bowling options. A positive approach is to be admired but,equally, over-egging it is irresponsible as Crawley undoubtedly does. Questioning ,criticism of McCullum are valid.

 

[Voice of fair play]

"Every player" - players are hardly going to come out and talk negatively about him or they won't get picked. Please don't tell me the likes of Foakes, Jimmy et al are fans of him

"A great unit" - refer to the 2005 Ashes side. Were nothing more than ordinary illustrated by 3 world class players only

Well then if we only have 3 world class players and are ‘nothing more than a ordinary side’ you should praising the coach and captain for getting the results they have instead of ridiculously calling the coach to be sacked.

And one hand you saying players not that good but then another saying it’s the coach’s fault even though results stack up???

As opposed to praising him all the time which is perfectly acceptable? We're going in the right direction but,as yet, we haven't won a series against strong opposition.
Atkinson is promising but hasn't been tested abroad or against strong opposition, like wise our young spinners, both Wood and Archer have fitness issues.There are a lack of bowling options. A positive approach is to be admired but,equally, over-egging it is irresponsible as Crawley undoubtedly does. Questioning ,criticism of McCullum are valid.

Saying he should be sacked if he is serious is quite frankly ridiculous.

There are lack of bowling opinions and room for improvement and that’s why the coach and captain have done a great job getting the best of out of the players available.

The Ashes was a prime example imo, player did player they were better, but the coaching and the captaincy got the best out of our players imo to match them.

Constructive criticism of McCullum has been justified at times that’s fine.

The poster if serious asking for McCullum to be removed is taking nonsense

 

[Parkside]

Well then if we only have 3 world class players and are ‘nothing more than a ordinary side’ you should praising the coach and captain for getting the results they have instead of ridiculously calling the coach to be sacked.

And one hand you saying players not that good but then another saying it’s the coach’s fault even though results stack up???

Saying he should be sacked if he is serious is quite frankly ridiculous.

There are lack of bowling opinions and room for improvement and that’s why the coach and captain have done a great job getting the best of out of the players available.

The Ashes was a prime example imo, player did player they were better, but the coaching and the captaincy got the best out of our players imo to match them.

Constructive criticism of McCullum has been justified at times that’s fine.

The poster if serious asking for McCullum to be removed is taking nonsense

Haven't seen a sacking quote but I suspect it was a tongue in cheek wind up and inevitably you bite.
The persistent bowling of bouncers at a stubborn tail end and over emphasis on fast scoring indicates a one size fits all tactic which warrants and deserves criticism.

 

[Voice of fair play]

Haven't seen a sacking quote but I suspect it was a tongue in cheek wind up and inevitably you bite.
The persistent bowling of bouncers at a stubborn tail end and over emphasis on fast scoring indicates a one size fits all tactic which warrants and deserves criticism.

He started a thread on this board saying he said he should be sacked and has continued to slate him every since.

I disagree with that strongly and think he has got the best out of our players since he took over that’s just an opinion, whether you class it as bite up to you, I just class it as disagreeing with this point.

That’s not to say your point about bowling bouncers is not a good one, or that other criticism at times is not valid as it has been.

But bigger picture is imo that our current coach as done a good job as test coach imo creating a really good vibe within the team and getting the best out of the players.

I actually agree with a lot of your points about the lack of options and concerns you have, but that to me actually shows what a good job he has done with the players he has.

I also think people have short memories of where we were before he took over.

 

[Parkside]

Quite

He started a thread on this board saying he said he should be sacked and has continued to slate him every since.

I disagree with that strongly and think he has got the best out of our players since he took over that’s just an opinion, whether you class it as bite up to you, I just class it as disagreeing with this point.

That’s not to say your point about bowling bouncers is not a good one, or that other criticism at times is not valid as it has been.

But bigger picture is imo that our current coach as done a good job as test coach imo creating a really good vibe within the team and getting the best out of the players.

How much is the credit, and criticism, should be directed at Stokes. it's Stokes who appears to make the rallying speeches.Quite like the suggestion of McCullum as white ball coach where we lack a strong captain.

 

[essex boy]

Root,stokes and Brook are plus woakes in English conditions Atkinson very promising and Bashir let's be happy we lost one series away at a team everyone does, god knows what you would be like if we were actually getting beat lots

Brook is not world class. He maybe in the future but needs runs all over the world first. Far too early in his career

Every test side has promising players

Woakes is world class at home

He started a thread on this board saying he said he should be sacked and has continued to slate him every since.

I disagree with that strongly and think he has got the best out of our players since he took over that’s just an opinion, whether you class it as bite up to you, I just class it as disagreeing with this point.

That’s not to say your point about bowling bouncers is not a good one, or that other criticism at times is not valid as it has been.

But bigger picture is imo that our current coach as done a good job as test coach imo creating a really good vibe within the team and getting the best out of the players.

I actually agree with a lot of your points about the lack of options and concerns you have, but that to me actually shows what a good job he has done with the players he has.

I also think people have short memories of where we were before he took over.

Scoring at 5 an over, which in effect is Bazball, has repeatedly been found wanting. Along with the fact the coach does not acknowledge draws. He is a 1 day coach who has come long at a good time with English cricket on its arse post Silverwood

A few mesmerising wins (new coach bounce) then the gaping cracks started to appear. What are the cracks?

Have our two opening bats kicked on to be regularly scoring 100s? No, still swashbuckling run a ball 50 merchants ie, 1 day batters

Have we unearthed a test number 3 in the mould of Trott? No, we have a guy who wouldn't get in Australua 2nd XI

Root went backwards and lost sight of being Joe Root. Now he plays his game again

Stokes still has no consistency as a batsman at 6. He should be at 7 but the coach can't see it. Worrying

Bar Wood the bowling is ordinary at best.

One of the poorest English test sides in living memory, shorn of quality bowlers, littered with 1 day batters and generally rudderless in testing conditions

 

[Voice of fair play]

Quite

How much is the credit, and criticism, should be directed at Stokes. it's Stokes who appears to make the rallying speeches.Quite like the suggestion of McCullum as white ball coach where we lack a strong captain.

Tbf don’t think either of us can really know under this regime who influences it the most Stokes or McCullum.

Stokes is brilliant a real team player and one of the most selfless players around.

Quite like the idea of McCullum been involved in any of the England teams.

I think him and Stokes have created a environment where players have been able to flourish and be themselves.

Top international sport is a very pressure environment and they seem to have the knack of getting players thriving in that environment and not buckling and tightening up which happens.

It’s a philosophy I love in other walks of life and other sports, allowing people to flourish and not making them feel too much pressure,

it works sometimes it doesn’t sometimes as has happened.

But it’s worked more often than not, and a massive improvement from before they took over.

Brook is not world class. He maybe in the future but needs runs all over the world first. Far too early in his career

Every test side has promising players

Woakes is world class at home


Scoring at 5 an over, which in effect is Bazball, has repeatedly been found wanting. Along with the fact the coach does not acknowledge draws. He is a 1 day coach who has come long at a good time with English cricket on its arse post Silverwood

A few mesmerising wins (new coach bounce) then the gaping cracks started to appear. What are the cracks?

Have our two opening bats kicked on to be regularly scoring 100s? No, still swashbuckling run a ball 50 merchants ie, 1 day batters

Have we unearthed a test number 3 in the mould of Trott? No, we have a guy who wouldn't get in Australua 2nd XI

Root went backwards and lost sight of being Joe Root. Now he plays his game again

Stokes still has no consistency as a batsman at 6. He should be at 7 but the coach can't see it. Worrying

Bar Wood the bowling is ordinary at best.

One of the poorest English test sides in living memory, shorn of quality bowlers, littered with 1 day batters and generally rudderless in testing conditions

Scoring at 5 an over has not been repeatedly found out at all, in fact it has won several games that historically would have been draws.

There have been some occasions where it has been wanting granted, but the games we have won using this approach has offset them occasions.

However people can focus on the negatives rather than positives if they want.

But imo this approach the positives have far outweighed the negatives while still taking the point that on occasions they have been far to gung ho.

The previous openers of Burns, Sibley and Hameed for example were no where near scoring regularly 100s and this opening pair record miles better than any pair since Cook.

As for your last sentence sure it must be a wind up, but just to indulge in for a second.

If like you say this is ‘ one of the poorest Englands side in living memory’

Why has this side won something like 15 tests out of the last 24 under this regime?

When the previous regime had won 1 out of 17 tests.

Now that is a massive improvement by anyones standards.

Either you wrong about this been a poor side or if you right and it is a poor side.

And if you right and this is the one the poorest sides in living memory what a job this coach and captain have done to win 15 out of 24 tests, with one of the poorest sides in living memory.

Either we a good side with that record or if we poor the coach has done a astounding job?

Which one is it? Can’t have it both ways?

 

[essex boy]

Tbf don’t think either of us can really know under this regime who influences it the most Stokes or McCullum.

Stokes is brilliant a real team player and one of the most selfless players around.

Quite like the idea of McCullum been involved in any of the England teams.

I think him and Stokes have created a environment where players have been able to flourish and be themselves.

Top international sport is a very pressure environment and they seem to have the knack of getting players thriving in that environment and not buckling and tightening up which happens.

It’s a philosophy I love in other walks of life and other sports, allowing people to flourish and not making them feel too much pressure,

it works sometimes it doesn’t sometimes as has happened.

But it’s worked more often than not, and a massive improvement from before they took over.

Scoring at 5 an over has not been repeatedly found out at all, in fact it has won several games that historically would have been draws.

There have been some occasions where it has been wanting granted, but the games we have won using this approach has offset them occasions.

However people can focus on the negatives rather than positives if they want.

But imo this approach the positives have far outweighed the negatives while still taking the point that on occasions they have been far to gung ho.

The previous openers of Burns, Sibley and Hameed for example were no where near scoring regularly 100s and this opening pair record miles better than any pair since Cook.

As for your last sentence sure it must be a wind up, but just to indulge in for a second.

If like you say this is ‘ one of the poorest Englands side in living memory’

Why has this side won something like 15 tests out of the last 24 under this regime?

When the previous regime had won 1 out of 17 tests.

Now that is a massive improvement by anyones standards.

Either you wrong about this been a poor side or if you right and it is a poor side.

And if you right and this is the one the poorest sides in living memory what a job this coach and captain have done to win 15 out of 24 tests, with one of the poorest sides in living memory.

Either we a good side with that record or if we poor the coach has done a astounding job?

Which one is it? Can’t have it both ways?

What's our test record against SA, Ind & Aus? Once Key has replaced Root the side picked up. Root was not a captain not sure why you think BM takes the glory for that one

A good test coach ala Fletcher improves players. Has Pope improved? Stokes? Bairstow? Crawley?