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VAR has ruined top level football.

Sporty said:
Regarding the latter of your 2 points, see my last few posts as Wright was offside to begin with before the ball was kicked and the frame VAR shows him offside and even the frame after the ball is kicked he is still offside. The rule is the 1st contact of the ball and not when it leaves the foot.

Going back to the line width I've copied and updated an old post of mine from a long time ago.

It was changed as this 1st image is how the original offside lines worked. The lines are thicker than they were just to make it easier to see how it worked. There's 4 offside examples with blue line, the attacker kicking left to right and red line is the defender. The old way meant that only the 1st set of lines on the left was onside as the blue line wasn't nearer to the right (the goal). The other 3 used to be offside as the blue line is closer to the right. Simple enough to understand as it's whichever line is nearer the right that is taken and if there was a slight bit of blue (the 2nd one) then it was offside. This caused ructions of course and rightly so given the margin of error.

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Due to the kerfuffle what they did in 2021 was make the lines thicker for both players but also allow the two lines overlap. Initially the lines are thin and the computer make them thicker to give an advantage to the attacker. The computer works it all out. It is now no longer which line is nearest the goal but rather that there now has to be 'daylight' between the 2 lines for it to be offside. It now gives an attacker part of the margin of error and an advantage over the defender but it's clear from this thread alone that some don't even know that this advantage exists. If they meet in the middle and overlap by a gnat's knacker then it's onside.

Using 4 similar examples to the above image, the image below now has the lines are thicker and therefore more chance to overlap. The only offside of the 4 is now is the one on the right as there's a small gap between the lines, whereas before it was only the left one that would be offside as there was no overlapping allowed.

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The TV image isn't of high enough quality to show the gap, especially after someone takes a photo of a TV screen which itself will also modify the original image. I've an example of this using the offside for Coventry and just how much the image is distorted depending on how it it sourced. The problem is that when they show the lines on the TV screen, it's shit quality and from distance so the lines look small and very close. The small image below is the same image as above with the new VAR lines. It's just a lot smaller to replicate the lines on TV. Now you can see just how different it looks on TV as you can't see it as clearly at all. You can barely see the red/blue lines overlapping and by how much and can you see the gap between the 4th one?



People still go on about mm/toenails or the ball leaving the foot but a lot of that frustration is sometime unnecessary as they simply don't know how it works and what the law is.
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Are these designs for the new England flag?
 
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Safc98 said:
Two of them going to the World Cup and doing CL knockout games. We’ve had English refs do World Cup and Euros Finals in the last 15yrs. What’s your counter that other countries have better? And which countries?
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Aye because getting those jobs is entirely on how good a ref you are :lol:
 
Hendon Mad Frog said:
Not childish at all. If you genuinely think FIFA and UEFA run things on merit I don’t know what to tell you.

They are corrupt as fuck.
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So what do you base our referees being the worst on then? What’s the criteria? Anything you like. We’ll play by your rules and criteria.
 
chunkyshanhawk53 said:
I honestly don’t know.

I’d hope that offsides could be automated, within a margin of error, that gave benefit to attacker

I’d then clarify the stupid “clear and obvious” thing.

I quite like the way rugby does it it.
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Just for information, would the way that rugby does it, the way you think is so much better than the “ stupid clear and obvious thing”, have anything at all to do with this protocol, that includes the words “clear and obvious” about 20 times, including in the second and third paragraphs of its Guiding Principles?
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There’s something wrong with how it works in football, but that’s not it.
Turnip from the Tip said:
I’m not sure I follow.
I’m taking about a return to the previous interpretation of offside (pre VAR) where they’d look for daylight and if you were level you were deemed on.
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That’s never been the law. It’s what Wenger wants to be the law. There’s a good reason it isn’t the law though, as anyone who has ever actually run the line in person would realise. You cannot physically see whether or not there is daylight between two players if a third player is in front of them, which can happen quite a lot, particularly where there is a crowd of players in the box. However hard the current law is to implement by a single human pair of eyes, it is at least always in theory possible, as you can always see who is furthest forward if you are in the right position.

Turnip from the Tip said:
Advantage to the attacking team. Remember what offside was brought in for. It wasn’t for this.
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We have always had offside in football. To the extent it was “brought in” for any historical reason it was because Victorian public schoolboys from the rugby tradition thought it was jolly sporting to be in front of the ball at all.
 
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I said from before it came in, I wasn't in favour of it and I'm still not. Football is a human game, played by humans, officiated by humans and as a result human error has to be a factor.

But you can't say why does it work in cricket but not football. The Coventry goal being given offside yesterday was the same as someone being caught behind off an edge, and being given out off the slightest movement on ultra edge that neither players or umpires heard or saw. The difference is the level of debate and acceptance of the decision.
 
I think the whole thing needs be be brought back to why the rule exists in the first place, to stop one team gaining an unfair advantage.

Both feet of the attacking player should be clear of the defender before offside is called.
 
Hugh Gains said:
There’s a doing the rounds from the other angle and I fail to see how it’s offside, I know he’s off screen

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I thought it looked dodgy due to the shite quality and the way the video moved different speeds as if someone was panning the video. Low and behold here's the original full video in this video showing everything. There's a reason why people do this on Tw@tter as that video now has over 100,000 views which means someone somewhere will be getting paid.

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Again hoying some lines using 'vanishing points' shows the same thing as the other angle, Wright was offside.

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Or you can take Bissaka's part of the image and drag it along following the green lines and you get this. It's not precise but still enough to see Wright's left boot is clearly putting him offside. Shite for Coventry and the celebrations but it's the correct decision. If that was Coventry against us and that was given then there would be a 100 page thread by now with well over 90% slagging off the decision.

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SuperGerryHarrison said:
I think the whole thing needs be be brought back to why the rule exists in the first place, to stop one team gaining an unfair advantage.

Both feet of the attacking player should be clear of the defender before offside is called.
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They should introduce a timer threshold rather than a distance threshold.

If you're not continously offside +/- 2.5second of the ball being played then you're onside.
 
Sporty said:
I thought it looked dodgy due to the shite quality and the way the video moved different speeds as if someone was panning the video. Low and behold here's the original full video in this video showing everything. There's a reason why people do this on Tw@tter as that video now has over 100,000 views which means someone somewhere will be getting paid.

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Again hoying some lines using 'vanishing points' shows the same thing as the other angle, Wright was offside.

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Or you can take Bissaka's part of the image and drag it along following the green lines and you get this. It's not precise but still enough to see Wright's left boot is clearly putting him offside. Shite for Coventry and the celebrations but it's the correct decision. If that was Coventry against us and that was given then there would be a 100 page thread by now with well over 90% slagging off the decision.

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In that merge, the only body parts of the Coventry player that are in front of the body parts of the Man U player are one shin & one foot. It doesn't really give him an unfair advantage at all tbh. But rules are rules I s'pose 🤷‍♂️
 
Sporty said:
I thought it looked dodgy due to the shite quality and the way the video moved different speeds as if someone was panning the video. Low and behold here's the original full video in this video showing everything. There's a reason why people do this on Tw@tter as that video now has over 100,000 views which means someone somewhere will be getting paid.

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Again hoying some lines using 'vanishing points' shows the same thing as the other angle, Wright was offside.

Logon or register to see this image


Or you can take Bissaka's part of the image and drag it along following the green lines and you get this. It's not precise but still enough to see Wright's left boot is clearly putting him offside. Shite for Coventry and the celebrations but it's the correct decision. If that was Coventry against us and that was given then there would be a 100 page thread by now with well over 90% slagging off the decision.

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Doesn't paint Maguire in a good light that image. 6 United players and the ref all behind him when they are attacking at the death :lol:
 
SteveB said:
This is the perfect use case for var in offside calls . . .it is immediately obvious it was offside via replay . No lines. No time wasted

Intervene and over rule a totally shit linesman decision
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Which is what it was meant for, not measuring midges tits.
 
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