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Russia invading Ukraine (NEWS/UPDATES)

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Skellington said:
Germany and Netherlands opposing Ukraine being granted candidate status to join EU:

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The media across Europe has gone into the expected mode of all out support for the US led NATO alliance, but the actions of some European politicians are telling a slightly different story
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Course the Germans would be, only helping out due to pressure on them they still want that Russian gas.
 
SYB_DC said:
I hate to sound this blase, but why not? We've allowed that plenty of times before, including Stalin overrunning half of Europe.

Look, there's "it's hard to swallow" and there's "can't." This one is hard to swallow, but it's not a "can't."
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we did'nt just allow Stalin to over-run half of europe - we effectively gave him our blessings to do it in the aim of stopping Germany

and the big difference between then and now - then we could'nt do anything to stop Stalin (theres a reason why Operation Unthinkable got its name) - now we could quite easily stop Putin in his tracks

IF we think nukes are a bluff that is
 
Scotty said:
we did'nt just allow Stalin to over-run half of europe - we effectively gave him our blessings to do it in the aim of stopping Germany

and the big difference between then and now - then we could'nt do anything to stop Stalin (theres a reason why Operation Unthinkable got its name) - now we could quite easily stop Putin in his tracks

IF we think nukes are a bluff that is
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Yes, I think I addressed this already. But I agree with all of it.
 
rudd said:
Surely the compromise is a referendum in Donbass region overseen by a third party? Can't see Ukraine agreeing to not joining EU or NATO.

I think there'll be a lot more to it than the headline demands that we get to see. I suspect there'll be disagreements about the North Crimean Canal. When Ukraine blocked it up it made Crimea less worthwhile, massively shrinking the arable land. Russian forces have reopened at least part of it during the conflict according to reports. Ukraine will probably want some assurances about the Azov Sea and Kerch Strait too.
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Putin’s demands should only be a starting point. Everything can be thrashed out and compromises made on both sides, hopefully while hostilities cease.
 
Georgewhitt said:
I have always thought they stopped wars, because we all have them, and don't want to use them. Turns out I was wrong, because Putin has gone to war and everyone is scared shitless to get involved.
So they're like nipples on a bloke mate, no use at all.
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They are deterrents, not “stops”. The only thing that stops wars is people.
 
Georgewhitt said:
I have always thought they stopped wars, because we all have them, and don't want to use them. Turns out I was wrong, because Putin has gone to war and everyone is scared shitless to get involved.
So they're like nipples on a bloke mate, no use at all.
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It’s weird.

On the one hand people are saying no European leaders want to get involved with no fly zones, military assistance for Ukraine etc because war with Russia could lead to nuclear war.

Then they’re saying that if Sweden was invaded, everybody would pile in - no mention of the potential MAD that could result.

So basically, helping Ukraine militarily is unthinkable because of nukes, but helping Sweden - no bother at all, everyone piles in…

If we’re scared of Putin using nukes, then we can’t ever take him on, can we? He can do what the hell he likes. It doesn’t make a difference whether an invaded country is in NATO, the EU or any other mutual defence organisation, we can’t fight them because of nukes.

Absolutely mental.
 
Morse said:
It’s weird.

On the one hand people are saying no European leaders want to get involved with no fly zones, military assistance for Ukraine etc because war with Russia could lead to nuclear war.

Then they’re saying that if Sweden was invaded, everybody would pile in - no mention of the potential MAD that could result.

So basically, helping Ukraine militarily is unthinkable because of nukes, but helping Sweden - no bother at all, everyone piles in…

If we’re scared of Putin using nukes, then we can’t ever take him on, can we? He can do what the hell he likes. It doesn’t make a difference whether an invaded country is in NATO, the EU or any other mutual defence organisation, we can’t fight them because of nukes.

Absolutely mental.
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Pretty simple: Sweden would have allies rushing to its aid because it’s in the EU and an attack on one EU country is an attack on all.

Interesting.
 
Gillythedilf said:
Alright then out of spite let’s keep going the way we are see where it lands us.
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He takes some of your garden, you spend the next 12 months with your family, he then comes back and takes the rest of your garden, a few months later he takes over your house, he has to be stopped before he gets that far, the best option is he has an accident or we starve him out.
 
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