"investment" confirmed as a loan

Status
Not open for further replies.
Grumpy Old Man said:
If they owned the club, they can dispose of the assets as they see fit anyway. They'll also be well aware of the public backlash over Bury/Bolton. They all have reputations in the US as philanthropists - to be seen to be doing something which could affect a major football club that adversely would be severely damaging.

However, all this is hypothetical. Unless and until repayment isn't made, this is an entirely academic argument, and the longer the term of the loan, the more academic the argument is.

The only fly in the ointment is a negative pledge, meaning that Madrox can't sell shares in Sunderland to anyone else without FPP's permission. To be honest, so long as any investor could repay the loan, they'd give that, unless they wanted the club themselves.

As far as I can see, FPP are simply covering all the angles, as I'd expect any lender to do. The charge document would probably have read the same if the money had come from Barclays.
Click to expand...

This, for me. I am deeply distrustful of the current ownership, once again they have barefaced lied to us. The quicker they get out the better. However, the EFL and the FA are under serious scrutiny and pressure from FIFA and the DCMS over what has happened at Bury and Bolton and what is currently going on at Macclesfield, Oldham, Coventry, Southend and Morecambe further down the pyramid. They wouldn't dare even begin to contemplate allowing any club let alone a club the size of Sunderland get anywhere near the financial state that could potentially see a club go under. It will not happen. FPP are very successful businessmen and obviously had a fair bit of intent of owning/having a serious stake in the club so they have no incentive to let us fail. It's a dreadful situation as we see it as Donald and co gambling with the future of our club but hopefully, eventually FPP will become more directly involved and save us from the current amateur shit show.

Keep the Faith! 👊
 


Comeback_Kenwyne said:
We haven't got a pot to piss in. Donald is nowhere near rich enough to accrue the sort of liabilities associated with running a club of our stature.
Click to expand...

If that is the case then taking a loan to use on something that doesnt increase in value only enlarges the issue. I have no problem with his personal wealth but when he turns money to ahit when it comes to football, I'd rather he didn't do it with that that is secured by our assets.

Doeant make a jot of sense to me.
 
heroesof73 said:
We going to rise from the ashes just like the Phoenix
We going to rise from the ashes just like the Phoenix
Click to expand...

Will Griggs fire has been reduced to ashes . Will he be the rising Phoenix to save our season.

This is a clue that could of been used on the legendary quiz show 3-2-1with Ted Rodgers
 
Grumpy Old Man said:
I think when I was chatting to Reiver at Peterborough he said that they were trying to play poker with an off suit 2-7
Click to expand...
:lol: :lol:
sounds about right.
it’s looking more and more to me like they’ve turned up to a gunfight armed with a Swiss Army knife and a catapult.
Mansfield Mackem said:
Why would someone invest that much money wanting nothing back?
Click to expand...
That is the difference. Investment is long term without a guarantee of return. A loan is offered with an assurance of return or claim on assets should default occur.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Mickdundee said:
From what I’ve seen it’s a debenture, so strictly speaking Methven was correct in saying it’s an investment as debentures sit on the “bottom” part of the balance sheet rather than within creditors. In the UK debentures are usually secured against assets. Nothing to see here effectively.

TBF, no shares exchanged hands and FPP gave the club money, wtf did people think it was going to be? A gift?

Again, @Grumpy Old Man will know better than be since he is/was a practicing accountant for many years whereas I jumped ship to the public sector within 2 years of qualifying.
Click to expand...
That’s not strictly true in this case the debenture is security for the loan I.e a fixed and floating charge over the assets of Madrox which is therefore the shares of safc and cash at bank anything else but as it’s a holding company probably just the shares. It will be on the balance sheet of Madrox as a long term creditor - amounts not falling due within 12 months
 
Dilligaf60 said:
As you know I work for Americans, reputation isnt everything to them, it’s the only thing. Now I don’t know anywhere near as much about this as you do mate, but I’d agree wholeheartedly that these lads will not take a chance on reputational damage by allowing anything detrimental to the club. I know next to sod all but the impression I get is that Mr Donald and Mr Methven have been comprehensively outmanoeuvred.
Click to expand...
Can't agree with that. Don't know who you work for/with but I've worked for 3 American companies and they really couldn't give a shite what anyone thinks about them.
 
Texhnically as the £9m appears to have been capitalised into SAFC then the loan is to Madrox and splitting hairs it isn’t a loan to SAFC it’s a loan to Madrox only
 
Mary Hinge said:
He's the numero uno ye clot, 50% of yanks take their lead from them....am sitting in a room full of them at the minute....


Classico.....
Click to expand...
You have my deepest sympathy. And by the way they dont. You need to review the quality of the people you associate with Hairy. You’ve fallen in with the wrong crowd.
 
Grumpy Old Man said:
The loan to Madrox is $12m, apparently made on 4 November. On 6 November Sunderland issued £9m in new shares, paid in cash. At current exchange rates, that's the whole of the loan being passed down the line.
Click to expand...
So when they were fluffing it up with the announcement about it being significant and a minimum of "eight figures" they were also spinning it as actually the dollar amount and not sterling? Good stuff, Charles :lol:
 
Dilligaf60 said:
As you know I work for Americans, reputation isnt everything to them, it’s the only thing. Now I don’t know anywhere near as much about this as you do mate, but I’d agree wholeheartedly that these lads will not take a chance on reputational damage by allowing anything detrimental to the club. I know next to sod all but the impression I get is that Mr Donald and Mr Methven have been comprehensively outmanoeuvred.
Click to expand...

Or also possibly desperate for the cash?

What's the point of Sartori? wasn't he supposedly waiting in the wings if we needed a cash injection, well that's what I heard SD say on a podcast...

Oh, hang on...!
 
Last edited:
Morse said:
I don’t think there’s any other forum quite like this one!
It is very entertaining at times.
Click to expand...

Apparently, it's the most active open forum going (excluding the Stalinist moderated Liverpool and Man U ones, where any deviation from the party line gets an instant permaban), and certainly the one most welcoming of fans of most other clubs.
 
Grumpy Old Man said:
Nothing like as much, at least here in Brissle. Mind you, the City boys are happy because they're flying in the League, and Lansdown has just converted all his loans into shares.
Click to expand...

Ha! My daughter (no) is working in Brizzle on a civil service placement. Not that much of a coincidence...
...but she’s training to be an accountant! :lol:
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Back
Top