Takeover in trouble

[Grumpy Old Man]

GOM, technical one - Madrox shortened their accounting period to end July 31st '18. They then published the accounts on May 7th this year (you get 9 months after the accounting period ends to file). Now, theoretically we may not see Madrox accounts in any form until April next year, right?

Thought it was interesting, because the accounting period had been due to end on the 31st May 2019 until they did that. By filing what amount to dormant accounts for a company in existence a matter of weeks, they've avoided showing anything until April 2020, when otherwise it would have been February 2020. I wonder how much of that is based on the idea that they could effectively extend the initial accounting period to it's maximum without showing major transactions?

And we will likely know which division SAFC is in by April 30th next year. That's an interesting dynamic, because if we're promoted, people will gloss over a lot in April that they may not in February, put it that way.

It's to align with the rest of the Sunderland Group, which has an August year end. The original date was the default one for the month in which the company was formed. The alternative would have been to extend the first accounting period to August 2019. That's allowed, but it's more unusual than shortening. After the first year, you're only allowed to shorten the accounting period. At a technical level, the consolidation process if you have group members with a non-coterminous year end is a royal pain in the arse. Aligning the year ends is just a common-sense move.

 

[KittenMittens]

Yeah we do something similar, I was just wondering if it was standard to do it 3 weeks before the deadline that would have included all of the first year's transactions...

 

[Harton]

At the end of it all, Donald and Methven saw what what no one in the North East appeared to see and that was the chance to buy a distressed asset using Short and the clubs own money to buy it.
These guys are hard nosed business entrepreneurs out to make money, no problem with that as long as they put their heart and soul, along with some money, into getting us back in the big league.
I just hope they arent taking us for a ride along the way.
Cowie, Collins and Murray operated in the same financial manner, at least until Reids final days, in trying to have the club run on it's own finances. No different to the current owners.
Perhaps Drumaville and Short led us to believe money was no problem and look where that has put us.

 

[seanwharton]

At the end of it all, Donald and Methven saw what what no one in the North East appeared to see and that was the chance to buy a distressed asset using Short and the clubs own money to buy it.
These guys are hard nosed business entrepreneurs out to make money, no problem with that as long as they put their heart and soul, along with some money, into getting us back in the big league.
I just hope they arent taking us for a ride along the way.
Cowie, Collins and Murray operated in the same financial manner, at least until Reids final days, in trying to have the club run on it's own finances. No different to the current owners.
Perhaps Drumaville and Short led us to believe money was no problem and look where that has put us.

The first bit is absolutely fine however the narrative has been different and at best if I’m being fair confusing

 

[Grumpy Old Man]

Yeah we do something similar, I was just wondering if it was standard to do it 3 weeks before the deadline that would have included all of the first year's transactions...

I suspect that someone forgot to do it.

 

[ilovehorswill]

The shares cost £15m (actually £12m after a negotiation with Short later in the year as Donald and Methven clairified in a podcast a month ago) but Donald paid £5m cash and then loaned the rest of that money from the club, a loan that we have no information on. All we know is that he didn't make the balancing payment out of his own cash, he loaned £9.6m from the club.

Also, I urge you again to think of the deal holistically. The SBC loan is absolutely relevant to how much Donald paid in shares, as he agreed that rather than pay money he wanted to use to run the club to Short as an acquisition up front, Short could simply defer some of the debt he was writing off and it would effectively be paid by parachute payments. In effect, Donald just cut the middle man out of that process by paying it directly to SBC. The reason? Because it would definitely have been difficult to pay Short directly from a parachute payment, so instead they paid off a liability he had agreed to clear instead.



I think you should clarify if you have time, as I know you've been over it a hundred times.

My only worry with you, GOM, and I hope you understand what I mean by this, is that you are now a bit closer to this than you were. I know you've met the people involved, and I also know that they know who you are and how respected your characterisation can be. Yes, I can be cynical, but I work on the basis of following the money. My assessment (and not a completely uninformed one) is that Donald has obtained an awful lot for a disproportionately low amount of personal debt, and at every turn where he may reasonably be expected to pay out of his own pocket (paying off the balance of his shares, funding short term shortfall mid-season) he has loaned money either from the club or on behalf of it.



It hadn't as of June, when Charlie and Stewart said exactly that. They tried to gloss over it as 'phantom', but it's a very real debt to the club and was used to finance the acquisition of the shares from Short.

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[The Rat]

Interesting seeing who’s liked this post. @Speedy1976 I thought you said you generally liked and had no problem with the owners yesterday when you were spreading those malicious rumours about McLaughlin?

good god

You really need to look at what you're posting at the minute, it's mental.

Genuinely take a step back from the situation and really look, you must be a smart bloke, you aren't coming across well

 

[Julio]

Irony overload about to explode

 

[The Rat]

Irony overload about to explode

accusing Speedy of being malicious is bad, he is one of the best posters on here

Just shows nobody is safe from the wrath of the posters up Stewart Donald's arse, never seen anything like it

 

[Howard the Duck]

good god

You really need to look at what you're posting at the minute, it's mental.

Genuinely take a step back from the situation and really look, you must be a smart bloke, you aren't coming across well

I’m flattered you’re looking back through my posts (presumably looking (unsuccessfully) for me ‘going on repeatedly about how good the finances are’ which you incorrectly claimed).

 

[The Rat]

I’m flattered you’re looking back through my posts (presumably looking (unsuccessfully) for me ‘going on repeatedly about how good the finances are’ which you incorrectly claimed).

I’m not I was reading the stuff about the keeper and couldn’t believe your stuff

 

[Howard the Duck]

I’m not I was reading the stuff about the keeper and couldn’t believe your stuff

You’ve bumped a few of my older posts on threads that you’ve already contributed to (many times) since the posts were made. Honestly it’s fine though, I’m flattered.

 

[Black Cat Gypsy]

I’m flattered you’re looking back through my posts (presumably looking (unsuccessfully) for me ‘going on repeatedly about how good the finances are’ which you incorrectly claimed).

TBH to say @Speedy1976 was spreading malicious rumours about McLaughlin was a bit of the top. The guy is a good poster and is honest with his information. It wasn't malicious. He was reporting what he had heard.

 

[Deleted User 18963]

TBH to say @Speedy1976 was spreading malicious rumours about McLaughlin was a bit of the top. The guy is a good poster and is honest with his information. It wasn't malicious. He was reporting what he had heard.

Good lad is speedy

 

[Bilbo]

@kittenmitten I'm not an accountant but the majority of what you're describing reminds me of what the Glazers did at man utd's when they first took over. There was a lot of noise then & nothing came of those allegations

 

[seanwharton]

@kittenmitten I'm not an accountant but the majority of what you're describing reminds me of what the Glazers did at man utd's when they first took over. There was a lot of noise then & nothing came of those allegations

I think the point is that it’s against Donald’s narrative

 

[Howard the Duck]

TBH to say @Speedy1976 was spreading malicious rumours about McLaughlin was a bit of the top. The guy is a good poster and is honest with his information. It wasn't malicious. He was reporting what he had heard.

Aye, malicious was the wrong word in hindsight.

 

[Bilbo]

I think the point is that it’s against Donald’s narrative

If you're saying Donald has been very immature considering he's an experienced business man, then I agree

 

[hertsmackem]

Anyone care to update a few lines about what is going on, is the takeover on/off are we financially fucked etc?

Tks in advance

 

[Kevsgreat]

If it ends well and we go up this season, new investment comes in and Donald and co make a few quid, nobody's arsed about how they paid for the club. It's looking like that was their plan all along but last season knocked it.

You wouldn't care would you? I wouldn't. Could've been worse and all that. Short would've taken as much as he could get back out of it all either way.

The way they've gone about it isn't as transparent and straightforward as we were first told though. That's the part that sticks a bit. They haven't lied, but they've not told the whole truth until directly asked. How many other questions have they answered in the same way?

And if we don't go up and it turns out they spent more of the club's money on buying the club than anything else? Given the concern for individual pay packets on here that would be more worrying.