What's the difference between Sunderland & Newcastle?

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Because it’s a class city. Lived here since 1999 when I went to uni.

Few weeks ago I went to seaburn and Roker during the day. Had a canny day out with the missus and bairns.

She started looking at properties in Roker and seaburn and couldn’t believe what you can get for the money they were asking. Similar type properties in Newcastle’s more affluent areas go for nearly double.

Difference I think is the city centre. Both cities have absolute shitholes as well as really nice areas. Sunderland town centre is an embarrassment tbh.
 


EDGE said:
What do you mean? Land banking by whom? For what purpose?
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In the past big supermarkets have bought land/properties around their stores so they can control how much competition there is.

Or investors just buying some land and holding it until the area is more desirable, value of the land goes up and they sell it. Developing something on the site requires more capital up front with the risk that whatever you do isn't successful.

I've no idea if any of this is happening around Sunniside or anywhere else in Sunderland. From the outside looking in (I grew up in Gateshead, live in Manchester) I get the impression there isn't a lot of ambition to develop or improve Sunderland and any time someone does show it they get shouted down by nymbies or cynics or people with chips on their shoulder saying 'that's the kind of thing the tossers in Newcastle would do'.
 
mikemanc said:
In the past big supermarkets have bought land/properties around their stores so they can control how much competition there is.

Or investors just buying some land and holding it until the area is more desirable, value of the land goes up and they sell it. Developing something on the site requires more capital up front with the risk that whatever you do isn't successful.

I've no idea if any of this is happening around Sunniside or anywhere else in Sunderland. From the outside looking in (I grew up in Gateshead, live in Manchester) I get the impression there isn't a lot of ambition to develop or improve Sunderland and any time someone does show it they get shouted down by nymbies or cynics or people with chips on their shoulder saying 'that's the kind of thing the tossers in Newcastle would do'.
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Definitely right about ambition. I notice that if I suggest we go for a drink in different pubs I get the brush off. Strange attitude.

They would rather have 10 pints in Wetherspoons than have 5 in a nicer place.

To be fair they don't have a lot of money.
 
EDGE said:
Definitely right about ambition. I notice that if I suggest we go for a drink in different pubs I get the brush off. Strange attitude.

They would rather have 10 pints in Wetherspoons than have 5 in a nicer place.

To be fair they don't have a lot of money.
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I get that, but one thing follows the other. As others have said if you can get the jobs into the town, try and find a niche for the city to bring better paying jobs, people have more spending power, property value increases etc. But you need a spark or two and to build on the momentum not have some neanderthals on the sidelines asking what you think you're playing at (I'm in no way suggesting these are your mates! :)).
 
mikemanc said:
I get that, but one thing follows the other. As others have said if you can get the jobs into the town, try and find a niche for the city to bring better paying jobs, people have more spending power, property value increases etc. But you need a spark or two and to build on the momentum not have some neanderthals on the sidelines asking what you think you're playing at (I'm in no way suggesting these are your mates! :)).
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They are to some extent. Often it is those that moved away and have returned that have less parochial views, they didn't.

Maybe it's linked to education. Those that move generally have better qualifications and meet new people and experience different things.
 
Sunderland city centre is a joke, Newcastle is lovely. Its just bigger and better in every way. Sad but true
 
EDGE said:
What do you mean? Land banking by whom? For what purpose?
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Land banking - Wikipedia

I know someone ITK who suggested lots of land around Sunderland has been land banked for future development, especially around the port....e.g. The old littlewoods site as it could be used store cars for Nissan.
I've heard ABB down deptford might be used for this also
 
citybythesea said:
Land banking - Wikipedia

I know someone ITK who suggested lots of land around Sunderland has been land banked for future development, especially around the port....e.g. The old littlewoods site as it could be used store cars for Nissan.
I've heard ABB down deptford might be used for this also
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Interesting. ABB is still there isn't it? Are they thinking of moving?
 
That Calders site would not stand a chance if it were in Sunderland, the ground conditions are attrocious and it will cost 10s of millions before the developer sees pound note number 1 come back in, thats a lot for anyone to have on their balance sheet for such a long time.

Barratt had the site for years having picked it up at the top of the market and eventually cut their loses for these reasons as that isn't how they operate, they want quick in and out sites with good return on capital invested, same as most developers.

People need to accept that Sunderland is a very different place to Newcastle, at least in Newcastle you can command decent values so that it stacks up in the long run and more speculative/less risk averse operators who are more willing to have those finance costs on their books for such a long time and/or are willing to accept a lower than 20% developer profit in the end. Apartments (and non residential uses) on a comparible site in Sunderland would be lucky to go for half of what they will get in Newcastle.

So if i had to sum it up in two words, land values.

I'd still be surprised if that Newcastle scheme happens with all the uncertainty around brexit though, even if it gets planning which I think is far from certain.
 
Get the offices built on the Vaux, A food quarter on the crowtree site, new train station & decent apartments on the derelict land around Sunniside. If only it were that easy.
 
Location location location
Every city in the world benefits from good transport links and Newcastle has better ones. There’s other reasons but imo transport is the most important
 
the difference is geography and history. newcastle has been able to transition the quay area from port to residential/entertainment very easily as the city and quay have always had some connection and better access and the heavier industry was further up or down river, whereas there's never been the same connection between sunderland city and the river & harbour area as they were more compact and heavily industrialised.

sunderland would be a much better city if the city centre and the river & harbour area were more accessible, connected and open to commercial and entertainment opportunities i reckon. easier said than done of course.
 
elder said:
the difference is geography and history. newcastle has been able to transition the quay area from port to residential/entertainment very easily as the city and quay have always had some connection and better access and the heavier industry was further up or down river, whereas there's never been the same connection between sunderland city and the river & harbour area as they were more compact and heavily industrialised.

sunderland would be a much better city if the city centre and the river & harbour area were more accessible, connected and open to commercial and entertainment opportunities i reckon. easier said than done of course.
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The Tall ships event this year was a real eye-opener as to the potential the docks and the East end on the south side have were they to be redeveloped/commercialised.
 
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