What's the difference between Sunderland & Newcastle?

Lewberry pie said:
There isn't enough money in the north east to support Sunderland and Newcastle, as the trains and buses and roads are set up to support Newcastle, it makes sense that the investment goes there.

What that doesn't mean however is that sunderlands centre should have been allowed to fall to bits and look shit, Sunderland should be seen as a residential area but with a nice town centre for locals to enjoy nice surroundings in the historical buildings with a focus on places to eat, drink and other lesuire activities, sunniside is an attempt to do that but it should be in the centre instead.
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Sunniside is fairly central.
 


sunderland is a blue collar manufacturing city

also.. a major difference is that sunderland has over the years been built like a doughnut , everything is on the outskirts with very little in the middle , there is hardly anyone works in the city centre and that is the major factor for the towns decline IMO, until that changes it will remain in steady decline
 
Ben Gardner said:
with that in mind, do you think footfall is the (at least, the main) answer?

certainly works for Newcastle, never seen it quiet / shops are always busy / very few boarded up.
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i cant remember the question :lol:
Answer to our regeneration of the City ctr ? I suppose it is but a few projects want change history and how we are different
i was over for a pint a few weeks back and it was a bit of a shock in a good way.I used to drink over there as a young lad in the 80s etc and it always had more going on but difference now is massive.I jumped off the metro at about 10.30pm and the town was dead ,Saturday night

Lewberry pie said:
There isn't enough money in the north east to support Sunderland and Newcastle, as the trains and buses and roads are set up to support Newcastle, it makes sense that the investment goes there.

What that doesn't mean however is that sunderlands centre should have been allowed to fall to bits and look shit, Sunderland should be seen as a residential area but with a nice town centre for locals to enjoy nice surroundings in the historical buildings with a focus on places to eat, drink and other lesuire activities, sunniside is an attempt to do that but it should be in the centre instead.
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Its only 2 minutes walk.People are leaving Sunderland to travel 12 miles for a drink .We don't help ourselves really,people try stuff and its gone before you know it.Restaurant chains,ideas for bars,venues,gig nights etc ,Sunniside is still trying to get going 10 years in .Seems the people we need in the city to change things go elsewhere which leaves the old ,don't like change,how much ?!! crowd in the bars that look different but all play the same music to the same crowds .
 
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Ben Gardner said:
This isn't a joke and is meant to be a serious question.

Plan for £250m urban village on Newcastle Quayside | Construction Enquirer

The above article outlines basic plans for a £250m development on derelict land on Newcastle quayside.

Great news for them, loads of jobs being generated, some new new homes and loads of commercial stuff going on (potentially)

But when I read stuff like this, it's galling to think about the negative comments that would emanate from Mackems if such a thing was mooted for Sunderland - despite us having a near-identical plot of land ripe for development by the Wear.

Geographically, Newcastle is at a massive advantage with transport infrastructure but there must be more to it than that.

So, with this in mind (and going back to my original question), is it the local council? Is the place just better connected? Do they have a more condensed population? Is the demographic considered higher? Do businesses and investors buy into their history? Is it because their city centre architecture is finer?

I've grown out of a football-based bias against Newcastle and I really don't mind some of them, but for years I've always wondered how they seem to get the rub of the green, so-to-speak.

Investment, transport, music venues, even down to stuff like festivals n that.

Let's be honest, the people are no better or no worse than us. They're a traditionally working-class populous that expanded in the last century on heavy industry - and now working in tech and service industries (more-so than shipyards & pits)

We have so much going for us a s city, and we do seem to be going places (the City of Culture 2021 bid showed that), but we could be so much better. It's easy to say, "ignore them, focus on Wearside" but when developments like this quayside thing get unadulterated support from business and the public, it's a little annoying.
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Mmmmm What's the difference?

They've got a better track record of attracting external investment and seeing it through to completion, god knows where the cash is coming from for all the apartments....Maybe UAE, China, Russia???.
The road and rail links are on major routes. (A1, A19, and the east coast mainline). Newcastle-centric development bodies have favoured development there, along with a better record of attracting European money. Theyve got a better marketing partnership in the NGI and their council works closely with its two universities to attract business into the urban core of newcastle. Couple that with a conurbation consisting of towns close enough to travel to newcastle rather than support their own economies....Shields, Jarrow, Hebburn, Gateshead etc.

Sunderland as a de-industrialised area has failed to adapt its city centre, by contrast its hollowed out the central urban core. What's remaining in the centre is mostly focused on retail which hasnt gave the city centre economy any resilience to change e.g. If the retail sector ever took a nose dive, like we're seeing now. It has shot itself in the foot by positioning office accommodation on the periphery, i.e. Rainton Bridge and Doxford park, as both these would have increased footfall of the city centre. Its also missed a trick in developing partnerships and road and rail links southwards out of the city centre. E.g if the south side of the port can be linked to the A19 and rail, it wouldn't mean the link road between the A1231 and A1080 will become a bottleneck. Although Nissans proximity to the A1231 means that road is the only realistic route for transporting cars out of Sunderland.
The pace of development remains slow. The Vaux site is nearing 20 years since the brewery shut and the city was without a cinema for 10 years.
Personally I think Sunderland should improve roads between the city centre and A19 (i.e. A1080) and also look to increase the amount of people living in the city centre. Along with lobbying for better services/ contections to the east coast mainline via the Durham coast line.
 
RichD said:
Newcastle has had it their own way in the northeast since the 80's and unfortunately we are still playing catch-up
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In what way ? its canny different place to when i drank there ,very little big market left,haymarket pretty ,much gone .Its adapted and changed but its done it with a constant demand by the numbers visiting .Look at the gay scene,they embraced while we are still in denial
 
JAZZMANB said:
In what way ? its canny different place to when i drank there ,very little big market left,haymarket pretty ,much gone .Its adapted and changed but its done it with a constant demand by the numbers visiting .Look at the gay scene,they embraced while we are still in denial
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That's the key isn't it? Numbers.

If 50% of 100 wanted change, that's little demand.
If 50% of 10,000 wanted change, that's quite a demand.
 
Ben Gardner said:
That's the key isn't it? Numbers.

If 50% of 100 wanted change, that's little demand.
If 50% of 10,000 wanted change, that's quite a demand.
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Yeah,you can play the risk card with bigger numbers .I Read all those long posts about investment and this body and that but its an easy call to make throwing money into a city thats full of people spending money .Saying that the demise of Whitley bay will have brought that money back from the coast.The Jesmond thing was weird too,it took off from hype really.All the bars in the city and they were flocking up there instead .The hype never works in Sunderland thats for sure

You do wonder if there was a massive expansion across Vaux then down under Ghyll bridge to the river wether it would take off,bars ,small shopping mall,leisure etc.Rather than take people from the town it should bring more people in to both areas .
 
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Govt spending in large urban cities. Whereas we got bugger all.

Interview any Govt politician in the NE and they always have the Quayside in the background. "Look what we built!"
 
JAZZMANB said:
In what way ? its canny different place to when i drank there ,very little big market left,haymarket pretty ,much gone .Its adapted and changed but its done it with a constant demand by the numbers visiting .Look at the gay scene,they embraced while we are still in denial
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Tyne & wear metro, Newcastle airport, One Northeast, Britsh rail, BBC & ITN National media centres. Everything has been geared towards Tyneside..
 

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