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Fans of other clubs

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chave said:
Sunderland is too good a chance to pass up, if you have the money to throw away in the short term, but he doesn't have that. My main reasons for thinking he's naive is that he's brought in a manager who doesn't know the English league, but will be expected to hit the ground running, and that he's dependant on getting the going rate from player sales and not having to pay up contracts, despite the players and other clubs having all the bargaining power.
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I think you need to actually listen to him a bit more then. For all the Twitter shite and some of the bluster with agents he's not trying to chuck money at it, but is looking at areas of the club, mostly player recruitment of course, and the finances involved and asking why so much has been spent or why we were offering so much for players just prior to him coming in. If anything he's trying to cut our cloth for League One and our income not simply chuck money at it, with an eye on investment further down the line - this is long overdue.

As for getting the going rate from player sales and not having to pay up contracts - why wouldn't we do that? Stand firm instead of being walked allover, but being realistic. Should we follow the Pompey model that got you lot into shit or the model that has got us into where we are now or last season, when we were paying two 8m/9m players on loan in France 30%+ of their wages each week, which was costing us from memory about 120k a month?

Sure we're trying to get decent fees on players who have value, or not paying up fees when clubs want players - did you miss Jason Steel depart the club yesterday for nothing (after paying 500k for him last season) and no contribution from us? If we were doing as you say, then we'd have been holding out for a fee and cutting our nose off to spite our face - clearly it's being done a bit more cleverly than you suggest. Last season we'd have still been paying him.

Going back to agents the club is in a mess and is having agents dictate to us. In the PL they're a necessary evil, at this level not so much. Maybe he's a bit naïve in his comments and how open he's been but he's not directly criticising individual players, just like they're not directly coming out and asking for a transfer. He's putting the onus onto them and given wht's gone on and what's going on I'm absolutely ecstatic about it because we've been an easy touch for too long and people like Margaret Byrne have caused enough f***ing damage here without dictating to us through several of our players.
 
not sure 'naive' is a word i would use to be honest, at no point has he ever tried to 'big' himself or his plans up and has been honest enough to admit that he has enough to push the club forward for a couple of seasons and then will most likely need the financial clout sartori can provide, hopefully this will mean we will be at least capable of competing in the championship by then.

it would be completely negative to throw money around and allow players and agents to dictate to the club especially in div 3, if he allowed that to happen then the demands will be even more crazy in the championship (the premier is a different kettle of fish altogether) so by taking a stand now and having people realise that there is no easy ride or easy money to be had at the club now is a very good start...the down side is that we may lose out on a player or two or be stuck with a couple that do not want to be here, he has stated the current wages can be covered so if it means running a contract down to be rid of them he is able to do that, while obviously this is of no benefit to him or the club it removes a bit more of the player/agent stranglehold.
 
Perryqhill said:
I think you need to actually listen to him a bit more then. For all the Twitter shite and some of the bluster with agents he's not trying to chuck money at it, but is looking at areas of the club, mostly player recruitment of course, and the finances involved and asking why so much has been spent or why we were offering so much for players just prior to him coming in. If anything he's trying to cut our cloth for League One and our income not simply chuck money at it, with an eye on investment further down the line - this is long overdue.

As for getting the going rate from player sales and not having to pay up contracts - why wouldn't we do that? Stand firm instead of being walked allover, but being realistic. Should we follow the Pompey model that got you lot into shit or the model that has got us into where we are now or last season, when we were paying two 8m/9m players on loan in France 30%+ of their wages each week, which was costing us from memory about 120k a month?

Sure we're trying to get decent fees on players who have value, or not paying up fees when clubs want players - did you miss Jason Steel depart the club yesterday for nothing (after paying 500k for him last season) and no contribution from us? If we were doing as you say, then we'd have been holding out for a fee and cutting our nose off to spite our face - clearly it's being done a bit more cleverly than you suggest. Last season we'd have still been paying him.

Going back to agents the club is in a mess and is having agents dictate to us. In the PL they're a necessary evil, at this level not so much. Maybe he's a bit naïve in his comments and how open he's been but he's not directly criticising individual players, just like they're not directly coming out and asking for a transfer. He's putting the onus onto them and given wht's gone on and what's going on I'm absolutely ecstatic about it because we've been an easy touch for too long and people like Margaret Byrne have caused enough f***ing damage here without dictating to us through several of our players.
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Agreed that cutting your cloth accordingly is the right thing to do. You can be self sufficient in League One and make a profit and, going forward, as more and more clubs get in debt, a big club with a strong fan base and no debt should have an advantage.

Using Pompey as an example, we suffered the most from owners who misunderstood the fundamentals of football business. We've started turning things around slowly once we realised we had to play with the system as opposed to against it.

As you say, some of his comments appear to be naive - the proof of this will come in a few months. His hearts certainly in the right place, but I'm not sure he has a realistic support structure to help him achieve his goals .
 
chave said:
Agreed that cutting your cloth accordingly is the right thing to do. You can be self sufficient in League One and make a profit and, going forward, as more and more clubs get in debt, a big club with a strong fan base and no debt should have an advantage.

Using Pompey as an example, we suffered the most from owners who misunderstood the fundamentals of football business. We've started turning things around slowly once we realised we had to play with the system as opposed to against it.

As you say, some of his comments appear to be naive - the proof of this will come in a few months. His hearts certainly in the right place, but I'm not sure he has a realistic support structure to help him achieve his goals .
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As he said in the interview yesterday - previously we had a owner in London distanced from the club in more ways than one who was writing cheques and a Chief Exec up here trying to run things. There was no one asking why 100k wasn't costing 10k and such like and money was being spent without question. He also said speaking to Short he felt that the people he got most of his appointments at the club wrong, so hopefully someone present and interested over things is a start.

Financially we're still in the middle of a shit storm with money due in, but money due out immediately too. He's hinted that whilst we could keep several high earners realistically he couldn't afford to underwrite 20m losses for more than a couple of years and so we're doing all we can to correct that, but by the sounds of what he said our wage bill should already be down to a level more reasonable than most of us thought given we've another two years of parachute payments, but it does need more work. He did say that we wouldn't spend much at all in this league, but what we would spend would still likely put us up there as one of if not the highest spender and the hope is that if we are promoted soon, then it would maybe be the point where Sartori and his family become more interested or even further along the line that Sartori maybe his money, but certainly influence and contacts would be looking for major investment. I may be wrong but it didn't seem to me as if he feels like he'll be here as owner/chairman for the long term if things go as planned, more a correction job.

As well as the negative stuff he mentioned about agents he also spoke about Rodwell and his agent and that they'd been good to deal with and seemingly realistic and that should be sorted soon. So don't get me wrong - there's an awful lot of damage been done and an awful long way to go
 
Perryqhill said:
I think you need to actually listen to him a bit more then. For all the Twitter shite and some of the bluster with agents he's not trying to chuck money at it, but is looking at areas of the club, mostly player recruitment of course, and the finances involved and asking why so much has been spent or why we were offering so much for players just prior to him coming in. If anything he's trying to cut our cloth for League One and our income not simply chuck money at it, with an eye on investment further down the line - this is long overdue.

As for getting the going rate from player sales and not having to pay up contracts - why wouldn't we do that? Stand firm instead of being walked allover, but being realistic. Should we follow the Pompey model that got you lot into shit or the model that has got us into where we are now or last season, when we were paying two 8m/9m players on loan in France 30%+ of their wages each week, which was costing us from memory about 120k a month?

Sure we're trying to get decent fees on players who have value, or not paying up fees when clubs want players - did you miss Jason Steel depart the club yesterday for nothing (after paying 500k for him last season) and no contribution from us? If we were doing as you say, then we'd have been holding out for a fee and cutting our nose off to spite our face - clearly it's being done a bit more cleverly than you suggest. Last season we'd have still been paying him.

Going back to agents the club is in a mess and is having agents dictate to us. In the PL they're a necessary evil, at this level not so much. Maybe he's a bit naïve in his comments and how open he's been but he's not directly criticising individual players, just like they're not directly coming out and asking for a transfer. He's putting the onus onto them and given wht's gone on and what's going on I'm absolutely ecstatic about it because we've been an easy touch for too long and people like Margaret Byrne have caused enough f***ing damage here without dictating to us through several of our players.
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Spot on,Perry lad.

Perryqhill said:
As he said in the interview yesterday - previously we had a owner in London distanced from the club in more ways than one who was writing cheques and a Chief Exec up here trying to run things. There was no one asking why 100k wasn't costing 10k and such like and money was being spent without question. He also said speaking to Short he felt that the people he got most of his appointments at the club wrong, so hopefully someone present and interested over things is a start.

Financially we're still in the middle of a shit storm with money due in, but money due out immediately too. He's hinted that whilst we could keep several high earners realistically he couldn't afford to underwrite 20m losses for more than a couple of years and so we're doing all we can to correct that, but by the sounds of what he said our wage bill should already be down to a level more reasonable than most of us thought given we've another two years of parachute payments, but it does need more work. He did say that we wouldn't spend much at all in this league, but what we would spend would still likely put us up there as one of if not the highest spender and the hope is that if we are promoted soon, then it would maybe be the point where Sartori and his family become more interested or even further along the line that Sartori maybe his money, but certainly influence and contacts would be looking for major investment. I may be wrong but it didn't seem to me as if he feels like he'll be here as owner/chairman for the long term if things go as planned, more a correction job.

As well as the negative stuff he mentioned about agents he also spoke about Rodwell and his agent and that they'd been good to deal with and seemingly realistic and that should be sorted soon. So don't get me wrong - there's an awful lot of damage been done and an awful long way to go
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And again.
 
Perryqhill said:
As he said in the interview yesterday - previously we had a owner in London distanced from the club in more ways than one who was writing cheques and a Chief Exec up here trying to run things. There was no one asking why 100k wasn't costing 10k and such like and money was being spent without question. He also said speaking to Short he felt that the people he got most of his appointments at the club wrong, so hopefully someone present and interested over things is a start.

Financially we're still in the middle of a shit storm with money due in, but money due out immediately too. He's hinted that whilst we could keep several high earners realistically he couldn't afford to underwrite 20m losses for more than a couple of years and so we're doing all we can to correct that, but by the sounds of what he said our wage bill should already be down to a level more reasonable than most of us thought given we've another two years of parachute payments, but it does need more work. He did say that we wouldn't spend much at all in this league, but what we would spend would still likely put us up there as one of if not the highest spender and the hope is that if we are promoted soon, then it would maybe be the point where Sartori and his family become more interested or even further along the line that Sartori maybe his money, but certainly influence and contacts would be looking for major investment. I may be wrong but it didn't seem to me as if he feels like he'll be here as owner/chairman for the long term if things go as planned, more a correction job.

As well as the negative stuff he mentioned about agents he also spoke about Rodwell and his agent and that they'd been good to deal with and seemingly realistic and that should be sorted soon. So don't get me wrong - there's an awful lot of damage been done and an awful long way to go
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Agree with everything you've said. I stick by my original comment - I think he's been naive, and I think that will come to pass in the coming months, however I hope that isn't the case. Even if he is currently naive, that will soon be knocked out of him and you'll still be too big for League One.
 
chave said:
Because if he couldn't do better with Eastleigh, he's not ready for the challenges of Sunderland.
.
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You do know the majority of chairman in the premier league haven’t chaired a club previously don’t you?
And do better?
I live near Eastleigh and I think every person who supports them would say SD did a brilliant job.
 
it's refreshing to hear him call out agents for what they are etc.. but he needs to tone it in for me like

especially in regards to naming other clubs players so openly. we'd be going mental if another clubs owner was saying the same about players contracted to us

actually no wouldn't we'd be jumping for joy someone was actually interested in the useless twats. but that's not the point
 
Headingley Slog Fest said:
Are admiring Stewart Donald and his openness about the situation at Sunderland, he’s stood up to agents and players, he’s basically puffed his chest out and spoke on behalf of the fans. The mess that the previous regime left the club is shocking, it’s just pure negligence and disgraceful on how they ran the club.

People are taking note of us now and are looking at their own clubs to follow example, it’s refreshing to see and I’m over the moon we have a regime in who look organised and actually give a fuck about us and the club.
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No they're not.

As a Leeds fan who's been lead down the garden path time and time again, we know more than anyone talk is cheap. 'Debt free' more than likely means your debt has been 'moved'. No other fans even know who the bloke is. You're allowed to be giddy but until the season starts keep it in your trousers eh.
 
Spartan said:
no transfer fees, no agents , players who just want to play
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But as said , the majority of chairman have had zero experience.
At least he’s had some. I can’t see how some experience would make you out of your depth compared to zero experience.
 
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