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Benitez Future In Doubt Over Failure to Secure Key Signings

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The Fish said:
:lol: because I think that we'll finish above three teams. I think there'll be at least one of the promoted sides below us, if not both of them. I think that the other place(s) could be taken by any of a few teams in the top flight. Someone in the Premier League will have a difficult season, a key signing flops, a key player gets injured, they overachieved last season? Dunno, but there's a few teams in the PL that weren't a great deal better than Hull, Boro and yourselves.

I think we'll sign some players to address key areas before the window shuts and I have faith in the manager to get more out of the group than simply the sum of their parts.
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You see Sunderland fans would say "hopefully" in this scenario, whereas you always say "expect".
 

The Fish said:
The last one is certainly disputable and not at fact, but an opinion.

The others fall short under scrutiny as the broader picture explains much of the criticism your level at Benitez and Newcastle is little more than partisan bias.
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Partisan bias? Really?

10 points in 9 games is fact. Failing to beat any of your 3 rivals is fact. He failed in his remit of keeping you up. Relegation. Fact.
Receiving over £70m on that trio, and spending around £57m. Fact. Hysteria last summer. Fact.

Decent manager? The only one where opinion comes into it, and that's my honest opinion. He's certainly not the great manager you all seem to be proclaiming.
 
The Fish said:
That's demonstrably untrue.
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I've pulled you up on this "expect" before. Certainly the mood on this board, and the Sunderland fans I know are always more hopeful, than expectant.

I'm from Shields, I've loads of mag mates and cousins. I'm not a rabid hater of Newcastle. However there's definitely a difference in outlook between the two sets of supporters
 
G Force said:
Partisan bias? Really?

10 points in 9 games is fact. Failing to beat any of your 3 rivals is fact. He failed in his remit of keeping you up. Relegation. Fact.
Receiving over £70m on that trio, and spending around £57m. Fact. Hysteria last summer. Fact.

Decent manager? The only one where opinion comes into it, and that's my honest opinion. He's certainly not the great manager you all seem to be proclaiming.
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No, you're focussing on the wrong parts of your claims. e.g. you're misrepresenting the reaction to Benitez as hysteria. I would categorise the outpouring of affection from the fans as little more than us knowing a good thing when we see it, and being relieved after years of shit.

He's subsequently taken to the area, improving a fractured relationship between club and fans, won us immediate promotion, and a title. and so on.

You dismiss this as hysteria and messianic worship, when, in truth it's just fans appreciating having someone leading the club that we can be proud of, rather than embarrassed by.

You've manipulated the objective reality to paint the Newcastle fans in a poor light, hence, partisan bias.

Tadger said:
Aye, the reputation for Newcastle fans having unrealistic expectations came out of thin air.
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It's a cliche that may once have been grounded in some kernel of truth, but you're more likely to meet a doom monger amongst the Newcastle faithful, than you are a delewded jawdee. Aside from the orcs they wheel out for the tv cameras of course.

Saying all Newcastle fans, or even most Newcastle fans are like this, is pure talkSport.

G Force said:
I've pulled you up on this "expect" before. Certainly the mood on this board, and the Sunderland fans I know are always more hopeful, than expectant.

I'm from Shields, I've loads of mag mates and cousins. I'm not a rabid hater of Newcastle. However there's definitely a difference in outlook between the two sets of supporters
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I've read on this very board expectations. Some I've dismissed as bullish confidence, rather than an absolute conviction, but others are just that. An arrogance that doesn't follow from the reality.

I agree there's greater confidence on Tyneside than Wearside, but I'd put that down to your travails over the past decade compared to our peaks and troughs. I don't think we're more expectant than anyone else, perhaps we hope for more than we should, but I don't think we "expect" more than we should.
 
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The Fish said:
No, you're focussing on the wrong parts of your claims. e.g. you're misrepresenting the reaction to Benitez as hysteria. I would categorise the outpouring of affection from the fans as little more than us knowing a good thing when we see it, and being relieved after years of shit.

He's subsequently taken to the area, improving a fractured relationship between club and fans, won us immediate promotion, and a title. and so on.

You dismiss this as hysteria and messianic worship, when, in truth it's just fans appreciating having someone leading the club that we can be proud of, rather than embarrassed by.

You've manipulated the objective reality to paint the Newcastle fans in a poor light, hence, partisan bias.
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You wouldn't call last summer as "Hysteria"? It was akin to f***ing Beatlemania in the early 60s man :lol: "An outpouring of affection" That's sort of what we're all banging on about :lol:

Nice to see, you had no response to any of the factual parts of my post. The ones that don't paint him as the new messiah, just a reasonable manager who failed in his original remit.

Right, back to work. I forgot debating with you is like having a full time job :lol:
 
The Fish said:
No, you're focussing on the wrong parts of your claims. e.g. you're misrepresenting the reaction to Benitez as hysteria. I would categorise the outpouring of affection from the fans as little more than us knowing a good thing when we see it, and being relieved after years of shit.

He's subsequently taken to the area, improving a fractured relationship between club and fans, won us immediate promotion, and a title. and so on.

You dismiss this as hysteria and messianic worship, when, in truth it's just fans appreciating having someone leading the club that we can be proud of, rather than embarrassed by.

You've manipulated the objective reality to paint the Newcastle fans in a poor light, hence, partisan bias.



It's a cliche that may once have been grounded in some kernel of truth, but you're more likely to meet a doom monger amongst the Newcastle faithful, than you are a delewded jawdee. Aside from the orcs they wheel out for the tv cameras of course.

Saying all Newcastle fans, or even most Newcastle fans are like this, is pure talkSport.



I've read on this very board expectations. Some I've dismissed as bullish confidence, rather than an absolute conviction, but others are just that. An arrogance that doesn't follow from the reality.

I agree there's greater confidence on Tyneside than Wearside, but I'd put that down to your travails over the past decade compared to our peaks and troughs. I don't think we're more expectant than anyone else, perhaps we hope for more than we should, but I don't think we "expect" more than we should.
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G Force said:
You wouldn't call last summer as "Hysteria"? It was akin to f***ing Beatlemania in the early 60s man :lol: "An outpouring of affection" That's sort of what we're all banging on about :lol:

Nice to see, you had no response to any of the factual parts of my post. The ones that don't paint him as the new messiah, just a reasonable manager who failed in his remit.

Right, back to work. I forgot debating with you is like having a full time job :lol:
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How was it hysteria? Could you give an example of hysterical people? All I remember is mass singing of his name, delight/relief at the announcement of his commitment to stay, then the singing of our manager's name as we went on our way to win the league. Hardly Beatlemania :lol:

The factual elements bore little relationship to the broader subject. We're caught between two positions, you say he's worse than Newcastle fans make out, I say he's better than you make out. I also say that your categorisation of quite how good Newcastle fans think he is is exaggerated for effect.
 
To me there are two sets of mag fans. The ones who go to the games, been going pre Keegan who are generally decent lads who you can have a good bit of craic with. Then there are the Skyboys who jumped on the bandwagon in the mid 90's who go on about Barcelona of the North, Champions League, massive club with huge crowds. Alot of this delusion is fed by Sky still showing them alot. Most of these are knobheads who haven't got a clue
 
The Great MES said:
To me there are two sets of fans. The ones who go to the games, been going a while who are generally decent lads who you can have a good bit of craic with. Then there are the Skyboys who jumped on the bandwagon in the mid 90's who go on about "The Arsenal" , "City", "United" Barcelona of the North, Champions League, net spend. A lot of this delusion is fed by Sky showing the big 6 constantly and reruns of 90s football a lot. Most of these are knobheads who haven't got a clue
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broadened your post a bit.
 
raba said:
Loftus-Cheek has just said he chose Palace over Newcastle. Rafa's struggling to attract talent it seems.
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I wonder how long it is before the 52 thooosand start blaming their location, we are already being told that it's Ashley's fault.

They really do struggle to accept that they're really not a big deal, a below average club.
 
raba said:
Jairo Riedewald reportedly 'snubbed' Rafa for De Boar.
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Maybe, just maybe its because he's Dutch and possibly grew up watching De Boer, I mean its a massive Trump like leap into fake news but I think maybe this has some legs.
Palace fans on here mind, fuckin' ell, what next eh?
 
The Great MES said:
To me there are two sets of mag fans. The ones who go to the games, been going pre Keegan who are generally decent lads who you can have a good bit of craic with. Then there are the Skyboys who jumped on the bandwagon in the mid 90's who go on about Barcelona of the North, Champions League, massive club with huge crowds. Alot of this delusion is fed by Sky still showing them alot. Most of these are knobheads who haven't got a clue
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This whole pre Keegan thing is an absolute joke of an argument really. There are fans now who if born in 1988 and went to their first game in 93 say are now nearly 30 years old are you saying all of them are not as equal a fan or of right mind a fan as someone like me in their 40s

How about the generation of man United fans who from 90 onwards were used to them winning everything in sight are any different

Or are Older Liverpool fans different to newer ones because they were bandwagon jumpers in 70s and 80s yet newer ones aren't

People can't help their date of birth pal
 
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