Fat Spanish waiter to be given £70 million

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Brian Griffin said:
The top 7 is spot on so far:

http://www.totalsportek.com/money/english-premier-league-wage-bills-club-by-club/

Bottom 5 is spot on - barring Sunderland who over pay for what the achieve and rock up in mid table.



You do need to spend more than most clubs IMO as your standard of player is generally terrible for the PL - one or two exceptions to that.

Perhaps saying 'spend more' is wrong - but you do need to bring in a lot of players, more so than most.
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I disagree, I don't think that this promoted Newcastle side is significantly weaker than the Watford, Burnley, Bournemouth sides that came up and none of them have spent £80m in their first season in the top flight.

We have weaknesses, no doubt, but there's this line that we 'need 8 first team players at least' and we'd need to spend £100m in our first season back! That's just mental. Burnley have spent c£60m over two seasons, Bournemouth £82m, Watford £130m. I don't believe we're that much weaker than they were when they went up.
 


The Fish said:
I disagree, I don't think that this promoted Newcastle side is significantly weaker than the Watford, Burnley, Bournemouth sides that came up and none of them have spent £80m in their first season in the top flight.

We have weaknesses, no doubt, but there's this line that we 'need 8 first team players at least' and we'd need to spend £100m in our first season back! That's just mental. Burnley have spent c£60m over two seasons, Bournemouth £82m, Watford £130m. I don't believe we're that much weaker than they were when they went up.
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You need at least one striker, probably two.

You need at least a winger and a centre midfielder.

You need at least a centre half and a full back.

Minimum to even compete - that's six first teamers - and then you're gonna need some depth - you have a long list of decent Championship players but most of whom will not make the grade at PL level.

Gayle has proven he cannot do it at PL level, IMO - as have Perez and Mitrovich. So goals are gonna be a massive problem for you.
 
The Fish said:
I disagree, I don't think that this promoted Newcastle side is significantly weaker than the Watford, Burnley, Bournemouth sides that came up and none of them have spent £80m in their first season in the top flight.

We have weaknesses, no doubt, but there's this line that we 'need 8 first team players at least' and we'd need to spend £100m in our first season back! That's just mental. Burnley have spent c£60m over two seasons, Bournemouth £82m, Watford £130m. I don't believe we're that much weaker than they were when they went up.
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Forget the comparisons with other teams, please tell us the players from your first XI that you believe to be PL standard (bearing in mind that many of them were relegated last time or have failed to establish themselves as PL standard in recent years)

Go.........

Brian Griffin said:
you have a long list of decent Championship players but most of whom will not make the grade at PL level.
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Championship players on big money that they will struggle to shift
 
Brian Griffin said:
You need at least one striker, probably two.

You need at least a winger and a centre midfielder.

You need at least a centre half and a full back.

Minimum to even compete - that's six first teamers - and then you're gonna need some depth - you have a long list of decent Championship players but most of whom will not make the grade at PL level.

Gayle has proven he cannot do it at PL level, IMO - as have Perez and Mitrovich. So goals are gonna be a massive problem for you.
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I agree we need strengthening in a few areas (CF, #10, LW,LB,CB, imo), but I disagree that this Newcastle side is so poor that without spending £80m they'll be rock bottom. Next season there'll be at least 2 sides that we were better than this season, and then there's some poor sides in the Premier League (Hull, Swansea, Palace, etc.). We need only better 3 of them. There isn't this huge chasm between bottom of the Premier League and top of the Championship, honestly the gap isn't that big.

Re; the last bit, Gayle had a decent Goals per minutes record in the Premier League, Perez was all right in the Premier League and Mitrovic scored 9 in his debut season.

The players that are 1st choice now, can operate as backup next season, so the depth you talk of is already there in parts. We'll need only one Centre back as Clark, Hanley, Lascelles and Mbemba will be good enough 2nd-4th choices for a team aiming for safety with one quality addition. e.g.

TopCat said:
Forget the comparisons with other teams, please tell us the players from your first XI that you believe to be PL standard (bearing in mind that many of them were relegated last time or have failed to establish themselves as PL standard in recent years)

Go.........
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Well, first off, this is an entirely pointless exercise. You, a Sunderland fan, will not think few if any Newcastle players are good enough because you're biased. Also a team's relegation isn't always a reflection on a players quality or lack thereof. Defoe has been relegated, as has Kone and Pickford, are they suddenly not good enough for the Premier league?

However I'm waiting to hear back from someone at work so I've time to kill;

Darlow, Elliott, Krul are all good enough 'keepers for bottom half Premier League.
Yedlin is good enough
Clark, Mbemba and maybe Lascelles are good enough to be 2nd-4th choice CB
Hayden is good enough if he stays fit
Shelvey is good enough
Ritchie is good enough
Gayle might be too.

Dummett, Diame, Perez and Mitrovic are good enough for squad places.

I'm predicting either a string of :lol:s or a unilateral "No they're shite".

so... totally worth it.
 
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The Fish said:
I agree we need strengthening in a few areas (CF, #10, LW,LB,CB, imo), but I disagree that this Newcastle side is so poor that without spending £80m they'll be rock bottom. Next season there'll be at least 2 sides that we were better than this season, and then there's some poor sides in the Premier League (Hull, Swansea, Palace, etc.). We need only better 3 of them. There isn't this huge chasm between bottom of the Premier League and top of the Championship, honestly the gap isn't that big.

Re; the last bit, Gayle had a decent Goals per minutes record in the Premier League, Perez was all right in the Premier League and Mitrovic scored 9 in his debut season.

The players that are 1st choice now, can operate as backup next season, so the depth you talk of is already there in parts. We'll need only one Centre back as Clark, Hanley, Lascelles and Mbemba will be good enough 2nd-4th choices for a team aiming for safety with one quality addition. e.g.



Well, first off, this is an entirely pointless exercise. You, a Sunderland fan, will not think few if any Newcastle players are good enough because you're biased. Also a team's relegation isn't always a reflection on a players quality or lack thereof. Defoe has been relegated, as has Kone and Pickford, are they suddenly not good enough for the Premier league?

However I'm waiting to hear back from someone at work so I've time to kill;

Darlow, Elliott, Krul are all good enough 'keepers for bottom half Premier League.
Yedlin is good enough
Clark, Mbemba and maybe Lascelles are good enough to be 2nd-4th choice CB
Hayden is good enough if he stays fit
Shelvey is good enough
Ritchie is good enough
Gayle might be too.

Dummett, Diame, Perez and Mitrovic are good enough for squad places.

I'm predicting either a string of :lol:s or a unilateral "No they're shite".

so... totally worth it.
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Good enough for what though? Are you ambitions limited to 17th place?

Agree re keepers - Krul and Elliott are solid enough.
Defence is an issue - Clark and Mbemba have proven that they are not up to PL standard. Jury is out on Lascelles and Hayden as neitehr have played a significant number of games in the PL.
Shelvey? Was awful for you last season. Better this season, but standing in the centre circle playing hollywood passes will give you nothing next season
Ritchie - seems decent
Gayle - 5 goals a season max, ditto Perez and the otehr one
Diame? Decent

So from that I'd say you need a centre forward, a couple of midfielders and probably an entire back four unless it's a season of struggle.

Problem is that Rafa (like Dick) won't fancy a scrap at the bottom - coaches with experience of managing top of the league teams often don't enjoy the scrap for relegation. So, will rafa stay>? He probably has top end signings in his mind, but doubtful Ashley will give him the money he needs to finish top half. You might be better off appointing someone like Pearson, Pulis or Flores - stable mid-table managers
 
TopCat said:
Good enough for what though? Are you ambitions limited to 17th place?

Agree re keepers - Krul and Elliott are solid enough.
Defence is an issue - Clark and Mbemba have proven that they are not up to PL standard. Jury is out on Lascelles and Hayden as neitehr have played a significant number of games in the PL. Proven? Mbemba was one of our best defenders despite putting up with McClaren's nonsensical coaching. Clark has been very good this season and seems to have also suffered because of poor coaches. Either way were we to buy 1 quality CB (I'm thinking at the level of Sacko?) Defence is decent.
Shelvey? Was awful for you last season. Better this season, but standing in the centre circle playing hollywood passes will give you nothing next season Another who suffered because of McClaren and the shitshow around him. He's got great technique and it's his attitude/behaviour that's more of a concern
Ritchie - seems decent
Gayle - 5 goals a season max, ditto Perez and the otehr one I'd like a better striker, but which team wouldn't? Gayle's Goals per minutes is decent in the top flight and exceptional in the 2nd tier. He's a poacher, pure and simple and if he gets chances he'll score.
Diame? Decent

So from that I'd say you need a centre forward, a couple of midfielders and probably an entire back four unless it's a season of struggle.

Problem is that Rafa (like Dick) won't fancy a scrap at the bottom - coaches with experience of managing top of the league teams often don't enjoy the scrap for relegation. So, will rafa stay>? He probably has top end signings in his mind, but doubtful Ashley will give him the money he needs to finish top half. You might be better off appointing someone like Pearson, Pulis or Flores - stable mid-table managers
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We were told categorically that Benitez wouldn't join us, then he wouldn't stay because he wouldn't fancy slogging it out in the Championship away to Burton etc Now he won't fancy testing his mettle in the Premier League with the squad he's building? He's clearly got ambitions beyond mere survival in the Premier League, but I doubt that he'll be so daft as to expect Newcastle to leap several plateaus in 1 pre-season. As long as he's backed he'll see us as a long term project, he's already come out and said he could see himself here for 10yrs. Of course all that could go awry should Ashley try and screw him, but then we'll cross that bridge when we come to it. Also, Ashley gave McClaren money to spend and McClaren is clearly a far far poorer manager than Rafa.

Suggesting those three is pretty ridiculous. Benitez is one of the most trophied managers in the game, Newcastle haven't had a manager of his caliber since Robson and you're suggesting we should instead employ Nigel Pearson who has won nothing of note and who hasn't the consistency that Pulis can at least claim? Oh, and don't forget Pearson is a total headcase.

Now, should Ashley fuck up and force Benitez out we could do a lot worse than Pulis, but that's a fairly uninspiring appointment isn't it? Put it this way, were McClaren to have wonwon us promotion via the Play Offs I'd be grudgingly behind Pulis' appointment. It makes sense, out goes a incompetent Partridge-like prat and in comes a man who pretty much guarantees survival albeit via pretty awful football. But that didn't happen, so why would we go to Pulis

Flores is an odd suggestion, what's he done to prove he'd be better than Benitez?
 
The Fish said:
We were told categorically that Benitez wouldn't join us, then he wouldn't stay because he wouldn't fancy slogging it out in the Championship away to Burton etc Now he won't fancy testing his mettle in the Premier League with the squad he's building? He's clearly got ambitions beyond mere survival in the Premier League, but I doubt that he'll be so daft as to expect Newcastle to leap several plateaus in 1 pre-season. As long as he's backed he'll see us as a long term project, he's already come out and said he could see himself here for 10yrs. Of course all that could go awry should Ashley try and screw him, but then we'll cross that bridge when we come to it. Also, Ashley gave McClaren money to spend and McClaren is clearly a far far poorer manager than Rafa.

Suggesting those three is pretty ridiculous. Benitez is one of the most trophied managers in the game, Newcastle haven't had a manager of his caliber since Robson and you're suggesting we should instead employ Nigel Pearson who has won nothing of note and who hasn't the consistency that Pulis can at least claim? Oh, and don't forget Pearson is a total headcase.

Now, should Ashley fuck up and force Benitez out we could do a lot worse than Pulis, but that's a fairly uninspiring appointment isn't it? Put it this way, were McClaren to have wonwon us promotion via the Play Offs I'd be grudgingly behind Pulis' appointment. It makes sense, out goes a incompetent Partridge-like prat and in comes a man who pretty much guarantees survival albeit via pretty awful football. But that didn't happen, so why would we go to Pulis

Flores is an odd suggestion, what's he done to prove he'd be better than Benitez?
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You spelled 'people on a Sunderland chat forum were winding us up' wrong there tbh :lol:
 
Reiver said:
Your mate said 'We were told' ...... I was just answering in kind.
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Well, my 'mate' is saying 'we' and I am now agreeing with him so I guess it's valid that makes two of us (a collective) were told.

So, are you the spokesman for all of those people that were 'winding us up'?
 
Sima said:
Well, my 'mate' is saying 'we' and I am now agreeing with him so I guess it's valid that makes two of us (a collective) were told.

So, are you the spokesman for all of those people that were 'winding us up'?
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You must have been sitting there desperately waiting for a chance to use this :lol:

You obviously don't see the difference between stating an opinion, about NUFC, on behalf of a body of people and an offhand meaningless quip.

Well. you probably can but you're so cringingly wanting to prove your silly point that you'll ignore it.

In this particular case your little pal has used the term 'we were told' so he's obviously referring to more than one person, perhaps you and him, who knows?

If that's true then he's perfectly entitled.

I said 'people on a Sunderland chat forum' which is also true ....... I've done it and so have other people.

But when all is said and done ...... IT WAS JUST A JOKE :rolleyes:

If you truly believe I was claiming that all Sunderland supporters were winding you up then heaven help you.

The Fish said:
Wasn't just RTG, or even just Sunderland fans.
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Perhaps, as you're on RTG, addressing Sunderland fans you might wish to make that clear.
 
:lol:

Blarn so claim 'it was all a joke' defence.

Of course.

Wasn't really sitting on it but you embarrass yourself and prove yourself to be a massive hypocrite time and time again and when it is proven it's always 'just a joke' and 'stop taking things so seriously'. Maybe you should take your own advice with your 'toys out of the pram' reply :lol:

Proper parody.
 
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Reiver said:
Perhaps, as you're on RTG, addressing Sunderland fans you might wish to make that clear.
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Why? Does it matter who told me (and other Newcastle fans) that we wouldn't get Benitez? Or is the pertinent part the declaration, rather than the allegiance of the one declaring?

I was responding to a claim that Benitez wouldn't stay by anecdotally referencing similar claims that were subsequently proven inaccurate.
 
I think people are forgetting that a leicester team that was almost relegated the previous season won the title season before last. A team that included simpson, huth, morgan, drinkwater, albrighton. All of whom had been discarded by previous clubs. Were these players suddenly the best in the league? I think a large part of it was coaching and tactics, I also think players can be coached into performances that surpass their perceived ability. Case in point, Defoe was discarded by Spurs and sent to the US to retire essentially, all of sudden he's back in the prem and banging them in like he was 23.
 
The Fish said:
We were told categorically that Benitez wouldn't join us, then he wouldn't stay because he wouldn't fancy slogging it out in the Championship away to Burton etc Now he won't fancy testing his mettle in the Premier League with the squad he's building? He's clearly got ambitions beyond mere survival in the Premier League, but I doubt that he'll be so daft as to expect Newcastle to leap several plateaus in 1 pre-season. As long as he's backed he'll see us as a long term project, he's already come out and said he could see himself here for 10yrs. Of course all that could go awry should Ashley try and screw him, but then we'll cross that bridge when we come to it. Also, Ashley gave McClaren money to spend and McClaren is clearly a far far poorer manager than Rafa.

Suggesting those three is pretty ridiculous. Benitez is one of the most trophied managers in the game, Newcastle haven't had a manager of his caliber since Robson and you're suggesting we should instead employ Nigel Pearson who has won nothing of note and who hasn't the consistency that Pulis can at least claim? Oh, and don't forget Pearson is a total headcase.

Now, should Ashley fuck up and force Benitez out we could do a lot worse than Pulis, but that's a fairly uninspiring appointment isn't it? Put it this way, were McClaren to have wonwon us promotion via the Play Offs I'd be grudgingly behind Pulis' appointment. It makes sense, out goes a incompetent Partridge-like prat and in comes a man who pretty much guarantees survival albeit via pretty awful football. But that didn't happen, so why would we go to Pulis

Flores is an odd suggestion, what's he done to prove he'd be better than Benitez?
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Being top of the championship is a lot more fun than being bottom of the PL.

Didn't say any of those manager were better than Benitez, I said they may be better fits given Rafa's lofty ambitions. Do you really think he'll be happy managing a team that is 17th? no chance. Do you really think Fat Mike will spend emough to get you Top 8? No Chance

Something has to give
 
Get rid of a manager because he's better than the ones you will replace him with?

It's a unique way of thinking, I'll give you that. Benitez isn't stupid, he'll know he won't get the instant backing to launch an assault on the top 8 and it's a more long-term project.
 
What A Waster said:
Burnley only spent about £20m.
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Yes, they've been a great success story this season. They mostly brought in players to strengthen the depth of the squad, I think they only used two or three signings as regular first teamers.

Do you think Rafa will want to give as many of his Championship squad a chance in the Premier League?
 
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