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19/11/16 - 5pm - Protest at the Murray Gates

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WHD said:
There's no denying Short has made some poor appointments, but once they were appointed, they were responsible for their own poor performance. There's no point saying these poor appointments only performed poorly because of Short.
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This is why they got peddled - but it doesn't absolve Short entirely. If I, as an HR manager, kept hiring useless dickheads who didn't last a year, I wouldn't last long.
 

JonnotheMackem said:
This is why they got peddled - but it doesn't absolve Short entirely. If I, as an HR manager, kept hiring useless dickheads who didn't last a year, I wouldn't last long.
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I'm not absolving Short - he's made mistakes. He seemed to get it right with Allardyce, only for him to get fucked over by the FA. The majority of his appointments have been good on paper but they haven't worked out. It looks like his latest appointment has flopped spectacularly, but seriously I don't think any other owner (apart from a Man City type) would have made vastly different appointments at the time.
 
WHD said:
I'm not absolving Short - he's made mistakes. He seemed to get it right with Allardyce, only for him to get fucked over by the FA. The majority of his appointments have been good on paper but they haven't worked out. It looks like his latest appointment has flopped spectacularly, but seriously I don't think any other owner (apart from a Man City type) would have made vastly different appointments at the time.
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I think he's been a bit out of his depth in an industry he doesn't know well - with the best of intentions of course. The trouble we have with the bolded statement is there's only one way we can find out, and that's a gamble...
 
JonnotheMackem said:
Ah - this is why Short wanted a DoF. The trouble was, instead of appointing someone who knew what he was doing, he appointed a total cowboy.

Someone with his business sense should have known better.
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I agree Di Fanti was a poor appointment but Short tried to follow a successful model from elsewhere. He got shot of Di Fanti right away when it wasn't working. Again Congerton turned out to be poor but he had a top CV so why this didn't work? Maybe it was down to an internal struggle between Manager (Poyet) and Congerton.

DOF isn't a flawed system it's worked well at clubs like Southampton and Watford.

JonnotheMackem said:
This is why they got peddled - but it doesn't absolve Short entirely. If I, as an HR manager, kept hiring useless dickheads who didn't last a year, I wouldn't last long.
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A HR manager is a link in the chain. Short is the man at the top here hires people to do the job for him.
 
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1more said:
I agree Di Fanti was a poor appointment but Short tried to follow a successful model from elsewhere. He got shot of Di Fanti right away when it wasn't working. Again Congerton turned out to be poor but he had a top CV so why this didn't work? Maybe it was down to an internal struggle between Manager (Poyet) and Congerton.

DOF isn't a flawed system it's worked well at clubs like Southampton and Watford.
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How could Short, with his experience, not have seen this? How was he so easily hoodwinked?

Cack handedly by not appointing staff who were comfortable working within that kind of setup.

Tricky call. Either it was an unlucky appointment or the roles were handled badly as above.



1more said:
A HR manager is a link in the chain. Short is the man at the top here hires people to do the job for him.
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So other people hire and fire the managers?
 
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JonnotheMackem said:
How could Short, with his experience, not have seen this? How was he so easily hoodwinked?

Cack handedly by not appointing staff who were comfortable working within that kind of setup.

Tricky call. Either it was an unlucky appointment or the roles were handled badly as above.
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There's no denying Di Fanti was a mistake, I've got no idea what happened to make him the ideal DOF.

With Congerton I reckon he had a struggle right away with Poyet who wanted to sign the likes of Bridcutt and Buckley, I could be totally wrong though.

JonnotheMackem said:
How could Short, with his experience, not have seen this? How was he so easily hoodwinked?

Cack handedly by not appointing staff who were comfortable working within that kind of setup.

Tricky call. Either it was an unlucky appointment or the roles were handled badly as above.





So other people hire and fire the managers?
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That's not what I'm saying, a chairman at any level hires people to make decisions for them, so things like signing people, negotiating transfer deals and contracts will be handled by other people.
 
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1more said:
There's no denying Di Fanti was a mistake, I've got no idea what happened to make him the ideal DOF.

With Congerton I reckon he had a struggle right away with Poyet who wanted to sign the likes of Bridcutt and Buckley, I could be totally wrong though.
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I think that's pretty solid speculation.

I'm just going to clarify my position here, I'm not convinced sacking Moyes is the right thing to do, but questions have to be asked. Some of his decisions have been baffling. I appreciate what Short has done for us. I do think he's been misadvised and let down more than once, and I'm still not sure a new owner would take us to a land of milk and honey, and I think @haway's protest is basically pissing into the wind, but I'm just really fed up of paying for shite and being told that Short is the great benevolent one who is above all questioning - not, I hasten to add, that you have said so.
 
1more said:
There's no denying Di Fanti was a mistake, I've got no idea what happened to make him the ideal DOF.

With Congerton I reckon he had a struggle right away with Poyet who wanted to sign the likes of Bridcutt and Buckley, I could be totally wrong though.


That's not what I'm saying, a chairman at any level hires people to make decisions for them, so things like signing people, negotiating transfer deals and contracts will be handled by other people.
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Poyet said that he didn't actually want them but was left with the choice of them or nothing. Might have been just saying that to make himself look better mind.
 
sick said:
Poyet sais that he didn't actually want them but was left with the choice of them or nothing. Might have been just saying that to make himself look better mind.
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Funny they were both players he'd managed before.

My best mate said we'd had a bargain getting Bridcutt. Shows what he knows like. :D
 
Wayne The Punk said:
I am not sure if you are aware of this, they got relegated. Their protests were amazing

Just so you realise, they are still owned by the bloke they claimed to despise and protested against.

It sounds an amazing plan

How old are you?




It probably turns you on.

Carry on,

Does swearing offend you?
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Nope far from it. It amuses me.
as do your little rants on here.
 
sick said:
Poyet said that he didn't actually want them but was left with the choice of them or nothing. Might have been just saying that to make himself look better mind.
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Maybe, i have not ideas to be honest, just given an opinion of what may have happened.
 
WHD said:
There's no denying Short has made some poor appointments, but once they were appointed, they were responsible for their own poor performance. There's no point saying these poor appointments only performed poorly because of Short.
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this this and this. hopefully when the bedwetters and fannies make a mag like arse of themselves people realise they are not representative of the majority of sensible SAFC supporters who live in the real world.
 
Cosmos Rocks said:
this this and this. hopefully when the bedwetters and fannies make a mag like arse of themselves people realise they are not representative of the majority of sensible SAFC supporters who live in the real world.
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Don't get me wrong mate, I don't mind supporters showing their displeasure - if I think it's justified. Short has ballsed up in the past - he must know he has and he's tried to correct it. It looks like he wants out, so a demonstration seems pointless and there's nothing at this point, apart from sacking Moyes, I think he could change.

What are we going to demonstrate about? "Short, come out and admit you ballsed up some things in the past!"??
 
haway said:
Time to tell Short that he needs to go. I think all of us are sad that it has come to this but it's becoming increasingly clear that he's mismanaged the club to the point where relegation isn't our biggest worry - financial solvency is.

We've been through it all before but he's repeatedly left managers feeling their hands are tied and has made awful decisions that leave us in a perilous position.

Protesting may not help - but it's about time he hears the frustration of the support. It could well result in him acting - he wants rid of the club and is holding out for a higher price. Action might result in him dropping that price enough to get the sale through so we can rebuild for next year.

Let's keep it outside the stadium - the last things the players need is a hostile atmosphere when they're presumably low on confidence as it is, but I for one do not want to sit on my hands until the end of the season, knowing all that we do now about the mismanagement of the club, having done nothing.

The fans are the one real thing that matter to me about this club, and I'm sick of us being misled and manipulated by an owner who clearly has no interest anymore in our success.
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What will Short out achieve? guaranteed success under another owner?

He has appointed the best possible choice manager every time he has brought in a new man. Sam was probably the most frowned upon yet became the best of the bunch

He has backed managers, and sacked them when needed. He has invested hundreds of millions in the club

What will a new owner do differently?
 
haway said:
Iirc it wasn't that Short rang him up, it was something to do with how he went about it that griped Keane
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This is typical of your 'facts' tbh.

Yet with guesswork, speculation and vague recollections you decide to take on the owner of the club ...... didn't you say you worked in a solicitors office?


Do you believe the CPS wouldn't have laughed at your 'case'.
 
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