Rafael Benítez

[Church]

Wouldn't be surprised, Caulkin seems to think it's likely but the finer details are still being hashed out. Sounds like Carr is on his way out, which would make me think that the transfer committee is being sacked off. There's been positive noises from Perez, Mitrovic, Townsend (and a few fringe players) but the likes of Sissoko, Wijnaldum, Janmaat, Mbemba will likely be sitting down with Rafa to see if;
a) he wants them,
b) they want to stay
c) the finance side of things.

I know there's a decent portion of the sunderland fans who don't rate Rafa, but I'm genuinely excited about the prospect of having a man with his trophy laden CV managing my club, after years of employing men with nothing but failure on theirs.

With my non biased head on, i can understand the eagerness to have a big name, especially on the back of years of poor or knob head managers, although the hysteria has gone out of control, driven by the Chronicle and a few others.

 

[rentaghost]

No, I don't think there would. But that's because they're not of the same standard as Rafa. If it was de Boer or Koeman, for example, who'd been brought in as a last ditch attempt to keep us up and had the same impact on the atmosphere around the club as Rafa has, I think there would have been the same outpouring of warmth towards them.

I think if Warnock had come in and kept us up, we'd love him for it, but would want someone with a better record in the Premier League next season. That might seem deluded or whatever, but ask yourself, if shit had gone south under Sam and Warnock had been brought in to save you, would you necessarily trust him to take you out of the relegation worries as you do Allardyce?

Rafa had a remit to keep you up and failed. Set the team up to beat Villa away and pick up 3 or 4 points from Sunderland and Norwich would have been good enough. If Neil Warnock had done exactly the same as Rafa to the point relegation was confirmed you would have burned effigies of him. It isn't mental to want rafa as manager but utterly mental to praise the job he did prior to the Spurs game - and loads did.

 

[lurker]

Rafa had a remit to keep you up and failed. Set the team up to beat Villa away and pick up 3 or 4 points from Sunderland and Norwich would have been good enough. If Neil Warnock had done exactly the same as Rafa to the point relegation was confirmed you would have burned effigies of him. It isn't mental to want rafa as manager but utterly mental to praise the job he did prior to the Spurs game - and loads did.

This

 

[Deleted member 6830]

He will need a massive turn around in players, they didn't have any fight for the premier league, they will be fucked in the championship

WE SAID THAT ABOUT 2009-2010

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30 wins out of 46 games
90 goals scored
Only 3 short of our total in 98-99 which iirc has only been beaten once since.

THEY WILL PISS IT AGAIN MAN

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Nolan, Carroll, Ameoba and Lovenkrands all getting in to double figures.

 

[one footed wonder]

If they keep some the better players they have add the likes of Colback, Anita, Perez and probably Mitrovic plus some new signings, (law of averages would say they will get a couple of handy players at that level), they can all do a job in that league and should be at the very least good enough to be in and around the shake up at the end of the season.

I don't think the question is necessarily about ability in the championship it is about maintaining a strong belief and attitude for the absolute slog that league is.

Whether or not Benitez is cut out for that league is another question but if he does stay, no matter what outsiders think, it will give the club and the supporters a massive boost going into the new season and ensure the players have the backing of the fans early on, question is can they capitalise on it, get a good start and the backing will remain in place longer, stutter and falter early on and it could be a very different set of circumstances.

Biggest question for the mags, (given they seem to be saying IF he can keep a large majority of the current playing staff we should go up), should be, can Benitez rely on the attitude of the players he retains? I'd question that massively after some of the pathetic attempts under Benitez were suddenly turned around with a mauling of an admittedly switched off Spurs when they were already relegated. That would set alarm bells ringing for me can they do it when the pressure is on, can they do it when it matters and believe me the pressure will be well and truly ON if Benitez stays as expectation level will be title winners with ease.......can they handle it? f***ing hope not.

 

[The Fish]

With my non biased head on, i can understand the eagerness to have a big name, especially on the back of years of poor or knob head managers, although the hysteria has gone out of control, driven by the Chronicle and a few others.

It's not the name, it's the proven track record.

 

[Idlewild Mackem]

WE SAID THAT ABOUT 2009-2010

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30 wins out of 46 games
90 goals scored
Only 3 short of our total in 98-99 which iirc has only been beaten once since.

THEY WILL PISS IT AGAIN MAN

You must be logged on to see external links

Nolan, Carroll, Ameoba and Lovenkrands all getting in to double figures.

Absolutely no guarantee of that at all.

 

[Slackythemackem]

I'd love to see him fuck the job right up. unfortunately i can only see it going one way, i think they'll piss that league. even going to stick a few quid on it just to soften the blow when they get promoted.

 

[The Fish]

Rafa had a remit to keep you up and failed. Set the team up to beat Villa away and pick up 3 or 4 points from Sunderland and Norwich would have been good enough. If Neil Warnock had done exactly the same as Rafa to the point relegation was confirmed you would have burned effigies of him. It isn't mental to want rafa as manager but utterly mental to praise the job he did prior to the Spurs game - and loads did.

We were set up to take 3 points from each of you, Villa and Norwich. Inasmuch as Benitez's cautious approach permits. But bear in mind we haven't the confident players to go gung-ho, or the clinical striker to adopt a more selective approach and we have a porous defence. You were his first home game, his 2nd game with the squad and it's a derby.

Norwich came a next, it was his 3rd game, he'd just lost his then 1st choice 'keeper leaving us down to our 3rd stopped for the rest of the season. It was a mental game that swung between both sides just as the reverse fixture had, the only difference being we were away and 1/2 our team don't turn up for those games. Conceded just before both halves finished and Robert's your mother's brother.

I think you also have to take into account everything that goes with the situation. Newcastle fans aren't delighted with the possible long-term appointment Rafa because he failed to keep us up. It's because of what came before him and what came before that and before that. It's because of where a manager of his caliber can take us. Given the time and the support (and a bit of luck) he can get us comfortably mid-table, he has that level of ability. It's also because in 10 games we saw a team emerge from a set of gutless individuals bereft of organisation, of confidence and of a sense of identity. It's been repeated ad infinitum but it does bear repeating, had Rafa been appointed earlier I firmly believe we'd have stayed up.

 

[Mr David]

We were set up to take 3 points from each of you, Villa and Norwich. Inasmuch as Benitez's cautious approach permits. But bear in mind we haven't the confident players to go gung-ho, or the clinical striker to adopt a more selective approach and we have a porous defence. You were his first home game, his 2nd game with the squad and it's a derby.

Norwich came a next, it was his 3rd game, he'd just lost his then 1st choice 'keeper leaving us down to our 3rd stopped for the rest of the season. It was a mental game that swung between both sides just as the reverse fixture had, the only difference being we were away and 1/2 our team don't turn up for those games. Conceded just before both halves finished and Robert's your mother's brother.

I think you also have to take into account everything that goes with the situation. Newcastle fans aren't delighted with the possible long-term appointment Rafa because he failed to keep us up. It's because of what came before him and what came before that and before that. It's because of where a manager of his caliber can take us. Given the time and the support (and a bit of luck) he can get us comfortably mid-table, he has that level of ability. It's also because in 10 games we saw a team emerge from a set of gutless individuals bereft of organisation, of confidence and of a sense of identity. It's been repeated ad infinitum but it does bear repeating, had Rafa been appointed earlier I firmly believe we'd have stayed up.

You surely don't think you would have beat Spurs had there been pressure on you?

 

[royaldragon]

I'd love to see him fuck the job right up. unfortunately i can only see it going one way, i think they'll piss that league. even going to stick a few quid on it just to soften the blow when they get promoted.

The kiss of death.

 

[one footed wonder]

Allardyce is a fair point actually. I know it'll never be admitted on here, but Pardew is a charlatan and will be found out by the wider world soon enough.


It's complicated.

Benitez has no experience of the Championship and doesn't have a record of long term projects. He's suspect in the transfer market and favours a cautious approach which works in knock-out competitions and some foreign leagues but how will it fair in the knockabout 2nd tier of English football? Hard to say.

All that said, he's clearly a good manager, and definitely of a strata we'd not attract for quite some time. Nobody thought we'd get him to join in the first place, everyone thought he'd 100% go if we went down and many thought he'd go even if he had kept us up. He's proven that he can get teams promoted. He's got a reputation in the world (bar sunderland and Everton it seems )that will attract players to join a club in the 2nd tier that may have not fancied a year out of the top flight. His cautious approach isn't so dissimilar from the style that Hughton used to stroll through the Championship last time.

End of the day we'd be f***ing stupid not to try and convince a manager of his ability and standing to stay. Unfortunately, Lee Charnley is f***ing stupid, otherwise we'd have never appointed McClaren or at least brought Benitez is earlier.

If you keep some the better players, likes of Lascelles/Townsend/Janmaat add the likes of Colback, Anita, Perez and probably Mitrovic plus some new signings, (law of averages would say Benitez will get a couple of handy players at that level), they can all do a job in that league and should be at the very least good enough to be in and around the shake up at the end of the season.

I don't think the question is necessarily about ability in the championship and I also think it is bigger than just Benitez it is about everyone, mainly the players, maintaining a strong belief and attitude for the absolute slog that league is.

Whether or not Benitez is cut out for that league is another question, (trophy winning background at the top level is good therefore could assume it would transfer to a lower level although untested, other basket case clubs he has managed have ended in tears) but if he does stay, no matter what outsiders think, it will give the club and the supporters a massive boost going into the new season and ensure the players have the backing of the fans early on, question is can you capitalise on it, get a good start and the backing will remain in place longer, stutter and falter early on and it could be a very different set of circumstances.

Biggest question, (given a lot of mags seem to be saying get Benitez and keep large majority of the better playing staff and we should go up and I don't necessarily disagree), should be, can Benitez rely on the attitude of the players he retains?

I'd question that massively after some of the pathetic attempts under Benitez (Villa, Southampton, late collapse v Norwich), compared to battling displays v 'bigger teams' (Liverpool & Man City), and then the unexpected mauling of an admittedly switched off Spurs when they were already relegated.

That would set alarm bells ringing for me....... can they do it when the pressure is on, can they do it when it matters and believe me the pressure will be well and truly ON if Benitez stays as expectation level will be title winners with ease. Will the fans stay with him if the season starts badly? Some Mags are well known for their lack of patience and should we say poor reactions to when things start going not as envisaged....tough to do this time as they have well and truly nailed their colours to the mast with Benitez.

If he stays, keeps the better players and adds some quality he should guide them to promotion but as we know in football it doesn't always work out as planned whatever happens it is a massive season for the mags

 

[Reiver]

Can you see why, using terms like "a side put together by someone else" might come across as you dismissing their validity?

No, I'm not sure when he last took a team through a competition from start to finish. I'm presuming you do?

But you're continually blaming McClaren for his failure to do what he was brought in to do at Newcastle

 

[DufraisFTM]

Absolutely no guarantee of that at all.

The same fella 'guranteed' for weeks that the Mags would beat Villa. He even said that anyone suggesting anything other than a Newcastle win should be 'locked up'

 

[Marcus Aurelius]

We were set up to take 3 points from each of you, Villa and Norwich. Inasmuch as Benitez's cautious approach permits. But bear in mind we haven't the confident players to go gung-ho, or the clinical striker to adopt a more selective approach and we have a porous defence. You were his first home game, his 2nd game with the squad and it's a derby.

Norwich came a next, it was his 3rd game, he'd just lost his then 1st choice 'keeper leaving us down to our 3rd stopped for the rest of the season. It was a mental game that swung between both sides just as the reverse fixture had, the only difference being we were away and 1/2 our team don't turn up for those games. Conceded just before both halves finished and Robert's your mother's brother.

I think you also have to take into account everything that goes with the situation. Newcastle fans aren't delighted with the possible long-term appointment Rafa because he failed to keep us up. It's because of what came before him and what came before that and before that. It's because of where a manager of his caliber can take us. Given the time and the support (and a bit of luck) he can get us comfortably mid-table, he has that level of ability. It's also because in 10 games we saw a team emerge from a set of gutless individuals bereft of organisation, of confidence and of a sense of identity. It's been repeated ad infinitum but it does bear repeating, had Rafa been appointed earlier I firmly believe we'd have stayed up.

He'd had enough time by Villa away to sort it. And he goes into your must-win game/pile pressure on Sunderland game with two defensive midfielders against the worst team in the league by a country mile. Tactical genius? Erm, no. Liverpool fans will tell you he is ultra defensive in his outlook and that cost you. Additionally, Di Canio and Advocaat had less time to turn things around I believe. You went down because you have an expensively assembled highly paid team that didn't care.....unlike ours who sweated blood on the run-in. There you have it

 

[GBSAFC]

Lee Ryder didn't go to Uni, man. Evidently he didn't even go to primary school.

never graduated nursery fella... he's a man- toddler

 

[The Fish]

You surely don't think you would have beat Spurs had there been pressure on you?

Depends, they weren't at the races at all. Our shit defence won everything against them bar the Lamela goal (which was a 'keeping error). If they'd showed up they would have beaten us, pressure on us on no. They're much, much better than we are, but they just flat out failed to appear. Come on man, they pegged us back to 2-1 and we got a man sent off, everyone in the country must have expected a collapse, but they applied no pressure and our 10 men put 3 past them.

They Spurs'd that game up.

 

[Deleted member 6830]

Whatever anyone says, Benitez is a decent appointment. Had he been appointed a month earlier he would possibly have saved them, but failure to get more than a point from us, norwich and villa is quite damning really.

IF he is given full control over everything, he could well overhaul it and bring it back stronger by which time we will hopefully be far stronger as apparently, ES thinks the world of BSA and its likely BSA will be allowed to do what he wants to do within the obvious constraints of the FFP stuff. Therefore, like many on here, I couldnt give a shiny one how/what they do, as they will definitely find us, and many other current PL clubs much stronger than when they decided to leave us.

However, there is aload of shite being spoken about how tough the Ch'ship is. It is only tough on those clubs who can only afford to have a small first team squad.

Playing 46 games - Sat/Tues etc - so what ? The travelling is hardly arduous - Brighton, a few London teams ? Big deal. If they werent playing, they'd be training so where's the ordeal there ?

Scum and Villa have fairly large squads, so a bit of rotation can be done if players feeling mentally/physically jaded and Benitez has been doing rotation for years.

Also, this bollocks about it being a negative that he hasn't managed in the Ch'ship. He managed at least two teams in Spain's B league earlier in his career, and got two promotions iirc. In addition, he will watch and analyse how each chship team plays just as he did for the premiership, and plan accordingly. How's that going to be a problem ?

And the best bit about teams in the Chship being tougher and nastier. Well they coped against these supposed nasty teams no bother in 09/10. Plus, what I have seen of the Championship this season, its no tougher and certainly no more intense than against the PL teams.

Although they will lose a few players {wont be anywhere near the exodus lads are predicting except shite like Taylor, Goufran, Riviere, Saivet, Cisse and Thauvin}, theres still plenty who will enjoy a nice 'tear up' like Lascelles, Dummett, Mbemba, Mitroshit and Tiote.

They will piss it, but as long as we make the expected progress under BSA, it is totally irrelevant.

 

[The Fish]

He'd had enough time by Villa away to sort it. And he goes into your must-win game/pile pressure on Sunderland game with two defensive midfielders against the worst team in the league by a country mile. Tactical genius? Erm, no. Liverpool fans will tell you he is ultra defensive in his outlook and that cost you. Additionally, Di Canio and Advocaat had less time to turn things around I believe. You went down because you have an expensively assembled highly paid team that didn't care.....unlike ours who sweated blood on the run-in. There you have it

Your last statement is what I've been saying. Your initial few ignore what I've previously said.

 

[Reiver]

Depends, they weren't at the races at all. Our shit defence won everything against them bar the Lamela goal (which was a 'keeping error). If they'd showed up they would have beaten us, pressure on us on no. They're much, much better than we are, but they just flat out failed to appear. Come on man, they pegged us back to 2-1 and we got a man sent off, everyone in the country must have expected a collapse, but they applied no pressure and our 10 men put 3 past them.

They Spurs'd that game up.

I doubt many people were bothered one way or the other .......... we were saying, at Watford, that we hoped Newcastle would win 10-0.