Officiating in the lower leagues

[tunstallhill]

My lad took reffing at 16 after playing through all the age groups from u7.

He lasted about 4 seasons before giving up, just as he was starting doing more adult games.

He got fed up with the constant moaning and questioning of every decision. It’s not something you notice normally as a player or spectator but as you say when it’s your lad out there it’s never ending.

I used to wear headphones and listen to stuff so I couldn’t hear what was being said but still ending up having words with people a few times.

The sad thing is, he was actually pretty good at it. The FA really don’t do enough to retain promising refs and the more that drop out, the less there are to develop into tomorrows pro refs.

I think id take to wearing a body camera and maybe set up another camera to record the game

 

[Methusalah]

The time is getting added but the players are not being booked for doing it, keepers are still given 4 warnings and then booked in the 93rd minute, book them in the 26th when they start doing it and magically half of the added time wouldnt need to be added.

The fact is that it's so blatant, hardly subtle. One warning early on followed by a booking and then if necessary a sending off.It would soon stop.

 

[PulseSafc]

I've fancied it tbf. 32 now and my body can't handle playing weekly at a decent level anymore so to try and stay within the game I've thought after taking up reffing.

I'm also a currently a cop so I imagine the abuse on the sidelines is nowt compared to what I'm used to so might stand me in good stead to persevere.

 

[AC Mack]

I don't get it, given the power I wouldn't hesitate in abiding by the laws and brandishing cards. In the same way I'd be a bastard of a traffic cop too. Although I do think in the refs instance, there's a chance you'd get battered for it. Still some people are masochists, hence why I watch Sunderland

We all like to think we'd do that, but under pressure it's not as straightforward. If you do it once, you have to do it all the time. What if you end up dishing multiple red cards in a game that didn't warrant it? You'd be pilloried.

People say that if you clamp down on it then it will stop, but that's not the reality.

 

[tunstallhill]

Can't comment on refereeing, but cricket umpiring involves evening classes on the Laws, followed by exams (written and oral) to get qualified. After that, you start in the lower leagues and progress to higher standard games on the basis of assessments.

I've no idea marra tbh. At a guess I'd say you'd go on a course then start at a very low level. If your good I'd say the potential to shoot up the ladder quickly would be there

i might have a look into it. i wonder how many hours are required to get the basic level qualification.

We all like to think we'd do that, but under pressure it's not as straightforward. If you do it once, you have to do it all the time. What if you end up dishing multiple red cards in a game that didn't warrant it? You'd be pilloried.

People say that if you clamp down on it then it will stop, but that's not the reality.

depends. if the FA had your back and you recorded yourself telling both teams before the game that you won't accept foul and abusive language, and cards will be dealt out for anything that is deemed overly agressive, then the teams can't complain when they start getting punished for being c*nts.

to be honest, it would be the people on the sidelines that i would find more difficult to control

 

[The Archer]

I've fancied it tbf. 32 now and my body can't handle playing weekly at a decent level anymore so to try and stay within the game I've thought after taking up reffing.

I'm also a currently a cop so I imagine the abuse on the sidelines is nowt compared to what I'm used to so might stand me in good stead to persevere.

When I was coaching the fella who ran our club was a copper.

He used to ref too and just dealt with anyone abusing him by smiling at them and letting them go off on one so they got it out of their system and then taking whatever action he thought necessary.

Its much better than getting into a running battle with players/coaches and spectators like I have seen some refs do.

 

[PulseSafc]

When I was coaching the fella who ran our club was a copper.

He used to ref too and just dealt with anyone abusing him by smiling at them and letting them go off on one so they got it out of their system and then taking whatever action he thought necessary.

Its much better than getting into a running battle with players/coaches and spectators like I have seen some refs do.

That's exactly my way of thinking tbf too. Just let them rant and rave away until they've worn themselves out and deal appropriately.

I've seen too much shite and had far worse directed at me to let a footballer/coach/spectator bother me. "You crack on lad..."

 

[Confucius]

We all like to think we'd do that, but under pressure it's not as straightforward. If you do it once, you have to do it all the time. What if you end up dishing multiple red cards in a game that didn't warrant it? You'd be pilloried.

People say that if you clamp down on it then it will stop, but that's not the reality.

That’s true, they should get them to ref a match each and see how they like it.

 

[AC Mack]

i might have a look into it. i wonder how many hours are required to get the basic level qualification.


depends. if the FA had your back and you recorded yourself telling both teams before the game that you won't accept foul and abusive language, and cards will be dealt out for anything that is deemed overly agressive, then the teams can't complain when they start getting punished for being c*nts.

to be honest, it would be the people on the sidelines that i would find more difficult to control

That's what I mean, you'd have the wrath of the crowd who often bay for blood over the slightest thing.

There are a few parallels to my job as a teacher and I'll give an example. A TA I know likes to say that, were they the teacher, they would have an iron grip over discipline in the classroom ie not letting the slightest indiscretion go. That person would see that as good behaviour management.

However, firstly you'd have the kids hating you and parents not happy if they've deemed you've been too harsh on their child. You will miss things as you're only one pair of eyes so consistency becomes impossible. Also, it's absolutely exhausting trying to micro manage and keep on top of everything all the time. We're all humans at the end of the day.

By trying to clamp down on everything, you set yourself up for failure. You need to pick your battles, which is why refs usually let minor indiscretions go like stealing five yards at a throw in or taking a bit longer than necessary at a goal kick.

That’s true, they should get them to ref a match each and see how they like it.

A lot of what I've said above applies to your initial post too.

When I was coaching the fella who ran our club was a copper.

He used to ref too and just dealt with anyone abusing him by smiling at them and letting them go off on one so they got it out of their system and then taking whatever action he thought necessary.

Its much better than getting into a running battle with players/coaches and spectators like I have seen some refs do.

That's just it. Sometimes people see referees/police officers/teachers as soft for letting things go or turning a blind eye, but until you've been in that position yourself and seen how much there is to deal with, it's difficult to judge.

 

[Confucius]

That's what I mean, you'd have the wrath of the crowd who often bay for blood over the slightest thing.

There are a few parallels to my job as a teacher and I'll give an example. A TA I know likes to say that, were they the teacher, they would have an iron grip over discipline in the classroom ie not letting the slightest indiscretion go. That person would see that as good behaviour management.

However, firstly you'd have the kids hating you and parents not happy if they've deemed you've been too harsh on their child. You will miss things as you're only one pair of eyes so consistency becomes impossible. Also, it's absolutely exhausting trying to micro manage and keep on top of everything all the time. We're all humans at the end of the day.

By trying to clamp down on everything, you set yourself up for failure. You need to pick your battles, which is why refs usually let minor indiscretions go like stealing five yards at a throw in or taking a bit longer than necessary at a goal kick.


A lot of what I've said above applies to your initial post too.

To be fair we are talking about lower league football, they aren’t likely to bring their mam and dad along for a fight. I still think minor indiscretions should be pulled up, not talking about cards here. What is it they say about giving them an inch…..
Rules are rules, would teachers let minor indiscretions go in school? I’m not sure, I’m no teacher and times or different, I couldn’t get away with owt and I know there is very little discipline in schools for the very reason you have stated, upsetting someone. But that’s another thread for elsewhere and another day

 

[Matnab]

The minute a referee clamps down on dissent they get accused of being inconsistent and slagged off even more. How on earth do you even begin to legislate against 'dissent'? It's a nightmare to even begin trying to make it a binary issue. Unless of course you just ban players from talking to the refs.

 

[Mr Redknapp]

Yes it's me again on my favourite subject but I've taken in a few Northern league games in lately and it genuinely astounds me of what goes on. Don't get me wrong I'm not expecting all sunshine and happiness. It's a passionate game and I expect people to get pissed off, frustrated and all that but fuck me the abuse the officials take is absolute ridiculous. It must be quite soul destroying. Just constant twisting coming from the players and sidelines, everything decision contested, appealing for stuff thats clearly not theres and twisting still when its rightly not given. Witnessed a couple of young lasses running the lines which I thought was great to see but even then players and spectators just getting on to them all the time. Has it always been like this? Has it filtered down from professional football. Why anyone wants to do it is beyond me..As I said above it must be absolutely soul destroying having to listen to it all the time.

yep, pro refs are put under constant pressure by home crowds and then get jumped on when they make the slightest mistake. It's bound to trickle down to the lower leagues and semi pro level imo.

 

[SAFCItalia]

yep, pro refs are put under constant pressure by home crowds and then get jumped on when they make the slightest mistake. It's bound to trickle down to the lower leagues and semi pro level imo.

Spot on. VAR doesn't help. Every week the media and pundits are going into over the top analysis of officials' decisions more than they are the actual game.

 

[GBJS]

i might have a look into it. i wonder how many hours are required to get the basic level qualification.


depends. if the FA had your back and you recorded yourself telling both teams before the game that you won't accept foul and abusive language, and cards will be dealt out for anything that is deemed overly agressive, then the teams can't complain when they start getting punished for being c*nts.

to be honest, it would be the people on the sidelines that i would find more difficult to control

If I recall I did two/three Sundays doing practical work and then an exam on a separate evening (this was several years ago mind). If you do take up refereeing then I would suggest don’t ever give a sermon to grassroots players before the game as you’re setting yourself up to fail, just referee what’s in front of you as it happens. It’s a little different the higher up the pyramid you go as captains are involved in exchanging team sheets.

 

[exiled_in_manc]

This was an email released today from the club my 12 year old plays for... Some people just don't know how to behave, it's kids football for Christ's sake, it's embarrassing.

MESSAGE TO ALL PARENTS/GUARDIANS

The club have recently received an E21 charge from the FA. An E21 charge means the Club has failed to ensure that spectators and/or its supporters conducted themselves in an orderly fashion whilst attending a match. It is very difficult, or even impossible, for us to control the actions of grown adults in the moment but we do try to ensure you are all educated as to what is expected during training and matches.

When registering a child with us you did confirm that you had read the Club's Code of Conduct Document, Equality Policy Document & Child Safeguarding Document, among others. These documents will be sent out via your coaches for you to refresh yourselves with the contents.

Please be aware that any fines received by the club due to misconduct by players or supporters are passed to the individual for settlement. We will also be taking steps to suspend individuals found guilty of disorderly behaviour from attending matches and training.

Poor behaviour will not be tolerated by the club. We all (Committee Members, Coaches, Assistants, Informal Volunteers, Players & Supporters) work hard to provide a safe and fun environment for all involved. Poor behaviour also reflects badly on the club’s reputation within the grassroots community.

It is a shame we must send this message to everyone but unfortunately the actions of a minority cause problems for all of us. If you do have any concerns regarding behaviour within the club, please speak to our Safeguarding Officers.

 

[Sporty]

yep, pro refs are put under constant pressure by home crowds and then get jumped on when they make the slightest mistake. It's bound to trickle down to the lower leagues and semi pro level imo.

It could be nipped in the bud at the top level. Xavi went on like an idiot tonight over the red and got himself sent off eventually yet it was a foul all day long as shown in the gifs (note the boot/calf contact also).

https://www.readytogo.net/smb/threa...sports-ultimate.1631750/page-10#post-40510822

They trialled bodycams last season so I wonder what became of that?

There's a shortage of up and coming refs

European football is 40,000 referees short and the elite game is partly to blame

Being a referee is a calling: most people want to score the goals or be the star, but officiating is an elite career path. However, fewer people becoming referees and it impacts the entire sport from top to bottom.

www.espn.co.uk

This is thor'd from another post of mine as it just needs sorting out once and for all.

I don't watch rugby as I think it's shite but football needs to adapt to get players to act more like rugby players rather than whiney moaning twisty abusive brats. Watch these 2 videos to see how football should be, the first being the use of video review but without players getting in the ref's face (tho the commentators would need to shut up for TV) and the second showing how the players respect the ref and how he can easily put them in their place.

Note how he tells the player at 40 secs to go away and he instantly does, yet footy players even though they can get booked STILL go to the ref.

Football players are neanderthal in comparison to rugby players respecting the ref. Note the "It's not soccer" at 1 min 47 secs. Also the way he pulls the 2 captains over to tell them about the players calling for decisions etc at 2:45. Can this mentality ever happen to football or is it too late to change?

The minute a referee clamps down on dissent they get accused of being inconsistent and slagged off even more. How on earth do you even begin to legislate against 'dissent'? It's a nightmare to even begin trying to make it a binary issue. Unless of course you just ban players from talking to the refs.

It works very well in rugby as you can see above and it's not as if rugby blokes aren't as passionate or are softer than football players. It's not perfect but it's a long way away from the shite we see in football. It wouldn't take much to bring in similar rules in football and aye it might be a bit messy and controversial at times but over time you'd like to think it would be far better than it is now.

 

[SPUFF]

If I recall I did two/three Sundays doing practical work and then an exam on a separate evening (this was several years ago mind). If you do take up refereeing then I would suggest don’t ever give a sermon to grassroots players before the game as you’re setting yourself up to fail, just referee what’s in front of you as it happens. It’s a little different the higher up the pyramid you go as captains are involved in exchanging team sheets.

Massively sympathise with refs but one at carlton done exactly that. Speech saying what a top top ref he was.
Went on to make the entire game about him.
Most are great n just crack on.