Mackem00
Striker
Hopefully it's all spent on bin collections.
WDSC???
- Thread starter the boot
- Start date
Boz33
Striker
Well since they've stated they spent £7.7m just on temp social workers, unless they've employed a legion of social workers the numbers are an absolute pisstake even for day rates....say they got 50 temp social workers working full time for a full year which I'd imagine is way more than they actually have had on temp contracts/ day rates that works out at a mind boggling £154k per temp.
Now I'm not sure what your average social worker earns but I'm pretty sure even if you advertised posts at £75k a year you'd get plenty of takers and still be up £3.5m quid a year on the deal.
And even 50 social workers for Sunderland seems a pretty hefty amount of social workers so I guess that number is a lot smaller
Some Random Guy
Striker
Depends what they are doing mate.
I remember when this happened, shit loads of DoLs reviews had to be done. There were people making thousands of pounds over a weekend by going to authorities with backlogs. Not even doing it full time, they would head back to work on Monday and do their day job.
I have no idea what is going on in Sunderland's children's services, that is just an example of shit that can happen that costs a bomb.
Boz33
Striker
Oh I understand things can quickly rack up and you can have your eyes taken out by contractors effectively, but Christ that's an insane amount of money for a northern council in a cheap area to be splurging on social workers...bearing in mind newcastles temp bill is so much less and deprived areas / people will be similar in both authorities really.
In fact I wonder how many social workers we are talking about?
Did I read @janey is a social worker somewhere on here? If so I guess she may know how many approx social workers are in Sunderland at any one time?
Also I'm not sure about this whole council forming a seperate company to deal with taking them on from agency's etc, surely it's just yet another level of governance to be paid for besides the cost of the temps themselves
Some Random Guy
Striker
Mate, I can't get my head around the amount of money. As you say it's insane.
They got an inadequate rating from OFSTED so big changes were required. You can't compare Sunderland to Newcastle. It's more expensive to reinvent the wheel than to keep it spinning.
It's an eye watering amount.
the boot
Winger
Boz33
Striker
It is, and I'm pretty sure a proper breakdown will never be forthcoming from the council, but I do think greater care has to be given to how they splash the funds around especially nowadays when so much other stuff has to be paid for, or indeed sticking some towards things like helping the culture vultures keep some decent momentum up since the bid lost etc.
Possibly is a few, but when you have Newcastle spending 157k and another 11 local authorities spending what was it? £8m between them, you then look at sunderland's numbers and they are enormous in comparison. It's not like the area is any better or worse than any other area in the northeast
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Some Random Guy
Striker
You aren't getting this "inadequate" thing are you?
Boz33
Striker
Inadequate!, they'd have to be downright incompetent to be splurging that much to fix it.You aren't getting this "inadequate" thing are you?
And according to the article
"With Together for Children still rated as inadequate by Ofsted it will be an uphill struggle to recruit a permanent workforce capable of turning the department round."
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the boot
Winger
Aye but I think the council has failed for a long time by the sounds of it. Probably won't help the gaffer resigning but hopefully it will right itself. As @janey as said next year spending maybe more inline.
No matter how ya look at it the council have failed on this one but am sure they will not be criticised by some on here.
Someone already posted about the money being spent else where which is an insult to the social workers and the kids.
They were pretty much given no choice about forming the company, after the awful OFSTED. And there have been agency Social Workers in Sunderland since at least 2007, the company made no difference to this.
The company took over running Social Services from the Council.
I agree it’s an insane amount of money, part of the problem is/was that Sunderland had a bad rep, so they had to pay higher hourly rates than neighbouring LA’s. So for example, if South Tynside were be paying agency Social Workers £30 an hour, Sunderland would have to pay more to encourage Social Workers to move to work for them. This will mount up and will contribute to the high levels of money paid.
There aren’t as many agency workers now as there has been, plus since September agency rates have been capped across the NE so one can’t pay more than the other.
As I said it will be interesting to see this financial years figures.
the boot
Winger
Is the company not the council though janey?
Boz33
Striker
Thing is though surely it's better to offer great wages, say 75k to attract the best from across the region to come work full time rather than messing with temps all the time, they'd still be well ahead money wise.
As you say at the end of this financial year the numbers will be scrutinised again, but with Sunderland still being inadequate even after all the extra money has been pumped in so far is there any real chance that the numbers or indeed the performance will be any better.
Personally I'd rather the council paid above average attractive wages to get the best permanent motivated staff from across the region rather than paying temps to dip in and out and not possibly have the long term commitments to the clients and cases as it were...bearing in mind every extra penny going towards this will be getting cut from other budgets to cover it
I couldn’t agree more that it would be better to pay permanent staff more, problem is the bands and gradings are set nationally for permanent staff
Social Services is no longer run by the Council, it’s a private company. I don’t fully understand how it works myself, but it’s a separate organisation now.
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Boz33
Striker
Surely ways around that, nowt stopping the council doing a bonus scheme to top them up, or some other workaround. It's staggering that to get staff the council is paying well over the top for people that may not be of the quality that's needed to actually improve the situation. Then if the situation doesn't improve the same merry go round has to be repeated again and again
DLT
Central Defender
The agency rate in Sunderland for a standard social worker will be £35 per hour (not taking in to account any extra they will need to pay the agency). They have a very high percentage of agency staff. What will be bumping that up will be the agency middle and senior managers they will have brought in who will be on a fair amount more.
To put it in to perspective if they were bringing in none agency workers on permanent contracts they'd be looking at about £15 - £20 per hour (granted they'd need to pay for holiday/sickness pay and pensions). However not many would go to Sunderland for none agency rates due to how much of a mess the place has been.
I think someone mentioned a figure of 50 social workers, it will be a lot more than that across the authority, think 150 - 300. Granted only a certain percentage will be agency.
To put it in to perspective if they were bringing in none agency workers on permanent contracts they'd be looking at about £15 - £20 per hour (granted they'd need to pay for holiday/sickness pay and pensions). However not many would go to Sunderland for none agency rates due to how much of a mess the place has been.
I think someone mentioned a figure of 50 social workers, it will be a lot more than that across the authority, think 150 - 300. Granted only a certain percentage will be agency.
the boot
Winger
I've just looked it up the company that runs child services is solely owned by the council. Sounds a bit like Gentoo. Anyway I hope it improves not just for the kids but for yous lot as well. I know it's a nightmare working with temps on long term commitments.
Boz33
Striker
Gotta piss off any that are permanent looking at what the temps earn in comparison
