Vaux site......

Osklen said:
In fairness I’m not sure the council could have bought the site before 2011 as an agreement in principal was only reached in 2010, however most of the funding I believe came from One North East and Homes & Communities Agency anyway.

Sunderland City Council buys former Vaux brewery site http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-wear-12577135

That is not to say that the council chose not to acquire the site in the 1998/98 when it closed and we’re happy for Tesco or someone else to development the site at that time. if that was the case then that is the labour council of that times fault. After that then they are always playing catch up but it is not the same labour council now as then. Equally would the other parties at the time acquired it? Who knows?

But you are right it’s time for people to move on from that and look to what is now being delivered.
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The council had a 15 year plan/development plan that they were required by law to have back in the early 2000's. The sudden availability of a lot of prime land in the centre of Sunderland threw a bit of a spanner in that tbf.
 


Paddy O'Dors said:
Seeing as you have a trial date in February for abusing and harassing politicians on social media I thought you might be keeping a low profile on the internet Len.
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There are many Len Lowthers in Sunderland who are of the same opinion as him.You dont even live here and havent done for many years by your past comments so your misguided input is diluted.
 
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Tbf I think council wise they have had their hands tied or spanners thrown in the works (carillion collapse for example) for a long time. And like it as been said, would any other council have done better.
I was watching a news feature about shields 2 neets ago about high st struggling and the councillor interviewed blamed thatcher as did some locals. It got me thinking do these councillors ever take the blame for anything? Is it a rule in politics not admit to wrong doing?
And did these locals not think 30 year is a long time sort it?
 
the boot said:
Tbf I think council wise they have had their hands tied or spanners thrown in the works (carillion collapse for example) for a long time. And like it as been said, would any other council have done better.
I was watching a news feature about shields 2 neets ago about high st struggling and the councillor interviewed blamed thatcher as did some locals. It got me thinking do these councillors ever take the blame for anything? Is it a rule in politics not admit to wrong doing?
And did these locals not think 30 year is a long time sort it?
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Look at So Shields seafront then compare to Seaburn.Enough said.Please no more excuses for Sunderland LABOUR council.!!! Please.
 
Sid James Park said:
Look at So Shields seafront then compare to Seaburn.Enough said.Please no more excuses for Sunderland LABOUR council.!!! Please.
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you seem passionate (a bit radged) - so, who do you suggest the fine people of sunderland should vote for in the next local elections? and what could the next lot do differently to the current council to encourage growth, private investment etc.. ?

i'm not a massive fan of our council, i think there has been a lot of 'jobs for boys' and people doing the bare minimum for a long time, but the last 3 or 4 years has seen some interesting and positive things happening. i'm interested to know what people think they could do differently? i don't think the problem of a dying town centre - in terms of retail - is anything exclusive to sunderland. for me, the key problem any council faces in a town like sunderland, that would eventually solve a lot issues, is increasing footfall throughout the city centre, both by day and by night. do this, means more jobs in the city centre, more people living in the city centre, more parking, better public transport facilities etc.. i don't know the answer. it would be nice if Keel Square somehow had a metro stop or better connection by bus
 
the boot said:
Tbf I think council wise they have had their hands tied or spanners thrown in the works (carillion collapse for example) for a long time. And like it as been said, would any other council have done better.
I was watching a news feature about shields 2 neets ago about high st struggling and the councillor interviewed blamed thatcher as did some locals. It got me thinking do these councillors ever take the blame for anything? Is it a rule in politics not admit to wrong doing?
And did these locals not think 30 year is a long time sort it?
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High Streets are struggling everywhere. Nothing to do with tribal politics, just changing habits. Even that local stalwart of the high street the bookies is turning now. My local Billy Hill's closed down last week due to doing more business online and not enough customers in the shop.

A politician's default mode is to blame the opposition first, even if they opposition weren't in any position to change it. Negative campaigning or summat it's called.
tunstallhill said:
you seem passionate (a bit radged) - so, who do you suggest the fine people of sunderland should vote for in the next local elections? and what could the next lot do differently to the current council to encourage growth, private investment etc.. ?

i'm not a massive fan of our council, i think there has been a lot of 'jobs for boys' and people doing the bare minimum for a long time, but the last 3 or 4 years has seen some interesting and positive things happening. i'm interested to know what people think they could do differently? i don't think the problem of a dying town centre - in terms of retail - is anything exclusive to sunderland. for me, the key problem any council faces in a town like sunderland, that would eventually solve a lot issues, is increasing footfall throughout the city centre, both by day and by night. do this, means more jobs in the city centre, more people living in the city centre, more parking, better public transport facilities etc.. i don't know the answer. it would be nice if Keel Square somehow had a metro stop or better connection by bus
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I think a few of the routes were changed last year so that buses went up there instead of down John Street/Fawcett Street. The Metro is only a couple of minutes walk tbf.
 
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Paddy O'Dors said:
I think a few of the routes were changed last year so that buses went up there instead of down John Street/Fawcett Street. The Metro is only a couple of minutes walk tbf.
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aye i mean it wouldnt and doesnt make any difference to me when using that area (empire, fire station etc..) it would just have been nice, impossible as it is, to have a dedicated metro stop called Keel Square. i've seen the bus stop over there but i don't think i've ever seen it being used. like i said, its just small details, nice-to-haves not show stoppers.
 
tunstallhill said:
aye i mean it wouldnt and doesnt make any difference to me when using that area (empire, fire station etc..) it would just have been nice, impossible as it is, to have a dedicated metro stop called Keel Square. i've seen the bus stop over there but i don't think i've ever seen it being used. like i said, its just small details, nice-to-haves not show stoppers.
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I think this will change when the new Civic Centre is built and open to the public, people will have a reason to go to that part of town.
 
royaldragon said:
I think this will change when the new Civic Centre is built and open to the public, people will have a reason to go to that part of town.
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Like I have droned on about for ages, we need to use it to bring new business in. A site that big and that has been under such debate over the years can’t just be used to jockey business about that already here. To me it should create more than a thousand new jobs from either new or expanding companies.
I know it’s about footfall but footfall doesn’t guarantee success just look at the top end of the town beside parklane which is the busiest part atm.
 
the boot said:
Like I have droned on about for ages, we need to use it to bring new business in. A site that big and that has been under such debate over the years can’t just be used to jockey business about that already here. To me it should create more than a thousand new jobs from either new or expanding companies.
I know it’s about footfall but footfall doesn’t guarantee success just look at the top end of the town beside parklane which is the busiest part atm.
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Agree with all of that and some of it will be to try and stop businesses from leaking from Sunderland.

There will always be displacement of businesses from one part of the city centre but they also definitely need to create new jobs from organisations outside of the city centre but preferably outside of Sunderland...if that’s not possible then even businesses relocating from doxford park or even wessington way would be a good start.
royaldragon said:
I think this will change when the new Civic Centre is built and open to the public, people will have a reason to go to that part of town.
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Also if they build the pedestrian footbridge it will also direct people through the Vaux site rather which will help support the rational of putting active uses on gf of office developments on the site. Quite an expensive reason mind you but should look good.
tunstallhill said:
aye i mean it wouldnt and doesnt make any difference to me when using that area (empire, fire station etc..) it would just have been nice, impossible as it is, to have a dedicated metro stop called Keel Square. i've seen the bus stop over there but i don't think i've ever seen it being used. like i said, its just small details, nice-to-haves not show stoppers.
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They really need to try and improve High St West as it’s going to be the main route between Vaux/keel sq and train station.
Sid James Park said:
Look at So Shields seafront then compare to Seaburn.Enough said.Please no more excuses for Sunderland LABOUR council.!!! Please.
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Do you genuinely like South Shields sea front? Do you want a fair and a leisure centre on it?
 
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Osklen said:
Agree with all of that and some of it will be to try and stop businesses from leaking from Sunderland.

There will always be displacement of businesses from one part of the city centre but they also definitely need to create new jobs from organisations outside of the city centre but preferably outside of Sunderland...if that’s not possible then even businesses relocating from doxford park or even wessington way would be a good start.
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I get that will help Vaux but will that not just start the demise of them
Places? Mind they need to sort the back of the town out traffic wise. It’s a nightmare atm trying to get to the Vaux site coming through Hendon way. Does anyone know if this is up for upgrading or change?
 
the boot said:
I get that will help Vaux but will that not just start the demise of them
Places? Mind they need to sort the back of the town out traffic wise. It’s a nightmare atm trying to get to the Vaux site coming through Hendon way. Does anyone know if this is up for upgrading or change?
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It will ultimately cause the demise of some of these areas but at the moment I personally think that the city centre is just a mess and they need to get one or two parts of it right and then let it expand from there back into those areas. At present values for rent of retail and office accommodation is so low that it’s not viable for private organisations / developers.

If they can concentrate development then hopefully this can focus footfall which in turn should hopefully make retail and leisure more profitable, improving the offer and which should push up rents in those areas with those on the periphery becoming more attractive for redevelopment.
 

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