UK electricity generation

[AndyGray1985]

The bi product of too much energy is hydrogen yet they don't seem to be taking it onboard?

There are huge investments needed to do this - and you need the "free/very cheap" energy to make it economically viable. And the demand for liquid hydrogen for cars that rarely exist today and are relatively expensive to manufacture vs. EV's and needs a new distribution network for the hydrogen...

 

[citybythesea]

So we are going to have a load of redundant stuff sometime in the near future. What do we do with it? Can it be recycled?

indeed it can be recycled easily and restarted again in comparison to say spent fuel rods from nuclear power that has a half-life of 160,000 years or finite sources that has environmental implications.
It’s basically using the excess electricity to store it for later

 

[joemcdokes]

There are huge investments needed to do this - and you need the "free/very cheap" energy to make it economically viable. And the demand for liquid hydrogen for cars that rarely exist today and are relatively expensive to manufacture vs. EV's and need a new distribution network...

Would a ramp up make the it more viable due to sales, it's obviously an environmentally friendly power. (well at the exit)
I mean oil would've been extremely expensive initially to produce.

 

[Kevj]

The bi product of too much energy is hydrogen yet they don't seem to be taking it onboard?

They are taking this on board. Hydrogen as a stand alone element is dangerous. Combine it with Nitrogen and it becomes easier to handle, transport and store.

. EV's and needs a new distribution network for the hydrogen...

Or you power powerstations with Hydrogen to generate electricity. Energy losses aside, it’s a clean process.

 

[AndyGray1985]

They are taking this on board. Hydrogen as a stand alone element is dangerous. Combine it with Nitrogen and it becomes easier to handle, transport and store.


Or you power powerstations with Hydrogen to generate electricity. Energy losses aside, it’s a clean process.

Net you probably lose 50% vs. on average 5-10% with a flywheel tech... Which Siemens btw. is also investing in.

The whole macro change to electricity powering "everything" is very exiting, and already the most polluting sources of energy are the most expensive, which shows that taxation works

 

[Kevj]

Net you probably lose 50% vs. on average 5-10% with a flywheel tech... Which Siemens btw. is also investing in.

The whole macro change to electricity powering "everything" is very exiting, and already the most polluting sources of energy are the most expensive, which shows that taxation works

I suppose they are ploughing money into R&D across a number of emerging technologies as they don’t at this time know which one will take market dominance or to be established in a number as the need to use fossil fuels dies off and newer energy sources take the lead.

 

[Paddy O'Dors]

we import around half the gas we need from Russia and Norway but we’ve already got storage capabilities for about 44%

All underground.

 

[jayjaysafc]

One downside to this which has been in general a success.

Wind farms paid record £.9.3m to switch off their turbines

Is it .9 or .3 ?

 

[Kevj]

Is it .9 or .3 ?

£9.3m. Not sure what happened there as that is a copy/ paste from the URL.

 

[jayjaysafc]

£9.3m. Not sure what happened there as that is a copy/ paste from the URL.

It’s on the Telegraph headline too

 

[Kevj]

It’s on the Telegraph headline too

It’s on twice. Once in the title and again in t he first paragraph, but then it goes on to state sub values all above the million mark.

 

[spitfire]

indeed it can be recycled easily and restarted again in comparison to say spent fuel rods from nuclear power that has a half-life of 160,000 years or finite sources that has environmental implications.
It’s basically using the excess electricity to store it for later

So is there a long term plan to replace these things with new ones as they reach the end of their working life, I assume so otherwise the country will be littered with them, or does a commitment to decommissioning and removal form a part of getting planning in the first place. I suppose they are just like modern day windmills, but everyone loves a windmill.

 

[citybythesea]

So is there a long term plan to replace these things with new ones as they reach the end of their working life, I assume so otherwise the country will be littered with them, or does a commitment to decommissioning and removal form a part of getting planning in the first place. I suppose they are just like modern day windmills, but everyone loves a windmill.

Any worries about them littering the place would be unfounded. We’ve got well rehearsed means for recycling despite them having a 25-30years lifespan. Scrap value means there’d be plenty of ways to recycle them. The operators of wind farms are responsible them.

 

[Kevj]

Any worries about them littering the place would be unfounded. We’ve got well rehearsed means for recycling despite them having a 25-30years lifespan. Scrap value means there’d be plenty of ways to recycle them. The operators of wind farms are responsible them.

Very unfortunate timing. I was just reading this on LinkedIn.

Wind Turbine Blades Can’t Be Recycled, So They’re Piling Up in Landfills

All steel above seabed level is recyclable, but monopiles and jacket pin piles will be cut off leaving all steel below ground in the ground. Particularly if it’s grouted to prevent scour. No way of vibrating them out too.

Floating wind is the way forward.

 

[citybythesea]

Very unfortunate timing. I was just reading this on LinkedIn.

Wind Turbine Blades Can’t Be Recycled, So They’re Piling Up in Landfills

All steel above seabed level is recyclable, but monopiles and jacket pin piles will be cut off leaving all steel below ground in the ground. Particularly if it’s grouted to prevent scour. No way of vibrating them out too.

Floating wind is the way forward.

I’m amazed at that considering they’re around 80% steel! I’d imagine the blades are biggest amount of fibre glass.....still makes it wasteful

 

[PTR]

The next stage is to find effective ways of medium term storage.

I bet hardly anyone knows about how the grid is really powered - by rotational momentum, basically.

Very unfortunate timing. I was just reading this on LinkedIn.

Wind Turbine Blades Can’t Be Recycled, So They’re Piling Up in Landfills

All steel above seabed level is recyclable, but monopiles and jacket pin piles will be cut off leaving all steel below ground in the ground. Particularly if it’s grouted to prevent scour. No way of vibrating them out too.

Floating wind is the way forward.

Ah, these problems almost always find a solution these days. For example:
"One start-up, Global Fiberglass Solutions, developed a method to break down blades and press them into pellets and fiber boards to be used for flooring and walls. The company started producing samples at a plant in Sweetwater, Texas, near the continent’s largest concentration of wind farms. It plans another operation in Iowa.

“We can process 99.9% of a blade and handle about 6,000 to 7,000 blades a year per plant,” said Chief Executive Officer Don Lilly.
"

 

[AndyGray1985]

I bet hardly anyone knows about how the grid is really powered - by rotational momentum, basically.


Ah, these problems almost always find a solution these days. For example:
"One start-up, Global Fiberglass Solutions, developed a method to break down blades and press them into pellets and fiber boards to be used for flooring and walls. The company started producing samples at a plant in Sweetwater, Texas, near the continent’s largest concentration of wind farms. It plans another operation in Iowa.

“We can process 99.9% of a blade and handle about 6,000 to 7,000 blades a year per plant,” said Chief Executive Officer Don Lilly.
"

These types of businesses are usually dependant on getting a lot of their income from receiving the recycled materials. But it might work

 

[Kevj]

I’m amazed at that considering they’re around 80% steel! I’d imagine the blades are biggest amount of fibre glass.....still makes it wasteful

The main structural components are steel, with the potential for concrete gravity based systems, but these are not prevalent. If you take a typical monopile foundation, the embedment is around 50% of the length, sometimes significantly more if the seabed is weak. These structures can be 100m in length and in excess of 1,000Te each. Doggerbank, when built, will be up to 1,000 turbines.

That article does focus on fibreglass blades.

I bet hardly anyone knows about how the grid is really powered - by rotational momentum, basically.


Ah, these problems almost always find a solution these days. For example:
"One start-up, Global Fiberglass Solutions, developed a method to break down blades and press them into pellets and fiber boards to be used for flooring and walls. The company started producing samples at a plant in Sweetwater, Texas, near the continent’s largest concentration of wind farms. It plans another operation in Iowa.

“We can process 99.9% of a blade and handle about 6,000 to 7,000 blades a year per plant,” said Chief Executive Officer Don Lilly.
"

I'd agree. this is a problem now which will generate a market to overcome this problem.

 

[legend7]

I didn't know they had to do that. It's a bit like a site I saw that made umbrellas out of cardboard

Its only because the grid can't handle the amount if all of them are putting loads in.
We pay out millions a year as if some are told to shut down we have to subsidise them to do it.

 

[Fcomp]

The UK is still playing catchup with France which regularly has 90%+ carbon free generation because it built up its nuclear generation capacity.
The UK could have been in the same position if it wasn't for the poor political decisions of the 1980/90s.