fyl2u
Striker
I think you've misread my post.
Also you should google the word pretentious.
Also also, you've missed the intended irony of my post.
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Tool
- Thread starter Discopants91
- Start date
I think you've misread my post.
Also you should google the word pretentious.
Also also, you've missed the intended irony of my post.
JAZZMANB
Striker
Busy bloke ,have a likeI think you've misread my post.
Also you should google the word pretentious.
Also also, you've missed the intended irony of my post.
I'd say hamming it up is pretentiousness, giving the impression you're suffering for your art when it's an act
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fyl2u
Striker
Possibly, but if that's the case then I'd say Tool definitely don't fit into that category whereas plenty of punk bands probably do.
Weren't The Sex Pistols a load of middle class kids pretending to be louts or am I misremembering that one?
Spitting on crowds, taking shits on the stage, starting fights at your own gigs... Surely punk is the pinnacle of pretentiousness using your definition?
JAZZMANB
Striker
As you said I jumped in the middle of something and merely commented on that reply you gave .Its pretty much a case on case topic ,cant see how you can say "punk" .
Rotten was the real deal,Jones was just having a laugh ,Vicious was Comedy punk .I find Strummer a bit pretentious but The Stranglers 100% kosher although Hugh was a frustrated Cliff Richard wannabee
I see people like Deacon blue and Del amitri with their faux angst and hair stroking and think Fk right off
fyl2u
Striker
In that case I think we're sort of in agreement about what pretentiousness is in music. It's to an extent an equivalent of cultural appropriation - people pretending they're from a background they're not, whether that be in the guise of "I'm more street than I really am" or "I'm more cool than I really am" or "I'm more down to earth than I really am" or whatever.
That said, I don't think that's always necessarily a bad thing. If it were outlawed entirely then we would have to get rid of the movie, TV and theatre industries, because actors make a career out of playing characters that aren't necessarily from the same backgrounds as themselves.
There are certainly some bands that could fit the description of pretentiousness due to having a theatrical nature to their act, but are actually highly entertaining.
I suppose like you say you have to take it on a case by case basis. You can't just say "all prog rock bands are pretentious to the extent that their music isn't worth experiencing".
JAZZMANB
Striker
Agree,except actors are exactly that .If they do it well they look like they aren't ,likewise they can overcook it and fool no one .That's the territory im talking about in music ...I don't mind musicians who quite clearly are entertaining its the shady ground where they go to great lengths to appear god like as they sing about deep things
In that case I think we're sort of in agreement about what pretentiousness is in music. It's to an extent an equivalent of cultural appropriation - people pretending they're from a background they're not, whether that be in the guise of "I'm more street than I really am" or "I'm more cool than I really am" or "I'm more down to earth than I really am" or whatever.
That said, I don't think that's always necessarily a bad thing. If it were outlawed entirely then we would have to get rid of the movie, TV and theatre industries, because actors make a career out of playing characters that aren't necessarily from the same backgrounds as themselves.
There are certainly some bands that could fit the description of pretentiousness due to having a theatrical nature to their act, but are actually highly entertaining.
I suppose like you say you have to take it on a case by case basis. You can't just say "all prog rock bands are pretentious to the extent that their music isn't worth experiencing".
fyl2u
Striker
Part of the beauty of Tool is that they never release their lyrics in the album sleeves, and the reason they give for this is that they don't want the listener to be distracted by the lyrical content. They treat the vocals as an equal instrument with the others in the band rather that the usual sensibility of having the lead vocal most prominent with the other instruments just backing it up.
In earlier live shows the vocalist was up front and centre on the stage but later in their career he moved to the back left, alongside the drummer at back right, with the guitarist and bassist standing front left and front right on the stage.
For some people this might look pretentious but it's really just mirroring the way they treat the vocals in the recordings of their songs: the vocals aren't more important than the other instruments, they're as important but not the sole focus.
zwartekat
Striker
JAZZMANB
Striker
Yeah ,i'm a big fan but clearly not as full on as some dipping into forums and articles etc .I can take or leave lyrics but for the lyric lovers its all there .I like the anti front man stance .I will say the gap for this record and the whole sideshow of waiting has got a bit weary and i'm not a full on Toolite .Fair do's take your time but saying they're working hard on it while doing loads of shows of 15 year old material is a bit much
See what live Uk stuff follows ,not a big arena fan .Really enjoyed the Academy size dates last time
fyl2u
Striker
It has got a bit tired waiting all this time. I know they've been active in other bands, Maynard particularly, but every time there's a news article saying "new Tool album this year" I've got to the point where it's "yeah, sure".
Although I do consider myself a big fan, to be fair it's the Lateralus album that got me hooked for this long. I enjoyed their earlier stuff but not to anywhere near the same degree as with that album, and I can forgive the bits of 10,000 Days that I wasn't so keen on because of the personal nature of the subject matter, but it is Lateralus that has kept me hanging on for new material all this time.
With them having taken so long with this album I'm living in hope that it's going to be a masterpiece to rival Lateralus but who knows, they might pull a Faith No More and just release a piece of crap that bares little resemblance to their former selves and hasn't much value as a new direction either instead. Hopefully not.
fyl2u
Striker
I'm not familiar with them. Cheers for the recommendation, I'll check them out when I get home! Any other tracks/albums of theirs I should check out?
ilovehorswill
Striker
Sounds like one of their tracks
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Lexingtongue
Guest
They're all great. But my favourite is Somewhere Along the Highway. I reckon you'll love them.
fyl2u
Striker
Just had a listen to The Silent Man. The music's canny but I'm not really into this style of vocals. Are all his vocals like that or is this a one-off for this song?
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L
Lexingtongue
Guest
All of them. Listen to their other stuff. Musically they are very impressive. Don't mind his vocals myself.
fyl2u
Striker
I don't mind a bit of that sort of vocals in amongst other styles, but there are few bands I can listen to that have that sort of vocal all the time. I'll give it a go though. I'll check out that Somewhere Along The Highway album tomorrow after the missus has left but before the match.
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Lexingtongue
Guest
They have some spoken songs in that one, slower stuff. Melodically they can't be beaten for me. Spiritual successors to Isis and Neurosis, so I'm told. If you listen to all their stuff I reckon you'll find a lot to appreciate.I don't mind a bit of that sort of vocals in amongst other styles, but there are few bands I can listen to that have that sort of vocal all the time. I'll give it a go though. I'll check out that Somewhere Along The Highway album tomorrow after the missus has left but before the match.
fyl2u
Striker
I've explored my tipping point on this sort of thing in the past. One band I remember from the 90's pretty much epitomises where my line is; Pro-Pain. Quite enjoyed a lot of stuff on the first album, like this...
...but then on the second album he was like this instead all the time and I just didn't get into it at all...
He'd lost all the melody (what little he was doing) and was just doing the one-note shouty growly thing all the time instead.
Basically, I don't mind the shouty, growly style of vocals as long as there's some melody sometimes.
If it's all one note all the time then I'm not so much into it.
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