The system (part 3)


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Based on his time at spurs and his debut yesterday i ,d be packing a suitcase for kaboul , joke of a signing rather play coates with oshea and let him learn his trade he'S young and at least has potential , i know nothing about mvila but if he doesnt have an immediate impact we are dead.arson , catts . And rodwell the three of em might as well play facing their own goal so negative , catts looked tgis bad all preseason and hasnt got any better, fullbacks bombing forward acphrase that doesnt apply to jones imo , poor defender and offer nothing at the other end , not a sngle cross from him yesterday which is the norm. The way we got hit time and time again onbthe break i agree 442 might have solidified us more but at 3-0 down at least dick didnt go into damage limitation mode at halftime.
Sad to say i saw this coming , dick should have been thanked for saving us and shown the door, basucally he turned us into a sit deep and launch it team. Dont even get me started on the lack of quality additions in this window, yesterday will have Been an expected consequence to dick and his staff , he hasnt got the players he wanted and it is obvious our owner has closed his wallet , in short this is the season we are flushed down the drain to join the boro in the shit league.
Kaboul may provide the occasional set piece scoring threat. Otherwise, he's too careless and overconfident despite being prone to making fundamental defending mistakes. He's infuriating to watch. And it's amazing that SAFC bought him despite Pochettino being clear he was getting rid of the cancer/deadwood at spurs this summer.
 
Kaboul may provide the occasional set piece scoring threat. Otherwise, he's too careless and overconfident despite being prone to making fundamental defending mistakes. He's infuriating to watch. And it's amazing that SAFC bought him despite Pochettino being clear he was getting rid of the cancer/deadwood at spurs this summer.
Kaboul was a regular in redknapps team that was one of best in league. He is a v good centre half who may have a an error in them but who will be solid when given a run in team. Nowt wrong with kaboul
 
So, the first game of the season has been and gone and it really was a nightmare.

I am really disappointed how we crumbled and looked disjointed, unorganized and far to open to any form of attack. Yes, the players have to take individual responsibility for their actions and performances however, is the system a to blame ?

People make refer to last year when we played it and got points towards the last part of the season, however, we were in survival mode and the main objective was to defend deep and hope for a counter or to nick a goal. Yday, was not like that, it was meant to be an even game where attacking and defending should have been in equal proportions.

My concerns are, the fullbacks are getting bashed on here, and partially that is right however, I do think they are fighting a losing battle. Having played left back all my life, at a decent level, it's easy to see the faults that PVA made yday as an individual but also just as easy to see what an impossible job he had. Dick instructs the full backs to fly forward at every opportunity, it's more emphasis on attack than defense and you can see this as soon as any CM gets the ball, our full backs are bombing up the wing and are at the half way line quickly. The issue is, our CM is far to rash and poor in terms of ball retention, losing the ball far to quickly and turning over possession. This leaves the fullbacks out of position and exposed. If they don't make the run then we have no width at all and they will get pelters for that too. Furthermore, we ask the wide players to support the loan striker so they are high up the pitch, offering no cover at all to the full backs, again leaving then open to 2-1 situations.

The 2 CH need to be far more organized and know how each other want to play, far to many times one was playing offside and one was playing deep. Coates is a huge concern and should be replaced by JOS. Think JOS and Kaboul will be fine in the middle. More experience and should be more organized.

CM need to step up and hopefully M'vila can add better ball control and we can build attacks instead of losing the ball in the middle of one. Roswell needs to get sharp and quick. Cattermole has a head losing game, not his first and won't be his last.

Wide forwards done ok in the attacking sense, but we really will get hammered down the wings on a defensive side. Think we should change the shape.

Defoe, done what he has always done. Create and he will score. Nice finish and movement for his goal. Fletcher made mistakes when he came on but again, caused issues and made us more effective going forward. Good desire for the goal too.

Going forward ? Maybe a flag 4-4-2 might be better. Cover for the fullbacks and support for Defoe, who can play off Fletcher.

If we get Adanan Jan, maybe a 4-2-3-1 with Lens, Jan and AJ in behind the striker with Catts and M'Vila provide protection and balls forward to the attacking group.

Long winded but feel free to contribute some tactical thoughts. Probably just get we are shite like. :lol:
Think you are spot on with CM and poor ball retention, but the FBs warrant some criticism - there were times when PVA just ignored the winger and strolled back towards goal meaning Kaboul had to cover 2 positions. Not sure 4-4-2 will work unless we play 2 defensive midfielders in the middle. Our midfield is poor enough playing 3 in there, nevermind 2...
 
The ball retention is notoriously shite and has been for some time now. If we are expecting Cattermole and Rodwell to release a first time pass into an onrushing full back, we are going to be very disappointed, they constantly lose the ball when they have time to pick out a pass. The system is OK, it's the personnel trying to carry it out
Should we not then find a system to fit the players we have?
 
433 will never work in a million years with what we have. Has to be the prehistoric 442 for me.
At one point, I thought perhaps it's worth going with a 4-1-4-1. Then two more goals were conceded. I think you're right with the 4-4-2. Keep it simple for the squad. And a big man/little man combination up top in Defoe/Fletcher just works better for both. But where will the pace come from on the wings?
 
At one point, I thought perhaps it's worth going with a 4-1-4-1. Then two more goals were conceded. I think you're right with the 4-4-2. Keep it simple for the squad. And a big man/little man combination up top in Defoe/Fletcher just works better for both. But where will the pace come from on the wings?
Lens and a n other (januzai?).
 
Kaboul was a regular in redknapps team that was one of best in league. He is a v good centre half who may have a an error in them but who will be solid when given a run in team. Nowt wrong with kaboul
I always viewed him as clumsy from even back in his Pompey days. And at Spurs, I thought Dawson had to work twice as hard to cover for his mistakes. But that's just a difference in opinions.
 
Think you are spot on with CM and poor ball retention, but the FBs warrant some criticism - there were times when PVA just ignored the winger and strolled back towards goal meaning Kaboul had to cover 2 positions. Not sure 4-4-2 will work unless we play 2 defensive midfielders in the middle. Our midfield is poor enough playing 3 in there, nevermind 2...

I know, he made individual errors. No doubt about it mate. Just feel that there are improvements across the system that will help specific positions, specifically at full back.
 
Good OP and I agree with all those portioning blame with the CM and their atrociously low level of basic skills. How many bloody years have we been crying out for someone who can put their foot on the ball and control a game from the middle, then when we have Ki there's a bunch of nuggets who don't want to sign him as they're thick as mince. There's been so many threads about formations in the last couple of seasons, and posters on this thread have hit the nail on the head as no matter what formation you play the lads on the pitch have to be able to control and ball, pass and move - attributes which have been sorely lacking in our entire squad for years.

If 4231 operates correctly then it does have an excellent balance of defensive solidity and attacking flare; however, when the FB is pushing forward one of the CMs must drop into the defensive line to cover a breakdown in play - NOT the wide player, as that would negate to benefit of having the FB in an advanced role. The risk of play breaking down is significantly decreased if you have players who are footballers. Football Australia has adopted this as their preferred system and they are encouraging all A-League teams to play it at all levels of the game, so players get used to it from an early age.
 
Good OP and I agree with all those portioning blame with the CM and their atrociously low level of basic skills. How many bloody years have we been crying out for someone who can put their foot on the ball and control a game from the middle, then when we have Ki there's a bunch of nuggets who don't want to sign him as they're thick as mince. There's been so many threads about formations in the last couple of seasons, and posters on this thread have hit the nail on the head as no matter what formation you play the lads on the pitch have to be able to control and ball, pass and move - attributes which have been sorely lacking in our entire squad for years.

If 4231 operates correctly then it does have an excellent balance of defensive solidity and attacking flare; however, when the FB is pushing forward one of the CMs must drop into the defensive line to cover a breakdown in play - NOT the wide player, as that would negate to benefit of having the FB in an advanced role. The risk of play breaking down is significantly decreased if you have players who are footballers. Football Australia has adopted this as their preferred system and they are encouraging all A-League teams to play it at all levels of the game, so players get used to it from an early age.

Good post.
 
I don't even know what to think. 4-2 flatters us, we were just awful and couldn't even stop attacks before reaching our box. There's some major investment needed in our squad like, it's totally dire.
 
Full backs first priority is to defend and that was sadly lacking yesterday.
A good attacking full back chooses his moment to join the attack when he can overlap his winger and get into space. The lack of positional sense by PVA in particular was worrying. We didn't have Stefan Schwartz using his nous to provide cover. Leicester made mincemeat of our left flank and opposition scouts will have made due note.
 
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