Sunderland fans! Hew!


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Still the worst finish in the clubs history, and that's fact, worse than the Denis Smith side, that finshed 1st and went up as champions last time around, its in stone now, simple as that, as i am sure you agree, the club failed last year to gain the target of promotion also fact.

The best possible outcome last season was for us to equal the worst finish in our history. Not managing to avoid it being the worst finish in our history when there was zero chance of beating the previous worst is hardly something that should be used against them. :lol:

Yes we failed to get promotion last year. By one result. Wow, such failure. Hang them all from the rafters!
 
Ah, the old "we didn't take advantage of our games in hand last year, therefore no team ever wins their games in hand" argument.

Classic.
You’re right, I see it now. We may be in a worse position than we were last year, with no manager and a poorer squad but if we win the games in hand we would go above Wycombe. We should count our blessings
 
The best possible outcome last season was for us to equal the worst finish in our history. Not managing to avoid it being the worst finish in our history when there was zero chance of beating the previous worst is hardly something that should be used against them. :lol:

Yes we failed to get promotion last year. By one result. Wow, such failure. Hang them all from the rafters!

First of all i am not using it against them its fact, we failed. secondly in which part of my post did i suggest we hang them ?
 
You’re right, I see it now. We may be in a worse position than we were last year, with no manager and a poorer squad but if we win the games in hand we would go above Wycombe. We should count our blessings

We have no manager because we only just sacked the manager that 95% of this board wanted sacked. :lol:

I'd argue that the current squad is better than the one that finished last season.

You can only go above the clubs you're in the same division as. I don't see how it being Wycombe is relevant in the slightest.
First of all i am not using it against them its fact, we failed. secondly in which part of my post did i suggest we hang them ?

It is fact, but it's a relatively meaningless fact.

You seemed to be indicating that you agreed with the poster I was chatting with. I apologise if you were just being pedantic and actually disagree with him. :)
 
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Ross has gone, so the OP starts another attention seeking, hysterical, fan-bashing attempt at fishing for likes. This time it’s about criticism against the owners.

Oh, and the same ‘like the Mags’ bollocks thrown in.

You could almost cut and paste the other opening post in the thread WM started about Ross and just exchange the names.

Give it a rest, ffs!

Yep, and the 'you're all bairns because you don't understand what's going like I do' bit as well.

His 'fluffing' threads are so well timed you'd think he was linked by mates to RR or summat?
 
We have no manager because we only just sacked the manager that 95% of this board wanted sacked. :lol:

I'd argue that the current squad is better than the one that finished last season.

You can only go above the clubs you're in the same division as. I don't see how it being Wycombe is relevant in the slightest.


It is fact, but it's a relatively meaningless fact.

You seemed to be indicating that you agreed with the poster I was chatting with. I apologise if you were just being pedantic and actually disagree with him. :)

I agree we did fail and isn't meaningless the reason why we are still in league one is due to that, maybe consider this, had the problems from last season been fixed over the summer, maybe just maybe Jack Ross wouldn't now be Unemployed. ?

the biggest problem are still outstanding. true or false ?
 
Yep, and the 'you're all bairns because you don't understand what's going like I do' bit as well.

His 'fluffing' threads are so well timed you'd think he was linked by mates to RR or summat?

Incidentally, I've seen this sort of thing mentioned a couple of times now... What's this sudden connection some people are making between posters being level-headed about SAFC and them being accused of being something to do with RR?

As far as I'm concerned, RR contains some of the most negative, un-level-headed drivel that ever gets published about SAFC. Why are they suddenly being seen to be otherwise? Have I missed something?
I agree we did fail and isn't meaningless the reason why we are still in league one is due to that, maybe consider this, had the problems from last season been fixed over the summer, maybe just maybe Jack Ross wouldn't now be Unemployed. ?

the biggest problem are still outstanding. true or false ?

I'm saying that it's meaningless for us to say it was the worst finish ever when there was no way it could have ever been otherwise. If we'd finished top then it still would have been our joint worst finish in our history.

Which problems from last season do you feel weren't addressed? All the positions we needed new players for, we got them, and at the same time reduced the wage bill so that we continued to conform to the league rules about the wage bill, which we needed to do because of the parachute payments being lower this season than last.

All of this happened while giving us a sustainable business model that would make us an attractive proposition to the investors that we all crave.

So to answer the closing question from your post, I'd say "false".
 
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Incidentally, I've seen this sort of thing mentioned a couple of times now... What's this sudden connection some people are making between posters being level-headed about SAFC and them being accused of being something to do with RR?

As far as I'm concerned, RR contains some of the most negative, un-level-headed drivel that ever gets published about SAFC. Why are they suddenly being seen to be otherwise? Have I missed something?


I'm saying that it's meaningless for us to say it was the worst finish ever when there was no way it could have ever been otherwise. If we'd finished top then it still would have been our joint worst finish in our history.

Which problems from last season do you feel weren't addressed? All the positions we needed new players for, we got them, and at the same time reduced the wage bill so that we continued to conform to the league rules about the wage bill, which we needed to do because of the parachute payments being lower this season than last.

All of this happened while giving us a sustainable business model that would make us an attractive proposition to the investors that we all crave.

So to answer the closing question from your post, I'd say "false".

Pace ? Strenghen ? are problems for me, not able to keep clean sheets ? still outstanding right now, and who mentioned the wage bill, i think you gone off on a tandem there.
 
It was explained over about a 20 minute period in one of the podcasts over the summer. If people want to listen to it and then choose not to believe it thats their perogative but he's explained it multiple times now.

all he said was that the parachute money had gone from the club to madrox and then to SBC (to pay off the debt) and that it would come back into the club "when it was needed", CM piped in that some of it had already come back in as running costs which is fair enough if that is the case.

what they haven't done is put a timeline on the rest of it and the question many of us have is would that money better off in a holding company like madrox or used by the football club to help us get out of this woeful league (transfers, wages).

what is more concerning is that CM has said in the last RAWA minutes that the money still owed (some £20 million) would be taken off the purchase price and the new owners would then put that extra money back into the club (assuming they would do that).
My opinion on that is that there seems currently no plan or schedule to put that money back into the club. there's absolutely nothing illegal in what they've done but it's very concerning given on the face of it we seemingly can't or won't spend money to improve the squad.
 
We had the worst season in Sunderland AFC’s entire history last season. By a distance.

We’re currently 9th.

Newcastle fans are stupid because they’re whinging with their team in the premier league. We’re just above mid table in the third division.

But yay, ticket sales


Nobody has any ambition at SAFC any more.
 
Pace ? Strenghen ? are problems for me, not able to keep clean sheets ? still outstanding right now, and who mentioned the wage bill, i think you gone off on a tandem there.

We've already got some pace in Watmore and Gooch. Willis is a strength upgrade on last year's defence. Were there particular areas you wanted more of either of those traits? Without getting rid of even more of our established squad members than we did and risking it taking even longer for the team to settle, I'm not sure how much more could have been done on those fronts.

Inability to keep clean sheets was something JR was trying to address. Just because we didn't manage to achieve it doesn't mean we weren't trying to. In fact a lot of folks on here were criticising JR for being too defensive with his approach, with many stating they'd rather win 5-4 than 1-0. The club can't please everyone when there's such a broad range of opinions of what we should be doing.

I mentioned the wage bill because it's relevant to your statement of us not addressing the problems of last season. One problem we would have had this season was the wage bill, had we not got rid of Cattermole and Oviedo. We couldn't just go out and buy similar standard players to those two and give the replacements similar wages; our recruitment had to be more sensible money-wise, and we achieved that. Last season we had too many defense-based midfielders and not enough attack-based ones, so we got rid of Catts and brought in Dobson, solving both problems while reducing the wage bill in keeping with the wage rules for L1, which as I said, we needed to do because of the reduced income from parachute payments.

Essentially, as far as I'm concerned, our recruitment this summer did address a lot of the problems from last season. We could all make arguments for buying specific players or buying players with specific traits that we feel we needed, but ask any ten people on this board how they would have gone about our Summer business and you'd get ten different answers that bore little resemblance to each other's, and most of those suggestions would likely have taken us over the league's wage limitations that a lot of folks seem oblivious of or are choosing to ignore.
all he said was that the parachute money had gone from the club to madrox and then to SBC (to pay off the debt) and that it would come back into the club "when it was needed", CM piped in that some of it had already come back in as running costs which is fair enough if that is the case.

what they haven't done is put a timeline on the rest of it and the question many of us have is would that money better off in a holding company like madrox or used by the football club to help us get out of this woeful league (transfers, wages).

what is more concerning is that CM has said in the last RAWA minutes that the money still owed (some £20 million) would be taken off the purchase price and the new owners would then put that extra money back into the club (assuming they would do that).
My opinion on that is that there seems currently no plan or schedule to put that money back into the club. there's absolutely nothing illegal in what they've done but it's very concerning given on the face of it we seemingly can't or won't spend money to improve the squad.

CTD from above:

.... like this person for example.
 
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We've already got some pace in Watmore and Gooch. Willis is a strength upgrade on last year's defence. Were there particular areas you wanted more of either of those traits? Without getting rid of even more of our established squad members than we did and risking it taking even longer for the team to settle, I'm not sure how much more could have been done on those fronts.

Inability to keep clean sheets was something JR was trying to address. Just because we didn't manage to achieve it doesn't mean we weren't trying to. In fact a lot of folks on here were criticising JR for being too defensive with his approach, with many stating they'd rather win 5-4 than 1-0. The club can't please everyone when there's such a broad range of opinions of what we should be doing.

I mentioned the wage bill because it's relevant to your statement of us not addressing the problems of last season. One problem we would have had this season was the wage bill, had we not got rid of Cattermole and Oviedo. We couldn't just go out and buy similar standard players to those two and give the replacements similar wages; our recruitment had to be more sensible money-wise, and we achieved that. Last season we had too many defense-based midfielders and not enough attack-based ones, so we got rid of Catts and brought in Dobson, solving both problems while reducing the wage bill in keeping with the wage rules for L1, which as I said, we needed to do because of the reduced income from parachute payments.

Essentially, as far as I'm concerned, our recruitment this summer did address a lot of the problems from last season. We could all make arguments for buying specific players or buying players with specific traits that we feel we needed, but ask any ten people on this board how they would have gone about our Summer business and you'd get ten different answers that bore little resemblance to each other's, and most of those suggestions would likely have taken us over the league's wage limitations that a lot of folks seem oblivious of or are choosing to ignore.


CTD from above:

.... like this person for example.

I'm pretty sure if you purchase a player you have to pay him a wage too (however large a small that sums is)... 😇
 
I'm pretty sure if you purchase a player you have to pay him a wage too (however large a small that sums is)... 😇

:) Of course. But we are limited by league rules as to how much we can spend on wages and I've seen no evidence to suggest that the club doesn't have the money to pay any and all wages up to that limit. In fact with the club now supposedly being "sustainable" and the league rules stating you can't pay out more than 60% of your turnover in wages (iirc), then even having all the extra cash in the world in the club's bank account wouldn't change the amount we could pay out in wages.
 
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Had the RR podcast not have categorically stated that we were the richest club on the planet we would not be having this conversation would we, isn’t this the point or am I lost somewhere?
 
:) Of course. But we are limited by league rules as to how much we can spend on wages and I've seen no evidence to suggest that the club doesn't have the money to pay any and all wages up to that limit. In fact with the club now supposedly being "sustainable" and the league rules stating you can't pay out more than 60% of your turnover in wages (iirc), then even having all the extra cash in the world in the club's bank account wouldn't change the amount we could pay out in wages.

yep, i'm aware of the 60% rule. I'm assuming we're paying a lot less for the current squad than last season due to the high earners we still had on the books then. assuming also that the parachute payments are included in turnover so until they run out we probably have a little wiggle room(?).
edit: Just read the article in the Chron today that states our wage bill is around £10m and our turnover is estimated at £18m, so it's close.

we're owed one more parachute payment of £16m aren't we?
 
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Does L1 mean no scouts, U23 in free fall, random strategy free signings, no ambition?
I think we have been treading water since the playoff final both on the structural and fooballing side as don was hoping for the takeover to occur !Something or someone has fekked this up and were now looking for a low rent manager and a bone from local investment from the likes of obrein and hays travel!
 
We had the worst season in Sunderland AFC’s entire history last season. By a distance.

We’re currently 9th.

Newcastle fans are stupid because they’re whinging with their team in the premier league. We’re just above mid table in the third division.

But yay, ticket sales

Failure to see that the club could have been / could be in a lot worse situation than it is? It could have been a lot worse.
 
This.

I read stuff constantly on twitter about them lying, being chancers, wanting out to make some quick cash etc and i've never seen one single bit of evidence to back it up. I said on another thread yesterday, if I were SD or CM and I didn't have an emotional attachment to the club, i'd sell to anybody to make a profit, regardless of their intentions for the club and be done with us as the constant accusations and abuse isn't worth it.

Even when he leaves twitter is taken as a "he's just running because theres bad news". No, how about he's getting a load of stick already and it doesnt matter what he says or does he's getting stick. The Sun release a story about him moving the goalposts of the investment deal and he's getting tweets of abuse straight away, because of an article in the f***ing Sun ffs. No wonder he's off twitter. Unless he gets Pep to quit City and join us, MSD take us over, SD gets no money for his initial investment and we instantly have £100 million to spend I genuinely don't think some people would be happy.
Absolutely this. if id had to put up with as much shite as they have id be off like a f**king shot. First chance i got.
 
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