Save Seaburn

Osklen

Goalkeeper
listen carefully.. trust me the front site has been shelved for housing it's going to be leisure only and when and only when the leisure on the front gets moving will the back sites for housing will get started
I’m not saying it hasn’t been shelved, I accept that it has according to that article, my point was that you said there were no interested housing developers for the site. I merely challenged that as being the reason why they’ve are now not doing housing. Clearly they’ve listened to the locals objections now that the council control Siglion.

As for leisure on the front site I’m still unsure what people are expecting?

Imagine living in an executive apartment overlooking Morrison’s, with terrible parking that gets worse in the summer.

To me it all hinges on the stack thing. If its successful it could be the catalyst the sea front needs. Hopefully it works out.
Or have a spectacular view of the beech and sea? I’m fairly sure any competent architect could take full advantage of the location.
 
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MattyW

Full Back
Imagine living in an executive apartment overlooking Morrison’s, with terrible parking that gets worse in the summer.

To me it all hinges on the stack thing. If its successful it could be the catalyst the sea front needs. Hopefully it works out.
The Stack has the potential to become a prime visitor attraction and will hopefully draw in other leisure operators. I like their proposed mixed leisure use of retail, food, drink and family led activities.
 

Osklen

Goalkeeper
The Stack has the potential to become a prime visitor attraction and will hopefully draw in other leisure operators. I like their proposed mixed leisure use of retail, food, drink and family led activities.
I agree with that, albeit it’s only a temporary offer. Good thing is that it will be cheap and flex rate which will hopefully lead to establishing a host of new businesses in the area which could lead to more permanent presence. However that still doesn’t mean that more housing couldn’t have been constructed on the front site in the future.

If people are expecting fairs, amusements etc then fair enough but I personally doing see that as being viable nor what Sunderland sea front should offer personally.
 

luvulongtime

Striker
I’m not saying it hasn’t been shelved, I accept that it has according to that article, my point was that you said there were no interested housing developers for the site. I merely challenged that as being the reason why they’ve are now not doing housing. Clearly they’ve listened to the locals objections now that the council control Siglion.

As for leisure on the front site I’m still unsure what people are expecting?



Or have a spectacular view of the beech and sea? I’m fairly sure any competent architect could take full advantage of the location.

they haven't listened to the locals objections and Siglion was always council controlled the simple fact that there isn't/wasn't any interest has forced their hand. the fairground tarmac stays,a container village where Seaburn centre was, hopefully a hotel where those trains where then Martinos and that's the front sorted
 

Osklen

Goalkeeper
they haven't listened to the locals objections and Siglion was always council controlled the simple fact that there isn't/wasn't any interest has forced their hand. the fairground tarmac stays,a container village where Seaburn centre was, hopefully a hotel where those trains where then Martinos and that's the front sorted
Well we’ll have to agree to disagree as I can’t see how house builders wouldn’t build on the sea front site, Miller are case in point as have the other plots that have become available such as the bus terminus site.

As for Siglion it was part owned by the council and its plans included housing on the current car park, a hotel on the site you mention and leisure offer probably similar in size and scale to what the stack offer all of which are coming forward. So let’s say 30 or 40% of their proposal is being delivered.

If that is extent of people’s ambition for the site then god help Sunderland .
 

luvulongtime

Striker
Well we’ll have to agree to disagree as I can’t see how house builders wouldn’t build on the sea front site, Miller are case in point as have the other plots that have become available such as the bus terminus site.

As for Siglion it was part owned by the council and its plans included housing on the current car park, a hotel on the site you mention and leisure offer probably similar in size and scale to what the stack offer all of which are coming forward. So let’s say 30 or 40% of their proposal is being delivered.

If that is extent of people’s ambition for the site then god help Sunderland .






ok here's the deal if they build houses on the front i'll buy your drink if they don't you buy mine
 

Osklen

Goalkeeper
ok here's the deal if they build houses on the front i'll buy your drink if they don't you buy mine
I’m not saying they are building houses on the front. You are using the argument that they are now not choosing to as they cant as no one (housing developer) is interested, my point is I don’t think that is true.

I’d be surprised if no housing / apt’s or similar is delivered on that part of the site as it would be a real shame. I’m not saying several hundred but some form of housing above retail or similar would help give some scale.
 

luvulongtime

Striker
I’m not saying they are building houses on the front. You are using the argument that they are now not choosing to as they cant as no one (housing developer) is interested, my point is I don’t think that is true.

I’d be surprised if no housing / apt’s or similar is delivered on that part of the site as it would be a real shame. I’m not saying several hundred but some form of housing above retail or similar would help give some scale.

ok i'll scale it down if there's any private housing overlooking the beach from where Seldons is on the corner opp Morrisons to Martinos whether above a leisure outlet or not i'll fill your drink for a night obviously you do the reverse if i'm right
 

Osklen

Goalkeeper
ok i'll scale it down if there's any private housing overlooking the beach from where Seldons is on the corner opp Morrisons to Martinos whether above a leisure outlet or not i'll fill your drink for a night obviously you do the reverse if i'm right
So not a single house on the entire site? Hey it’s a pint and will probably take 10 years to develop out so why not.

You accept the point however that housing developers would be interested in the site for housing?

Matty I noticed you liked these posts but seriously what leisure do you and/or others expect to see?
 

MattyW

Full Back
So not a single house on the entire site? Hey it’s a pint and will probably take 10 years to develop out so why not.

You accept the point however that housing developers would be interested in the site for housing?

Matty I noticed you liked these posts but seriously what leisure do you and/or others expect to see?
Any leisure, bars, restaurants, family led leisure hotel, arcades, crazy golf, mono rail. And about 100 residential dwellings to provide additional footfall ... oh wait... isn’t that what SaveSeaburn has been campaigning for?
 

Osklen

Goalkeeper
Any leisure, bars, restaurants, family led leisure hotel, arcades, crazy golf, mono rail. And about 100 residential dwellings to provide additional footfall ... oh wait... isn’t that what SaveSeaburn has been campaigning for?
But isn’t that predominantly what Siglion were going to offer albeit with some additional housing?

Not sure what family led leisure is? You talking about soft play etc?
 

Bob Fleming

Striker
Mixed thoughts on this. I didn't like the Siglion plans for the front. I agreed it was a little too much housing and not a good enough leisure offering. A big proper adventure playground and splash park thing like what they have at chester le street would have been ideal.

My issue now is the council now go back to the drawing board. Have wasted god knows how much on this with next to fuck all progress. And they now simply chuck this out the window, go back to square one and take a few more years to come up with another plan. Which may or may not get implemented.
As welcome as Stack is it is going to give the council and excuse to sit on their hands for a while.

Shame this is in Parsnip really.
@AB22 Easy Tiger could do with putting this back on SMB.
 

Osklen

Goalkeeper
Mixed thoughts on this. I didn't like the Siglion plans for the front. I agreed it was a little too much housing and not a good enough leisure offering. A big proper adventure playground and splash park thing like what they have at chester le street would have been ideal.

My issue now is the council now go back to the drawing board. Have wasted god knows how much on this with next to fuck all progress. And they now simply chuck this out the window, go back to square one and take a few more years to come up with another plan. Which may or may not get implemented.
As welcome as Stack is it is going to give the council and excuse to sit on their hands for a while.

Shame this is in Parsnip really.
@AB22 Easy Tiger could do with putting this back on SMB.
Yeah that’s the issue as unfortunately I suspect those things that you suggest wanting such as adventure play park and splash park will be expensive and to be honest could be delivered in Roker park or elsewhere.

My main concern is that no matter what the council do the people of seaburn just won’t agree with it full stop, so therefore nothing will happen.

The leisure offer that people seem to want appears to require council subsidy in the main. If it is a private offer then it’s likely to be of industrial scale and type (sheds), therefore likely to be a blot on the sea front.
 

MattyW

Full Back
But isn’t that predominantly what Siglion were going to offer albeit with some additional housing?

Not sure what family led leisure is? You talking about soft play etc?
Siglion never wanted leisure, they just wanted 279 (came down from 450 after SaveSeaburn pressure) residential dwellings. They never listened to public opinion and had a dedicated WDSC trolling gang which they employed to promote their housing estate. What Sunderland needs is a leisure, recreation filled seafront at Seaburn with some executive housing to provide footfall.
 

Osklen

Goalkeeper
Siglion never wanted leisure, they just wanted 279 (came down from 450 after SaveSeaburn pressure) residential dwellings. They never listened to public opinion and had a dedicated WDSC trolling gang which they employed to promote their housing estate. What Sunderland needs is a leisure, recreation filled seafront at Seaburn with some executive housing to provide footfall.
You mean a dedicated WDSC trolling gang the same as an anti-wdsc trolling gang, ie those for and against the development?

Why don’t people have to think there is always a conspiracy.

I agree that the sea front needs a leisure development / offer I just don’t think it needs to replicate South Shields. I personally think it should follow the tynemouth model (if possible).
 

Bob Fleming

Striker
Yeah that’s the issue as unfortunately I suspect those things that you suggest wanting such as adventure play park and splash park will be expensive and to be honest could be delivered in Roker park or elsewhere.

My main concern is that no matter what the council do the people of seaburn just won’t agree with it full stop, so therefore nothing will happen.

The leisure offer that people seem to want appears to require council subsidy in the main. If it is a private offer then it’s likely to be of industrial scale and type (sheds), therefore likely to be a blot on the sea front.
Adventure playground and splash pads can be council provided quite easily. It needs a mix of leisure down there and some will be private. I suspect little has been forthcoming during Siglions time to line anything up. But then what were they actually trying to recruit down there? Their plans and thoughts for what would be on offer were pretty much non existent other than the housing.

At the moment all I am seeing is (other than the stack) more years of fuck all happening.
 

Osklen

Goalkeeper
Adventure playground and splash pads can be council provided quite easily. It needs a mix of leisure down there and some will be private. I suspect little has been forthcoming during Siglions time to line anything up. But then what were they actually trying to recruit down there? Their plans and thoughts for what would be on offer were pretty much non existent other than the housing.

At the moment all I am seeing is (other than the stack) more years of fuck all happening.
I don’t disagree with what you are saying that the council could fund those things I suppose my view is that could be provided elsewhere other than that site. Just checking the Siglion outline planning consent it allowed for c. 45,000ft2 of leisure, 30,0000ft2 of and 20,000 retail plus 279 houses and a hotel.

I’m sure they’ll have explored leisure as an opportunity as they will deal with agents every day but I suspect it would have been based on a commercial basis (renting space) rather than a council funded project, that is unless the council wanted to fund a scheme such as one you suggested.
 

Bob Fleming

Striker
I don’t disagree with what you are saying that the council could fund those things I suppose my view is that could be provided elsewhere other than that site. Just checking the Siglion outline planning consent it allowed for c. 45,000ft2 of leisure, 30,0000ft2 of and 20,000 retail plus 279 houses and a hotel.

I’m sure they’ll have explored leisure as an opportunity as they will deal with agents every day but I suspect it would have been based on a commercial basis (renting space) rather than a council funded project, that is unless the council wanted to fund a scheme such as one you suggested.
I think they need to fund something and that will help attract private. I think families would travel for what I mentioned. I've seen it elsewhere anyway.
 

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