Safe Standing Petition


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And you've argued the evidence there is irrelevant. We've argued it is relevant because the English culture means nothing when rail seating doesn't enable hooliganism in any way.
You have absolutely no evidence of that at all. English football culture is at the very heart of this debate. The behaviour inside the stadiums by English football fans is about as bad as the craic on here from you all. The complete lack of respect for other people's opinions on this shouldnt come as any surprise really.

Not only that but not one person has given us all a valid reason why standing should be reintroduced into the top 2 divisions of English football. Not one credible reason why 20 years of no incidents should be thrown out and a clear and present danger be reintroduced.

Why should English football clubs go to the expense of remodelling their stadiums for absolutely no gain at all, especially when the cost will inevitably result in higher ticket prices as clubs try to recoup their additional and unnecessary expense. Some people are actually thinking that this will reduce ticket prices which is just farcical. Why on earth should ticket prices come down?
 
Well, I am the same sort of age and spent loads of my youth standing on terraces far and wide watching SAFC across the UK. It is not just "young guns" asking for this and you are sounding very much like an old codger who thinks he knows what is best is for everyone here.

I watched the body bags tot up too. But correlation is not causation. Hillsborough was more to do with Thatcher's stupid fences and rank bad stadium management than standing. Heysel was a totally inappropriate crumbling stadium and, yes, the hooligan element of the 80's. Valley Parade was actually a seated stand and some people will have been hindered by the seats in trying to evacuate the stand quick enough. Ibrox (the last one there) was due to the access to the terrace and a late goal rather than the terraces themselves.

You are massively overplaying "The English Disease" here. The hooligans of the 80's were concentrated in a few clubs - Man U, Millwall, West Ham, Birmingham, Leeds spring to mind, and they caused trouble inside grounds, outside grounds, on trains, in seats, in terraces, etc. etc. I stood on old style terraces hundreds of times without incident, in fact my worst experience was in the Roker End, 6th Round v Luton in 1973 due to the surges forward because of the sparse number of barriers.

I cannot see how safe standing with continuous barriers every row could possibly allow for surges or crushes or deliberate mass movement of hooligans etc that could not already happen in existing seats.

Comparing the proposed safe standing arrangements and current "culture" with the arrangements in the ancient stadiums and hooligan culture of the 1980s is comparing chalk and cheese.

I've signed the petition, would love to stand again.
You and I see eye to eye on most things but I'm not signing it and wont be standing again at an English football ground out of choice. For me there is no reason to reintroduce standing at English football grounds and no case has been made for it.
 
You have absolutely no evidence of that at all. English football culture is at the very heart of this debate. The behaviour inside the stadiums by English football fans is about as bad as the craic on here from you all. The complete lack of respect for other people's opinions on this shouldnt come as any surprise really.

Not only that but not one person has given us all a valid reason why standing should be reintroduced into the top 2 divisions of English football. Not one credible reason why 20 years of no incidents should be thrown out and a clear and present danger be reintroduced.

Why should English football clubs go to the expense of remodelling their stadiums for absolutely no gain at all, especially when the cost will inevitably result in higher ticket prices as clubs try to recoup their additional and unnecessary expense. Some people are actually thinking that this will reduce ticket prices which is just farcical. Why on earth should ticket prices come down?

I'm not expecting to pay less. I'd happily pay more. And they would remodel because many fans would want it and it's safer than it is now with people standing (and it's too many and gone too far to stop now anyway).

You need to read this post and respond to it properly.

Well, I am the same sort of age and spent loads of my youth standing on terraces far and wide watching SAFC across the UK. It is not just "young guns" asking for this and you are sounding very much like an old codger who thinks he knows what is best is for everyone here.

I watched the body bags tot up too. But correlation is not causation. Hillsborough was more to do with Thatcher's stupid fences and rank bad stadium management than standing. Heysel was a totally inappropriate crumbling stadium and, yes, the hooligan element of the 80's. Valley Parade was actually a seated stand and some people will have been hindered by the seats in trying to evacuate the stand quick enough. Ibrox (the last one there) was due to the access to the terrace and a late goal rather than the terraces themselves.

You are massively overplaying "The English Disease" here. The hooligans of the 80's were concentrated in a few clubs - Man U, Millwall, West Ham, Birmingham, Leeds spring to mind, and they caused trouble inside grounds, outside grounds, on trains, in seats, in terraces, etc. etc. I stood on old style terraces hundreds of times without incident, in fact my worst experience was in the Roker End, 6th Round v Luton in 1973 due to the surges forward because of the sparse number of barriers.

I cannot see how safe standing with continuous barriers every row could possibly allow for surges or crushes or deliberate mass movement of hooligans etc that could not already happen in existing seats.

Comparing the proposed safe standing arrangements and current "culture" with the arrangements in the ancient stadiums and hooligan culture of the 1980s is comparing chalk and cheese.

I've signed the petition, would love to stand again.

You and I see eye to eye on most things but I'm not signing it and wont be standing again at an English football ground out of choice. For me there is no reason to reintroduce standing at English football grounds and no case has been made for it.
There is.... we want it.

There has..... you just won't listen. @TheStatCat just demolished all your arguments against it.
 
@Buchans Boots celebrating sunderlands first goal in the west stand paddock after safe standing is reintroduced:

Logon or register to see this image

:lol::lol:

Well, I am the same sort of age and spent loads of my youth standing on terraces far and wide watching SAFC across the UK. It is not just "young guns" asking for this and you are sounding very much like an old codger who thinks he knows what is best is for everyone here.

I watched the body bags tot up too. But correlation is not causation. Hillsborough was more to do with Thatcher's stupid fences and rank bad stadium management than standing. Heysel was a totally inappropriate crumbling stadium and, yes, the hooligan element of the 80's. Valley Parade was actually a seated stand and some people will have been hindered by the seats in trying to evacuate the stand quick enough. Ibrox (the last one there) was due to the access to the terrace and a late goal rather than the terraces themselves.

You are massively overplaying "The English Disease" here. The hooligans of the 80's were concentrated in a few clubs - Man U, Millwall, West Ham, Birmingham, Leeds spring to mind, and they caused trouble inside grounds, outside grounds, on trains, in seats, in terraces, etc. etc. I stood on old style terraces hundreds of times without incident, in fact my worst experience was in the Roker End, 6th Round v Luton in 1973 due to the surges forward because of the sparse number of barriers.

I cannot see how safe standing with continuous barriers every row could possibly allow for surges or crushes or deliberate mass movement of hooligans etc that could not already happen in existing seats.

Comparing the proposed safe standing arrangements and current "culture" with the arrangements in the ancient stadiums and hooligan culture of the 1980s is comparing chalk and cheese.

I've signed the petition, would love to stand again.

won't get a better post if you left this thread open for comment for the next 20 years.

close the thread, pin this post at the top alongside a link to the petition and get signing folks.
 
can everyone just ignore him? he might go away
There is no chance that you will ignore my view. My minority view goes against the majority view on this issue and that seemingly is a huge issue for many.

As I say there is still not one valid reason been put forward - by anyone - as to why 20 years of great work by football clubs and the authorities should be thrown away and standing re-introduced. It bears no relation to common sense. To ask football clubs to spend hundreds of thousands of pounds, perhaps a 7 figure sum, to remodel their grounds for no reason and no gain is ludicrous. I cant see any advantage at all of bringing standing back and all it does, on past history is increase the risk dramatically of an incident occurring.

Its such a stupidly ill thought out idea that I shouldnt really have given the issue any sort of airtime. Crackers. A literal suicide note for English football.
 
You and I see eye to eye on most things but I'm not signing it and wont be standing again at an English football ground out of choice. For me there is no reason to reintroduce standing at English football grounds and no case has been made for it.

Which is your choice, same as it was back in the day.

I would not see safe standing as an unacceptable risk and would happily give it a go.

There is a demand for standing from the paying public. Safe standing was introduced to meet the demand whilst minimising the risk.

Life is about risk assessment, nothing is 100% safe. There have been stadium tragedies seated stands around the world and at Bradford.

There is a demand for booze and fags. They carry a risk. People can choose to take or avoid the risk.
 
There is no chance that you will ignore my view. My minority view goes against the majority view on this issue and that seemingly is a huge issue for many.

As I say there is still not one valid reason been put forward - by anyone - as to why 20 years of great work by football clubs and the authorities should be thrown away and standing re-introduced. It bears no relation to common sense. To ask football clubs to spend hundreds of thousands of pounds, perhaps a 7 figure sum, to remodel their grounds for no reason and no gain is ludicrous. I cant see any advantage at all of bringing standing back and all it does, on past history is increase the risk dramatically of an incident occurring.

Its such a stupidly ill thought out idea that I shouldnt really have given the issue any sort of airtime. Crackers. A literal suicide note for English football.
:lol:

This surely has to be a wind up man.

Football caters to what the fans/supporters/customers need/want. Fans wanting it is therefore all the reason they need to implement it. The Football League and FA agree. The Premier League will soon as well.

It'll be introduced once parliament wakes up. And no-one will die because it was introduced......because it is safer than what we have now.....and no-one has died because of the persistent standing we have at the minute.
 
Which is your choice, same as it was back in the day.

I would not see safe standing as an unacceptable risk and would happily give it a go.

There is a demand for standing from the paying public. Safe standing was introduced to meet the demand whilst minimising the risk.

Life is about risk assessment, nothing is 100% safe. There have been stadium tragedies seated stands around the world and at Bradford.

There is a demand for booze and fags. They carry a risk. People can choose to take or avoid the risk.
This is a pre cursor to terracing being reintroduced into English football. You can see it a mile off. Ground safety is being chipped away at.
 
Just looking at the pictures posted earlier in the thread the first thing that will happen is that people will start to stand on the rails. Inevitable. It used to happen all the time in the previous standing areas. A few people fall and thats it - chaos. Seen it all before and know where standing areas and rails lead to. So do the authorities.


I'm going to ask you two very simple questions and I'd appreciate an answer - without insulting me please if thats ok:

Question 1 - is it ok for me to have a differing view to you on this?
Question 2 - why if I am in a minority does my minority view bother you so much?
Aye. People will be doing parkour all over, trying to be the first one to go all the way round the stadium, lad. :lol:

Mind, I should be OK - I was ace at fence walking as a kid.
 
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Before you sign I'd urge people to think of the consequences of signing it.

So in your eyes is this what it's like now in the unofficial standing areas in stadiums around the country?

If not, why would rail seating do anything other than make these areas safer?

This is a pre cursor to terracing being reintroduced into English football. You can see it a mile off. Ground safety is being chipped away at.
It won't and it isn't.
 
We all know whats happening here - ground safety being chipped away at until the eventual aim reveals itself - terracing. You can see it coming a mile off. Absolute FACT.
:lol::lol::lol::lol:

It won't because it can be reasonably argued (very easily) that terraces are dangerous. It cannot be argued the same for rail seating. Therefore that will happen, terracing won't (and I wouldn't want it to either).
 
It absolutely is the aim. No question about it and for me I'll have no part of introducing standing back into English grounds. Literally dead against it.
Seating = safe
Terraces = unsafe
Rail seating = safe

Terracing won't ever come back because it's unsafe. Don't worry mate. Sleep well.
 
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