RR Roker Roundup: Sunderland Head of Recruitment Tony Coton speaks on transfers - loans incoming?

[The Cabbage]

but your making satuff up now you dont know its old school or at least you dont know if its more old school than our rivals..what the fuck is a football vision? and why would he be setng it? surely its the fiotball deoartment that sets that? steqwrat donald didnt decide to sign willis,,do you want a chairman who overrules the manager?

Willis has been a good signing so far..

I know that both Luton and Barnsley signed players who contributed to teams who maximised their chances to win games. I know that both those teams were the best teams throughout the season and none of our players made much of a dent in advanced metrics outside of Maja. I know that Donald lauded Coton’s contacts publicly and has demonstrated no understanding whatsoever about the use and importance of data in player recruitment - something which he absolutely should have knowledge of as chairman of the club. I know that none of the players we signed did much to address the clear deficiencies in our team - and the new ones haven’t really done much so far either.

I can’t be bothered arguing with you any more tbh. You’re spending so much effort shilling for Donald when you could be using it to educate yourself. If you don’t know what is meant by a football vision for Safc - and why it is the single most essential contribution from an owner/chairman - I’m not sure you’re worth any more of my energy.

 

[kildaremackem]

I know that both Luton and Barnsley signed players who contributed to teams who maximised their chances to win games. I know that both those teams were the best teams throughout the season and none of our players made much of a dent in advanced metrics outside of Maja. I know that Donald lauded Coton’s contacts publicly and has demonstrated no understanding whatsoever about the use and importance of data in player recruitment - something which he absolutely should have knowledge of as chairman of the club. I know that none of the players we signed did much to address the clear deficiencies in our team - and the new ones haven’t really done much so far either.

I can’t be bothered arguing with you any more tbh. You’re spending so much effort shilling for Donald when you could be using it to educate yourself. If you don’t know what is meant by a football vision for Safc - and why it is the single most essential contribution from an owner/chairman - I’m not sure you’re worth any more of my energy.

why would SD need to undersatand about data? the football guys should know that. Are you saying you think contacts are completely irerleavnt My view is data is important..but it doesnt tell you about temprament or the likelihood of a player being willing to come. The article inthe OP is Coton finding out of a player is willing to come..no analytics can tell anyone that..contacts can. Your mstaking two different bits of the process..part one is identiffying ones you would like to sign..part two is sigjing them. The OP is pabout the second part of the process..you are talking about the first part, so two completely differen things. Tony Coton has worked at both Mna Utd and Mna City, you saying they wouldnt have used anlaytics? You have dceided that becausde he is a player from yonder and so not a football hipster choice, he must be old school, its quite sad.

Arsene Wenger is often lauded as an inovative manager..yet so much of his recruitment was contacts based..allardyce overachieved with teams for years..he was very contacts based in recruitem terms (sed the agent who paid him most) but was also regadded as quite innovatve in the use of sports science..contacts and innovation complement e\avh other in the real world..they are not mutually exclusive.

 

[Seaham Towny]

he didnt say coton had the player lined up..he said a different person at the club did...
our recruitment has been shit..no doubt..or at least it was last year..there are better signs this year..
but luton have mick harford in charge and went up..he isnt an innovator..

i hope we become innovators..we have been under any owners..going back to murray quinny and short, as wella s the current lot, the safc has been horrendously run..thats why we are in the state we are..

I dont have a ;lot of faith in these owners to make better football deicsions,..becausde SD has shown at previous clubs he cant do that..but most of our fans just how and whaile for more money to hbe spent and threaten the ownrs children if he doesnt spend it...thats not an incentive for him to innovate..

but the view we didnt go up last year because of not being innovative is demonstrably bollox..our rivals werent innovative either..your veiw we get prlayers by pricing others out is bollox because thats the one thing we dont do..we haggle like fuck and have signed a lot of players for nowt..while cutting the wage bill..

Luton had Nathan Jones who built the team that went up from the ground up. Their full backs were outstanding. He played a diamond system and bought players to suit it. Nathan Jones is indeed an innovator.

Recruitment has been our downfall for years. Not since McCarthy have we really scouted players, young, cheap and on an upward trajectory and fit them into a style of play.

Keane - bought a load of players from his former clubs and when tasked with spending some money - Etuhu, Chopra etc decided he didn't fancy them really quickly.

Bruce - fared better but again a lot of players he'd worked with before Larsson, Gardner. South Americans who he didn't know how to utilise. Big money on Bent and Gyan who then went chasing more money. Dismantled a good side until his inevitable demise.

O Neill - could argue he had a system (counter attacking wing play) then bought wingers who didn't have a lot of pace, a centre forward who was a poacher more than a target man and also spent £5m on Danny Graham, as well as the likes of Cuellar who he worked with previously.

Di Canio - ah the Dof Model, where our strategy was, who on the confident is cheap and available or who in the Premier League is not getting a game? Before reverting back to club stalwarts

Poyet - definitely had a style of play, had players who fit it, the downfall was they were mainly loans who we struggled to replace - Ki, Borini, Alonso. Shame he got here when the money was starting to run out but then again, Bridcutt, Buckley, Scocco, Ustari would suggest maybe not.

Advocaat - Lens

Allardyce - got things spot on but used an agent. The players brought in were then absolute fuckwits once he left.

Moyes - covered in the Moyes thread on here, horrific.

Grayson/Coleman - both basically told to use what they had and use as many loans/freebies as possible. Ended up in League One.

So in the third tier, debt free. A chance to finally look at clubs who have come from here, learn, implement our own kind of system. Look at clubs like Barnsley, Brentford, Sheffield United, Norwich who don't have our resources or facilities but have a defined style of play, scout players well and then buy to fit that system and always seem to have a replacement lined up if someone goes. This is how you build a club. Organically our level is probably higher than those mentioned.

I gave the club the benefit of the doubt last season. We appear to have strengthened in areas we needed with Willis, Dobson and bringing Embleton back and tying him down. This gives me hope. However we're still short in some areas and if the style of play is the lopsided 3-5-2 then we need another couple minimum