Relegation 'hangover' Aug 70 - Jan' 73......

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When you see the old footage eg Spurs h, Milwall h, it seems so dark and depressing !
The vast open spaces on the terraces and all the kids in C and A parkas:lol:
 


shaun61 said:
...just browsing through the magnificent Statcat with EL on in back ground and didn't realise how bad crowds were after our 2nd ever relegation 69-70 up til the Notts County cup replay in January 73.

Talk about a hangover !! Horrendous.

Anyone have much memory of 70/71, 71/72 and early part of 72/73 ?

The strange thing was that we actually made a right fist of trying to gain promotion in 71/72 yet despite a 5th place finish, we only averaged 15,500:oops:. Was this anything to do with the anti Alan Brown sentiment that prevailed at the time ?

After relegation, Sunderland never got going at all in 70/71 despite signing the much vaunted Joe Baker.

Thank goodness for Sir Bob Stokoe and the cup run and win to lift us out of the doldrums !
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Have a read of Stokoe, Sunderland and '73 - club was on it's arse. Brown's regimented style* had sucked the life out of the players and the place. Stokoe's remit was to get the fans back.

*IIRC there remains the argument that his methods had instilled the same squad with technical proficiency and a higher level of fitness which would stand them in good stead once Stokoe allowed them to play a bit. I think I'm right in saying that Arsene Wenger and a few Arrigo Sacchi took a few leaves out of his book.
 
OLDROKERENDER said:
Dear me, I'd forgotten about Brand :) He was dire !
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Calvin Palmer ?
Bruce Stuckey
Brian Heslop
Mick McGiven
Malcolm Moore
John Tones
Brian Chambers
Paddy Lowery
John Lathan
Maurice Hepworth
Colin Beesley

Colin Symm another cracking panic buy for 69/70 season. No goals whatsoever !
 
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shaun61 said:
Calvin Palmer ?
Bruce Stuckey
Brian Heslop
Mick McGiven
Malcolm Moore
John Tones
Brian Chambers
Paddy Lowery
John Lathan
Maurice Hepworth.
Colin Beesley

Colin Symm another cracking panic buy for 69/70 season. No goals whatsoever !
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The first 3, and Symm, were bought in and the rest were through the youth system. At the end of 71/72 nearly all the apprentices were released along with the older players I mentioned before. I think McColl also had problems with the Irish because he sent Martin Harvey to the reserves as well. One week he played on the Saturday at Spennymoor for the reserves, on the Wednesday for Northern Ireland at Wembley against England and played another reserve match on the Saturday. ​
 
Johnap said:

The first 3, and Symm, were bought in and the rest were through the youth system. At the end of 71/72 nearly all the apprentices were released along with the older players I mentioned before. I think McColl also had problems with the Irish because he sent Martin Harvey to the reserves as well. One week he played on the Saturday at Spennymoor for the reserves, on the Wednesday for Northern Ireland at Wembley against England and played another reserve match on the Saturday. ​
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Great safc servant.
Shame only 13500 inc 500-1000 mags, turned up for his testimonial. Mind tbf, we had just lost at A.Villa to lose out on promotion.
 
shaun61 said:
First home game in 70/71 v Watford only had 16500 !
Dropped to below 12000 for second home game.
Boxing Day v Boro got 42000, but next home game, 3rd rd fa cup v Orient, dropped to 18000 iirc !
When we stuffed Swindon 5-2 later on in season, less than 9000 attended !
Just seemed to be no hope from the get go. Can you recall why ?

Can other veterans shed any light on these seasons @Grumpy Old Man @Reiver @vinegar hill @The Fulwell
@Geronimo
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I could shed some light on this era but seing as I am not part of the elite you can whistle.
 
Johnap said:
I am not either but I know a bit more than most. Put it on the board T_Bone.
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No. It’s a thing between me and Shaun 61
Anyway you know much more about it than me. I first went to Roker in 64. I continued to go with family and on my own from about 69 but not a regular until I drew my first wage in would you believe 73.
 
T_Bone said:
No. It’s a thing between me and Shaun 61
Anyway you know much more about it than me. I first went to Roker in 64. I continued to go with family and on my own from about 69 but not a regular until I drew my first wage in would you believe 73.
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I first went in 62 and went to most games until Liverpool relegation match 69/70. I then started in the office at Roker and was there for 7 years. - the last 6 as Assistant to Ron Linney. All this stuff I am putting up is from my memory!
 
Johnap said:
I first went in 62 and went to most games until Liverpool relegation match 69/70. I then started in the office at Roker and was there for 7 years. - the last 6 as Assistant to Ron Linney. All this stuff I am putting up is from my memory!
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I was impressed with your memory mind !

Johnap said:
I first went in 62 and went to most games until Liverpool relegation match 69/70. I then started in the office at Roker and was there for 7 years. - the last 6 as Assistant to Ron Linney. All this stuff I am putting up is from my memory!
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My memories are standing on the hay at the front of the Clock Stand paddocks, seing us play Leeds dunno the score, think that was my first match. I stood on the hay a few times my uncle took me.
My grandad took me in the seats in the Main Stand twice a season. Once at Xmas and once for my birthday. Good man.
By 68 I was getting the train up on my own. Remember losing 2-0 to Spurs but more for the fact I was 11 and got smacked in the mouth at the front of the Falwell by one of our fans. Gilzean scored I think, possibly twice.
Anyway that’s enough for now Shaun 61 might be looking in.

I spelt Fulwell wrong !
 
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shaun61 said:
First home game in 70/71 v Watford only had 16500 !
Dropped to below 12000 for second home game.
Boxing Day v Boro got 42000, but next home game, 3rd rd fa cup v Orient, dropped to 18000 iirc !
When we stuffed Swindon 5-2 later on in season, less than 9000 attended !
Just seemed to be no hope from the get go. Can you recall why ?

Can other veterans shed any light on these seasons @Grumpy Old Man @Reiver @vinegar hill @The Fulwell
@Geronimo
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There was just a feeling of hopelessness and frustration around the club in those times.
The Liverpool game which relegated us in ‘70 afterwards was probably the worst hooliganism I’ve ever witnessed from Sunderland fans.
There was a trail of destruction all the way over from Roker Park to the town, Barclay Court took a reet hammering, although it might have improved it!
The team then had youngsters like Billy Hughes and Dennis Tueart but really after the relegation it was just a struggle it wasn’t easy for those young lads at the time.
When Brown went there just seemed to be a release and every player just seemed to blossom under Stokoe especially those two.
 
vinegar hill said:
There was just a feeling of hopelessness and frustration around the club in those times.
The Liverpool game which relegated us in ‘70 afterwards was probably the worst hooliganism I’ve ever witnessed from Sunderland fans.
There was a trail of destruction all the way over from Roker Park to the town, Barclay Court took a reet hammering, although it might have improved it!
The team then had youngsters like Billy Hughes and Dennis Tueart but really after the relegation it was just a struggle it wasn’t easy for those young lads at the time.
When Brown went there just seemed to be a release and every player just seemed to blossom under Stokoe especially those two.
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Do you think the feeling of hopelessness/frustration/apathy in that period was worse than that between and including seasons 92/93 to 94/95 ? I was only 10 in 1970, so I dont recall much, but 92(after the final) to 95 (until Reid arrived) was a really depressing time to be a fan of Safc.
And of course it was made worse by the Keegan led revival up the road.
 
shaun61 said:
Do you think the feeling of hopelessness/frustration/apathy in that period was worse than that between and including seasons 92/93 to 94/95 ? I was only 10 in 1970, so I dont recall much, but 92(after the final) to 95 (until Reid arrived) was a really depressing time to be a fan of Safc.
And of course it was made worse by the Keegan led revival up the road.
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It was really bad especially amongst the older fellas who’d seen us relegated for the first time 12 years earlier now it happened again and after 6 seasons of struggling near the bottom of the 1st division.
It’s difficult to compare but those seasons up to ‘73 were very low and despondent,the club seemed to be thinking more small time.
 
vinegar hill said:
There was just a feeling of hopelessness and frustration around the club in those times.
The Liverpool game which relegated us in ‘70 afterwards was probably the worst hooliganism I’ve ever witnessed from Sunderland fans.
There was a trail of destruction all the way over from Roker Park to the town, Barclay Court took a reet hammering, although it might have improved it!
The team then had youngsters like Billy Hughes and Dennis Tueart but really after the relegation it was just a struggle it wasn’t easy for those young lads at the time.
When Brown went there just seemed to be a release and every player just seemed to blossom under Stokoe especially those two.
Click to expand...
My memory of the night of the Liverpool game is different - thousands staying behind on the Falwell after for quite a while singing, like after City game in ‘91, the Echo did a little piece on that the day after. Me and me mates walked back to Park Lane after and don’t remember the hooliganism (not saying there wasn’t any, I was 12).

I went a lot in the following seasons and, at it’s worst, just prior to the cup run, I don’t remember a lot of vocal negativity or protest just basically resignation at being bang average/poor in the second tier. I think it’s cos we were down to hard core attendees who go just turn up matter how shit it gets. Bus conductors would say ‘what you going there for they’re a load of rubbish’ all that. For me there’s been far more vocal negativity in recent years, on. social media etc.
 
Manny F said:
My memory of the night of the Liverpool game is different - thousands staying behind on the Falwell after for quite a while singing, like after City game in ‘91, the Echo did a little piece on that the day after. Me and me mates walked back to Park Lane after and don’t remember the hooliganism (not saying there wasn’t any, I was 12).

I went a lot in the following seasons and, at it’s worst, just prior to the cup run, I don’t remember a lot of vocal negativity or protest just basically resignation at being bang average/poor in the second tier. I think it’s cos we were down to hard core attendees who go just turn up matter how shit it gets. Bus conductors would say ‘what you going there for they’re a load of rubbish’ all that. For me there’s been far more vocal negativity in recent years, on. social media etc.
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There was windows put out between the ground and the town.
Dundas Street and Barclay Court took a bit of a hammering.
I certainly didn’t imagine it.
 
I agree about the lack of vocal negativity. The crowd were very quiet. What the club had to do was to get the crowd back. The fans had not gone to watch any other club - except perhaps their local team. They just were waiting for a hint of a good run and perhaps success. The rollercoaster that started in Jan 73 and stopped in May 77 was great. I have said this before and I will always stand by it - Adamson was a terrible mistake. The club was too big for him and his cronies. It went from a place of people enjoying working together to one of where people looked behind the door before speaking in case other people heard them. I had a lot of time for Ian Macfarlane but to sack Arthur Cox to bring him in was a mistake. Arthur thought the world of the club. I left in 1977 and went to Leeds United and guess who followed me - Adamson and his boys. I told them then that he was mistake and he didn't last long there. The fans wanted him out very quickly after he went there.
 
Remember all those years mind.

Like a few on here I'd started early enough to see the relegation that preceded that era, but those were my formative years watching, when the whole of my world would revolve around the match on Saturday. I was among the throng when the numbers were very low but it meant nothing to me that the numbers were poor.

I can't say it ever concerned me in the slightest, though I remember getting a bit excited when the crowds would rise after a run of form, especially in the Cup. Then it exploded into a mad fury of bedlam in '73. Man, we could win the Champion's League three times in a row without conceding a corner and I'll never feel like I did when that happened.

Johnap said:
I agree about the lack of vocal negativity. The crowd were very quiet. What the club had to do was to get the crowd back. The fans had not gone to watch any other club - except perhaps their local team. They just were waiting for a hint of a good run and perhaps success. The rollercoaster that started in Jan 73 and stopped in May 77 was great. I have said this before and I will always stand by it - Adamson was a terrible mistake. The club was too big for him and his cronies. It went from a place of people enjoying working together to one of where people looked behind the door before speaking in case other people heard them. I had a lot of time for Ian Macfarlane but to sack Arthur Cox to bring him in was a mistake. Arthur thought the world of the club. I left in 1977 and went to Leeds United and guess who followed me - Adamson and his boys. I told them then that he was mistake and he didn't last long there. The fans wanted him out very quickly after he went there.
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Great post that mate.

shaun61 said:
Great safc servant.
Shame only 13500 inc 500-1000 mags, turned up for his testimonial. Mind tbf, we had just lost at A.Villa to lose out on promotion.
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Right there. I was one of them. Martin was one of my favourite all time players. I saw him toward the end of his time I suppose, but he always seemed to stand out to me. You can't go wrong with characters like that in the team.
 
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