Redundancy question


You can still get away with it if it's pure compensation iirc. It'll depend on how the offer is worded.

Yeah, that's probably most likely, but as you say, who knows with those jokers.
A document is being drafted and I'm waiting to see it. Will report back 🤣👍
A document is being drafted and I'm waiting to see it. Will report back 🤣👍
Not happy with the wording of this document.
Something I've not mentioned on here before but I have a separate grievance ongoing with my ex employer regarding the actual redundancy process itself. It has not reached the stage of ACAS yet, just a couple of letters back and forth between me and HR. However I guess there is a possibility I could end up going to ACAS with a separate complaint regarding unfair dismissal.
The wording of the document goes:-
The employee agrees to accept £2000 in full and final settlement of all claims under statute or at common law which the employee has brought or could bring against the employer arising out of the employees contract of employment with the employer and it's termination including the claims in early conciliation case number xxxxxxxx.
That to me reads like I would not be able to pursue any other complaint at all if I accept this 2k which really is only for the unlawfully withheld salary.
What do you think mate?
 
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You can still get away with it if it's pure compensation iirc. It'll depend on how the offer is worded.
Is that if it's injury to feelings etc? I pay quite a few compensation agreements through payrolls for various clients and it's years since I saw any PILON in the agreement as non-taxable. Most of them don't even move loss of contractual OT etc to tax/no free.
 
Is that if it's injury to feelings etc? I pay quite a few compensation agreements through payrolls for various clients and it's years since I saw any PILON in the agreement as non-taxable. Most of them don't even move loss of contractual OT etc to tax/no free.
Pilon, has been taxable even if it's breach for years now, yeah.
 
But how does it get worded as pure compensation to circumnavigate the tax law?
Probably have to claim discrimination of some sort. Depends how much they want it to go away. It was easier before the changes a few years back.
 
Brilliant result mate. Now you can shit in their postbox.
Hopefully it'll be structured as a generic compensation as opposed to back pay. Then it should be tax free too. Fingers crossed.
At a bit of a stalemate now, they're prepared to alter the wording of the COT3 document slightly but it would still prevent me pursuing any other complaint that would need to go to an employment tribunal. I've refused to sign the document so don't know what to do now. I have until February 3rd to start the process on the court website for an employment tribunal.
 
At a bit of a stalemate now, they're prepared to alter the wording of the COT3 document slightly but it would still prevent me pursuing any other complaint that would need to go to an employment tribunal. I've refused to sign the document so don't know what to do now. I have until February 3rd to start the process on the court website for an employment tribunal.
Do you have any other potential complaint?
 
Do you have any other potential complaint?
Yes unfair dismissal, I've been in contact with my old employer asking some awkward questions about my redundancy process but that was back in November. I had one reply by letter just before Xmas acknowledging receipt of my letter and saying a manager would be allocated to look at my concerns. Their letter was even headed "Your grievance" when I never really said I had a grievance. My letter was very softly softly to hopefully not tip them off that I think they have made me redundant in error. I've heard nowt since and the deadline to raise a case with ACAS was on Monday gone so that's what I have done. I'm waiting for the ACAS email telling me a case worker has been assigned.
If I sign this COT3 document for the unlawfully withheld salary I would not be able to proceed any further with the unfair dismissal as it states I agree that accepting the £2000 is to settle "all claims that can be concilliated by an ACAS concilliator ".
 
Yes unfair dismissal, I've been in contact with my old employer asking some awkward questions about my redundancy process but that was back in November. I had one reply by letter just before Xmas acknowledging receipt of my letter and saying a manager would be allocated to look at my concerns. Their letter was even headed "Your grievance" when I never really said I had a grievance. My letter was very softly softly to hopefully not tip them off that I think they have made me redundant in error. I've heard nowt since and the deadline to raise a case with ACAS was on Monday gone so that's what I have done. I'm waiting for the ACAS email telling me a case worker has been assigned.
If I sign this COT3 document for the unlawfully withheld salary I would not be able to proceed any further with the unfair dismissal as it states I agree that accepting the £2000 is to settle "all claims that can be concilliated by an ACAS concilliator ".

You can't really accept it at this stage then.

What makes you think you were selected unfairly, or that it wasn't a true redundancy situation?
 
You can't really accept it at this stage then.

What makes you think you were selected unfairly, or that it wasn't a true redundancy situation?
The company used a point scoring system to determine who would be made redundant. There were 2 of us locally in the North East doing this one particular role but one of us had to go. My mate (I actually sit next to him at the match 🤣🤣) got the nod over me on length of service by 1 year as the company scored us level on points. However since leaving and studying all the redundancy paperwork prior to almost shredding it all I realised my mate should have had 1 point less than me. I've even discussed it with him and he can't understand how this has happened either, he agrees they may have made a mistake.
To be fair to the company they went about the redundancy process legally and fairly over 100 lads nationwide went, but in my case I think they have simply made a clerical error.
So what to do now ?
I guess I have decisions to make 🤣
 
A document is being drafted and I'm waiting to see it. Will report back 🤣👍

Not happy with the wording of this document.
Something I've not mentioned on here before but I have a separate grievance ongoing with my ex employer regarding the actual redundancy process itself. It has not reached the stage of ACAS yet, just a couple of letters back and forth between me and HR. However I guess there is a possibility I could end up going to ACAS with a separate complaint regarding unfair dismissal.
The wording of the document goes:-
The employee agrees to accept £2000 in full and final settlement of all claims under statute or at common law which the employee has brought or could bring against the employer arising out of the employees contract of employment with the employer and it's termination including the claims in early conciliation case number xxxxxxxx.
That to me reads like I would not be able to pursue any other complaint at all if I accept this 2k which really is only for the unlawfully withheld salary.
What do you think mate?


how long is the redundancy procedure taking? I've got to either sign a settlement agreement or go down a redundancy route which will just be me
 
The company used a point scoring system to determine who would be made redundant. There were 2 of us locally in the North East doing this one particular role but one of us had to go. My mate (I actually sit next to him at the match 🤣🤣) got the nod over me on length of service by 1 year as the company scored us level on points. However since leaving and studying all the redundancy paperwork prior to almost shredding it all I realised my mate should have had 1 point less than me. I've even discussed it with him and he can't understand how this has happened either, he agrees they may have made a mistake.
To be fair to the company they went about the redundancy process legally and fairly over 100 lads nationwide went, but in my case I think they have simply made a clerical error.
So what to do now ?
I guess I have decisions to make 🤣

Sounds like they wanted you out. Seen it happen plenty where the criteria and scoring doesn't marry up.
 
The company used a point scoring system to determine who would be made redundant. There were 2 of us locally in the North East doing this one particular role but one of us had to go. My mate (I actually sit next to him at the match 🤣🤣) got the nod over me on length of service by 1 year as the company scored us level on points. However since leaving and studying all the redundancy paperwork prior to almost shredding it all I realised my mate should have had 1 point less than me. I've even discussed it with him and he can't understand how this has happened either, he agrees they may have made a mistake.
To be fair to the company they went about the redundancy process legally and fairly over 100 lads nationwide went, but in my case I think they have simply made a clerical error.
So what to do now ?
I guess I have decisions to make 🤣
The outcome may be your mate gets bladdered and you get your job back. Awkward!
 
how long is the redundancy procedure taking? I've got to either sign a settlement agreement or go down a redundancy route which will just be me
I've already been made redundant mate back in late October. My concerns regarding a possible unfair dismissal only came to my attention a month or so after redundancy. Hope all works out for you 👍
Sounds like they wanted you out. Seen it happen plenty where the criteria and scoring doesn't marry up.
I highly doubt that to be honest mate, the people who made the decisions don't even know us, we are just a number to them. When it turned out to be me both my manager and senior technician were a bit shocked.
The outcome may be your mate gets bladdered and you get your job back. Awkward!
That's not going to happen now mate, I've already assured my mate that I'm not after his job. I'm purely doing this hoping that if a unfair dismissal is proven and it either gets settled before court or at an employment tribunal I'm offered financial compensation of some sort. If I was offered or told I'm getting my job I would tell them to stick it now. Too much gone on with the way they have treated me regarding my unlawfully withheld salary claim.
 
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I've already been made redundant mate back in late October. My concerns regarding a possible unfair dismissal only came to my attention a month or so after redundancy. Hope all works out for you 👍


theyre wanting to take the role from me on the 1st feb. if I start the formal redundancy procedure does anyone know if I'd still remain an employee and be paid until it's done?
 
theyre wanting to take the role from me on the 1st feb. if I start the formal redundancy procedure does anyone know if I'd still remain an employee and be paid until it's done?
What exactly is happening to you ? Is it forced change role where they give you compensation to take up another role or you can take voluntary redundancy?
 
What exactly is happening to you ? Is it forced change role where they give you compensation to take up another role or you can take voluntary redundancy?


I deleted what I wrote just in case. basically, sign the settlement agreement which is insultingly low or don't and they want to take the role from me on 1st feb
 
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I deleted what I wrote just in case. basically, sign the settlement agreement which is insultingly low or don't and they want to take the role from me on 1st feb
Did not get a chance to read what you deleted anyway. 🤣 Still not 100% sure what you mean mate ? Are you saying your loosing your job on the 1st of Feb and that's you done with who you work for ? They are not offering you an alternative role ?
 
Did not get a chance to read what you deleted anyway. 🤣 Still not 100% sure what you mean mate ? Are you saying your loosing your job on the 1st of Feb and that's you done with who you work for ? They are not offering you an alternative role ?


thats exactly it. either sign the agreement or dont, either way if I go the formal route it'd just be me up for redundancy so I'd be out
 

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