Racism in Ukraine

I spend a fair amount of time in Ukraine,and go to games regularly in different parts of the country.

The element of 'supporters' who are involved in this appalling behaviour is very small,and a separate entity from the Dynamo ''Ultras' who regularly seem to be lumped into all this kind of thing.An ultra nationalist group known as 'Rodychi' are responsible for most of this at Kyiv;the vast majority of fans at Dynamo are normal,well behaved football supporters who take no part in anything like the much publicised actions of a small group of far right ultra-nationalists-they don't like their behaviour either,believe me. The Dnipro lot are worse.

It's also interesting to note comments from posters who've probably never been to the country,and have no real experience of the people or life there. I spent last Saturday in Ocean Plaza shopping Mall in central Kyiv,stopping off for a coffee here and there whilst mooching around the shops. There were many ethnicities,as usual,just going about their normal everyday lives and getting on with things, as is normal in the city.I know Ukrainians married to and in relationships with people of African decent,Indian,Chinese and many others,so to call a whole nation 'backwards' on the basis of a group of football thugs isn't really accurate in 2019 Kyiv,or the wider Ukraine. People are,in general,pretty tolerant,very friendly,inquisitive and open minded in my experience-certainly more so than Russia-but that's a generational thing mainly,and things are changing.
Kiev is a marvellous city mind
 

spangle

Full Back
Kiev is a marvellous city mind
Certainly is,as is Lviv and Odessa.Kharkiv isn't too bad,nor is Dnipro either. I'd also add that the younger generation in many of the cities in Ukraine-and even Russia too-are far more open minded these days,and things are improving in terms of tolerance throughout society in general.That's not to deny they're quite up to where we are in the west,but it's changing over there quite markedly.

As postulated earlier by me,the real fans at Dynamo abhor the disgraceful behaviour of this small element of people that tarnishes the name of what is a great football club:there are many great people in and around that club that want to take it forwards on all fronts.The rivalry with Shakhtar is huge,mind you,and they don't like being overshadowed by them.
The sound system at Dynamo's stadium is something to behold too,it's really very good and adds to what is normally a great atmosphere at games;maybe we should send Stewart and Charlie over to have a listen. ;)
 

rebelsafc

Midfield
Certainly is,as is Lviv and Odessa.Kharkiv isn't too bad,nor is Dnipro either. I'd also add that the younger generation in many of the cities in Ukraine-and even Russia too-are far more open minded these days,and things are improving in terms of tolerance throughout society in general.That's not to deny they're quite up to where we are in the west,but it's changing over there quite markedly.

As postulated earlier by me,the real fans at Dynamo abhor the disgraceful behaviour of this small element of people that tarnishes the name of what is a great football club:there are many great people in and around that club that want to take it forwards on all fronts.The rivalry with Shakhtar is huge,mind you,and they don't like being overshadowed by them.
The sound system at Dynamo's stadium is something to behold too,it's really very good and adds to what is normally a great atmosphere at games;maybe we should send Stewart and Charlie over to have a listen. ;)
I don't mean to antagonise, but if it such a small (less than 100???), well known group, why can't they just be banned from the ground? Why does there seem to be a reluctance from the authorities to deal with the situation?
 

martinlumley

Striker
Certainly is,as is Lviv and Odessa.Kharkiv isn't too bad,nor is Dnipro either. I'd also add that the younger generation in many of the cities in Ukraine-and even Russia too-are far more open minded these days,and things are improving in terms of tolerance throughout society in general.That's not to deny they're quite up to where we are in the west,but it's changing over there quite markedly.

As postulated earlier by me,the real fans at Dynamo abhor the disgraceful behaviour of this small element of people that tarnishes the name of what is a great football club:there are many great people in and around that club that want to take it forwards on all fronts.The rivalry with Shakhtar is huge,mind you,and they don't like being overshadowed by them.
The sound system at Dynamo's stadium is something to behold too,it's really very good and adds to what is normally a great atmosphere at games;maybe we should send Stewart and Charlie over to have a listen. ;)
agree on Lviv, went to Portugal v Denmark game there in Euro 2012, the locals were great and very friendly (a bit confused by 10 English fans being at that game) and showed us great hospitality. I'd love to go back to see more of the country.
 

spangle

Full Back
I don't mean to antagonise, but if it such a small (less than 100???), well known group, why can't they just be banned from the ground? Why does there seem to be a reluctance from the authorities to deal with the situation?
You're not being antagonistic mate,it's a fair question. The problem is not enough is being done to prevent these individuals obtaining tickets to games,but as many people know it's possible to get a ticket for games fairly easily. In the country in question,pretty much anything can be bought and corruption is still endemic;perhaps with the new Police and law enforcement regime that's been developed in the last three or four years,more will be done to bring the perpetrators to justice in conjunction with the clubs themselves looking more closely at how tickets are purchased. In the UK,clubs have worked hard to try to prevent troublesome individuals having access to football grounds,plus of course an effective banning system and intelligence to identify offenders effectively;to implement that in many East European countries will take time and money. Furthermore,as with any group with extreme views,when some are removed from circulation there are always others willing to step in and replace them-who's to say these individuals are in fact fans of the club anyway? Some won't be.

There's no denying there is a problem though,and some of the country is still in the grip of the problems caused by the situation in Donbass: to stem a deep rooted sociological problem rooted in the extremism this division has caused is going to take time. Clubs there need to take a more firm stance,and some do,but their systems for rooting out and banning these people is nowhere near as developed as we have here in the UK. The statement Dynamo put out after the events in Kharkiv was worded reasonably well in that it didn't apportion blame to all travelling fans,but they really need to act upon their claim that they will deal with these people,and work with the authorities to implement a more effective intelligence and ticketing system. Some people are still stuck in the past too though as far as attitudes go.

On a positive note,it all made me realise how far we've come in the UK and much of Europe in football regarding this issue but sadly it will still rear its ugly head.
 
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