Ozturk must not be selected for play off matches.



KittenMittens said:
Correlation is not causation.

Simple reality is that none of our defenders have been stellar, but you would expect our attackers to be better quality and to be putting the opposition under the cosh more of the game. The other day Southend had 64% possession against us. That isn't Ozturk's fault, but clearly has a huge impact in L1.

In the end lots of this comes down to us not keeping the ball and creating chances by breaking teams down. The strikers are feeding on scraps half of the time.
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I agree correlation is obviously not causation but I only checked the stats as for me he has looked poor and I know few people watching think he has played well. It is all opinion it's just I am worried that he may be a factor and its a chance I don't wish to take and a trend I don't want to follow

Secret Visage said:
Shhh man, that doesn't fit in with Mrs "Dave" Baldwin's stats.
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Ha ha ha
It does
Who you give man of match to is just opinion and I have already agreed some people rate him!!
 
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No. 1 is Gary Rowell said:
Fair point. I just think against the likes of Vaughan and Hawkins he's a bit more suited, if we were playing the fast forwards from Coventry for example then I'd really worry.
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Yep Even against Peterborough they sussed him and we’re floating a ball over the top for a young kid to run onto and it took ozturk completely out of the game. As you say it’s portsmouth and long ball game .
 
Mainze said:
Choosing our centre halves is simply a matter of deciding which shade of shit you prefer on the day.
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Is harsh but not too far wrong sadly. It’s my main criticism of the transfer activity at the club this season (including January).

It’s simplistic to say the main difference between us and the two sides that attained automatic promotion is the quality of central defenders. Simplistic but not too far wide of the mark.
 
Dave Cleadon said:
He hasn't improved the defence.
I am not just going off stats.
His first game against Charlton had people around me and myself commenting on how slow he is and how big his turning circle was. His only clean sheet was against Doncaster when Sky cameras showed that he committed a stone wall penalty offence which fortunately wasn't seen.
Surely no one can think he has enough pace.
I checked the stats because I see how poor he is. Then discovered the stats backed up my observations
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Your stats are failing to consider who else was playing during the games he's started though, you've also failed to consider the teams we played.

He played well at home to Portsmouth.

naughtynose said:
Ozturk and Dunne
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Too slow, we can only play one or the other, not both. I'd prefer to see Flanagan and Dunne.
 
gipetto said:
Your stats are failing to consider who else was playing during the games he's started though, you've also failed to consider the teams we played.

He played well at home to Portsmouth.

Too slow, we can only play one or the other, not both. I'd prefer to see Flanagan and Dunne.
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Some massive points there that many on this thread seem to have overlooked.

Additionally, the individual players playing for the teams we've played also make a difference. If the opposition attackers are slow but tall and good in the air, then we'd be better off with a back line that sits further forward but is good in the air. If the opposition forwards are fast but crap in the air and not great from long range then we'd be better off with faster defenders sitting further back to prevent them getting behind the back line.

It's way too simplistic to say "Ross doesn't know his best pairing" because he's probably putting a hell of a lot more thought into each teamsheet than most folks on here.
 
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Dave Cleadon said:
Never said he was solely responsible but he is definitely a contributary factor.
Getting the best centre back pairing is important and so the stats are a relevant factor


I completely agree.
I don't like just using statistics but like you after watching him early in the season I had hoped never to need him because he lacks pace.
But I only checked the stats because he has looked slow and also knackered by the 80vth minute.
No coincidence that in our two last games we have conceded very late goals
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But your headline say's Ozturk must not play, so you've singled him out as the reason.
 
Dave Cleadon said:
In the 7 matches Ozturk has started this season we have kept 1 clean sheet and collected nine points.
In the games Ozturk has played we have gained 1.29 points per game.
If this had been continued for the whole season we would have gained 59 points and have finished mid table well off the play off places.
Without Ozturk in the starting 11 we have played 39 games and gained 76 points which is significantly better at 1.95 points per game and in that time kept 12 clean sheets. So without Ozturk we are getting a clean sheet every 3.25 games as opposed to 1 in 7.
Without Ozturk we were on course for 89.5 points but with him only 59 points. A massive 30 points difference.
I know people will say it is just statistics but he has started 7 games which is significant.
Also everyone must realise how slow he is and that includes the opposition.
I think while he is in the team we sit deeper because we dare not push up incase we are caught out for speed at the back.
Jack Ross should at least consider what his best centre back pairing is. If he cannot decide from watching then he might as well use the most efficient pairing statistically which is Baldwin and Flanagan despite letting in 5 freak goals against Coventry
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Thanks for the indepth analysis.
Out of interest in how many of his seven games has a fully fit McGeady played?
 
I think he's just about the best centre half (on form at least) we have, I'd go him and Dunne on Saturday. Still wouldn't be surprised if he gives away a penalty or fucks up somehow, we don't have a reliable centre half.
 
Dave Cleadon said:
Ha ha.
Now that would scare me.
I have seen a Loovens Ozturk combination against Charlton and it worried me to bits.
However as we have 30 000 regular fans I wouldn't be surprised if some people would favour that partnership!!!!
I have watched football regularly for 55 years and it always fascinates me how two people watch the same player and one thinks he is great and the other thinks he is crap.
One of my friends thought Ndong was superb yet I called him NDonkey as I thought he was awful.
There is no categoric answer


More likely to be his father
Ha ha ha
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Just to be clear, I certainly don't think this! :lol:

SAFC Wilks said:
Absolutely not. :lol:

Nothing against him personally but he’s way past it.

Might as well get Gary Breen out of retirement.
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Couldn't agree more.

Baldwin/Dunne for me, as the best of a bad (and getting worse) job.
 
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As has been said on many threads (and often by me) all our centre halves are f***ing gash.
Loovens needs to retire. Ozturk is the physically strongest but just doesn't look like a footballer, I'm constantly worried he'll fuck up and give away penalties.

Dunne is the best defender, and either Baldwin or Flan should be in there with him. As bad as they are they are the best we have.
 
It's hard to argue against him looking like our most solid defender at the moment but I'm still not a fan. He's far too slow and is so clumsy that he's a disaster waiting to happen IMO. Everytime he tries to defend a ball over the top or high into the box my heart is in my mouth.
 
Nelson! said:
There's more to it than just ability. Taking Baldwin as an example; Pboro supporters loved him, he was playing so well they made him captain and he ended up having a poor season. We presumably took the gamble this was a blip and signed him. The pressure of playing at SAFC seems to have really gotten to him, even a family member told a poster on here that fan opinion really gets to him.

I don't think he is a bad footballer, but I'm in the minority. I think he often shows good promise when things are going well.

Keane said that on a few occasions he signed a player he really liked, they'd look excellent in training and as soon as they went out in front of 40k passionate fans they fell apart.

We can't afford to sign the players who have played and been successful at big clubs. I'd love to see us scout from central/south America where the atmosphere/stakes are high but players would likely want to join a club like ours.
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Surely the lesson here is never to get on a player back at the game. No way Liverpool won last night had the fans put any pressure on them. We are an unforgiving crowd....and when it’s third tier standard players they need more patience and support than ever..... unless you want to be down here for ever
 

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