our fans obsession with sacking people


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10th in the Premiership, 'a false dawn' who have you been supporting the last 30 years or so??. or are you old enough to remember Sunderland when they were the 'bank of England club' if you are, I concide

12th if Stoke and Fulham win this week at home against Wolves and Bolton.
 
10th in the Premiership, 'a false dawn' who have you been supporting the last 30 years or so??. or are you old enough to remember Sunderland when they were the 'bank of England club' if you are, I concide

Look at the teams ahead of us and look at the money that's been spent and the quality at their disposal.

We've underperformed this season if the likes of Fulham, Stoke, the mags and Bolton are ahead of us.

Wake up and stop accepting mediocrity, we've done that for years. It's about time we saw some change.
 
Look at the teams ahead of us and look at the money that's been spent and the quality at their disposal.

We've underperformed this season if the likes of Fulham, Stoke, the mags and Bolton are ahead of us.

Wake up and stop accepting mediocrity, we've done that for years. It's about time we saw some change.

take away the horrible run we have just been on, and the biggest change I have wittnessed since Bruce has been in cahrge is taking points of the top 6 teams both home and away. and doing it without having to resort to smash and grab tatics.
 
Yes I do. But that's not what you said, you said the fans have a responsibility. The fans don't have a responsibility.

Personally, I am one of a few who go to the game and sing pretty much non-stop throughout. Others choose not to do so. I'd prefer it if they did but if they don't want to then that's up to them.

It's the paid players, manager and backroom staff who have the responsibility. And to suggest the fans after years of undying support for many of us are responsible is outrageous. We've won nothing and return year after year. We're fed false dawns, led down the garden path on countless occasions yet we continue to support the lads. To suggest we are at fault is just wrong. Sorry.

I have not said we are at fault. To put it simple, if a neutral football fan went to one of our league games and one of our cup games the difference would be evident for them to see in a major way. Why is that?

MBH stated we pick weak teams in these competitions and I showed we did not and the attitude of the players and fans can not be fully controlled by Bruce. He picked strong teams from the 1st team squad for both games yet the attitude from everyone was still crap.

Something needs to change somewhere for us to do well in the cups. As I said we may be better drawn away from home.

12th if Stoke and Fulham win this week at home against Wolves and Bolton.

10th is currently fact. We will talk about 12th if it happens.

It is better to talk about facts than possibilities.
 
take away the horrible run we have just been on, and the biggest change I have wittnessed since Bruce has been in cahrge is taking points of the top 6 teams both home and away. and doing it without having to resort to smash and grab tatics.

That's all well and good but we've had that horrible run. It can't be taken away and we had the same horrible run last year. It's not good enough. Team selections were conspicuous, many signings have been questionable. Not being able to change games has been worrying and our overall attacking play has been nothing short of shocking.

You can defend them all you want but if you look at it realistically, we have been poor for months. Very poor.

Of course we've imrpoved whilst Bruce has been here, he's been able to sign better players! However, I'd love to see a top manager in charge of this team, a manager who really knows how to manage.

I have not said we are at fault. To put it simple, if a neutral football fan went to one of our league games and one of our cup games the difference would be evident for them to see in a major way. Why is that?

Something needs to change somewhere for us to do well in the cups. As I said we may be better drawn away from home.

10th is currently fact. We will talk about 12th if it happens.

It is better to talk about facts than possibilities.

In cups? We didn't get past the first round in either competition mate.

There was nothing wrong with our fans (yes I would have loved us to have filled the ground but understood why people chose not to go). West Ham and Notts County at home in the first round are not a very attractive ties. However, I quite enjoyed the County game as the atmopshere at the back of the SWC that day was great to be part of.

Had we went further in the competition then the attendances would have risen. It's the same everywhere bar at the top clubs.
 
That's all well and good but we've had that horrible run. It can't be taken away and we had the same horrible run last year. It's not good enough. Team selections were conspicuous, many signings have been questionable. Not being able to change games has been worrying and our overall attacking play has been nothing short of shocking.

You can defend them all you want but if you look at it realistically, we have been poor for months. Very poor.

Of course we've imrpoved whilst Bruce has been here, he's been able to sign better players! However, I'd love to see a top manager in charge of this team, a manager who really knows how to manage.


lets change the manager again, like we have done upteen times before, that will work... :lol: :lol: :lol:
 
lets change the manager again, like we have done upteen times before, that will work... :lol: :lol: :lol:

You haven't given an argument why it wouldn't work though. You've just inserted three daft smilies.

I'll give you an argument to support it working...Owen Coyle and Roy Hodgeson. We'll see how they progress but they've been successful short-term.

Brucie has done the minimum for me.

I still can't believe Noble wasn't in the sqaud yesterday.

I take it you felt we should have kept Reid, McCarthy and Wilkinson :roll:
 
Look at the teams ahead of us and look at the money that's been spent and the quality at their disposal.

We've underperformed this season if the likes of Fulham, Stoke, the mags and Bolton are ahead of us.

Wake up and stop accepting mediocrity, we've done that for years. It's about time we saw some change.

What were your expectations/predictions for the season?

Mine was 8-11th. An improvement on last year. We are still on course for this. If it is below this than I will accept we have underperformed. We were out performing my expectations up until January and then the bad run happened as per last season. Every team has them but ours seems to last longer than most. This needs to change as it was 12 games last season and 9 this season.

I don't think we have a team to compete with the top six for a European place yet. So at present we are in a battle with all the teams below that and at present Everton, Bolton & Newcastle are above us. We still have 4 games to change this.
 
We have a squad capable of 6th. We know that to be a fact. In truth, but for late equalisers we could have been even higher. At that point in the season, the pattern regularly was that we would dominate the early part of the games but then opposing managers would make changes that would see us become less effective. Bruce could never respond because essentially, he only has one tactical plan that he sets up pre game and isn't able to react mid game. However, we held on in sufficient games to have a terrific early season.

Also in those early games, the pattern was established that, Bruce wouldn't make tactical substitutions at 60-70 minutes like most managers. Instead he would make seemingly random or forced substitutions at around 80 minutes and interestingly we held the record for most goals conceded in the last 10 minutes.

Then in the second half of the season three things happened. We got unlucky with injuries. Teams knew how to play us. And we lost Bent, who was critical to Bruce's usual formation. This resulted in Bruce trying to shoehorn players into his plans that had been previous effective.

I honestly rate this squad. I don't have an "obsession" with sacking people, nor do I think our fans do. If anything I think the obsession most have is with "clear outs" of players. It makes me cringe when I read this at the moment. We have a great squad run by a manager who will always suffer from late season slumps because he's a great scout but a poor tactician. Plus he's defensive and obstinate by nature.

I think it would be a huge mistake to think we haven't moved on. We absolutely have but the next step has to be to see how these players perform under a flexible, intelligent, imaginative or tactical manager.

Players in: Bryce out. Not obsession, just a next level move.
 
In cups? We didn't get past the first round in either competition mate.

There was nothing wrong with our fans (yes I would have loved us to have filled the ground but understood why people chose not to go). West Ham and Notts County at home in the first round are not a very attractive ties. However, I quite enjoyed the County game as the atmopshere at the back of the SWC that day was great to be part of.

Had we went further in the competition then the attendances would have risen. It's the same everywhere bar at the top clubs.

Aye we did.

What do you mean by the bold part in anyway. I said we need to do better in the cups and your arguement is we didn't get past the first round in either??? I don't get it.
 
You haven't given an argument why it wouldn't work though. You've just inserted three daft smilies.

I'll give you an argument to support it working...Owen Coyle and Roy Hodgeson. We'll see how they progress but they've been successful short-term.

Brucie has done the minimum for me.

I still can't believe Noble wasn't in the sqaud yesterday.

I take it you felt we should have kept Reid, McCarthy and Wilkinson :roll:

in my view it will work becuase he will have learn't from mistakes made during his first 2 years. He will have a clearer direction of how to move foward, have clearer more ambitious goals, he knows the club and the fans. he will have money to spend in the summer, which is a massive plus, and we will have continuity as a club as oppossed to starting all over again. Moyes struggled in his first few seasons at Everton and what would have happened if the board had knee jerked and sacked him. You ask me to argue why he should stay and then present a weak as piss argument yerself, how old are you, 10??
 
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You haven't given an argument why it wouldn't work though. You've just inserted three daft smilies.

I'll give you an argument to support it working...Owen Coyle and Roy Hodgeson. We'll see how they progress but they've been successful short-term.

Brucie has done the minimum for me.

I still can't believe Noble wasn't in the sqaud yesterday.

I take it you felt we should have kept Reid, McCarthy and Wilkinson :roll:

Someone correct me if I am wrong. But I thought he was injured during the week.
 
We have a squad capable of 6th. We know that to be a fact. In truth, but for late equalisers we could have been even higher. At that point in the season, the pattern regularly was that we would dominate the early part of the games but then opposing managers would make changes that would see us become less effective. Bruce could never respond because essentially, he only has one tactical plan that he sets up pre game and isn't able to react mid game. However, we held on in sufficient games to have a terrific early season.

Also in those early games, the pattern was established that, Bruce wouldn't make tactical substitutions at 60-70 minutes like most managers. Instead he would make seemingly random or forced substitutions at around 80 minutes and interestingly we held the record for most goals conceded in the last 10 minutes.

Then in the second half of the season three things happened. We got unlucky with injuries. Teams knew how to play us. And we lost Bent, who was critical to Bruce's usual formation. This resulted in Bruce trying to shoehorn players into his plans that had been previous effective.

I honestly rate this squad. I don't have an "obsession" with sacking people, nor do I think our fans do. If anything I think the obsession most have is with "clear outs" of players. It makes me cringe when I read this at the moment. We have a great squad run by a manager who will always suffer from late season slumps because he's a great scout but a poor tactician. Plus he's defensive and obstinate by nature.

I think it would be a huge mistake to think we haven't moved on. We absolutely have but the next step has to be to see how these players perform under a flexible, intelligent, imaginative or tactical manager.

Players in: Bryce out. Not obsession, just a next level move.

I agree entirely!

Moyes struggled in his first few seasons at Everton and what would have happened if the board had knee jerked and sacked him. You ask me to argue why he should stay and then present a weak as piss argument yerself, how old are you, 10??

He finished 7th in his first full season, after saving them from relegation the season before. 7th!!! Declared Manager of the Year! Stop it with this struggling nonsense!
 
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I agree entirely!



He finished 7th in his first full season, after saving them from relegation the season before. 7th!!! Declared Manager of the Year! Stop it with this struggling nonsense!

Burce finished 13th- not bad either and his 10th now. its early doors, lets stick with him and see where he takes us, it may work, chopping and changing every couple of years does not and that is evidence based.
 
I agree entirely!



He finished 7th in his first full season, after saving them from relegation the season before. 7th!!! Declared Manager of the Year! Stop it with this struggling nonsense!

I think the thing people compare Moyes about, is he seems to have a cycle of 2 or 3 good seasons and a rubbish one. But the board/fans don't knee jerk.

Although listenening to the radio this season there has been Everton fans on saying he needs to go as he can't change a game tactically etc etc.

Be careful what you wish for.
 
Aye we did.

What do you mean by the bold part in anyway. I said we need to do better in the cups and your arguement is we didn't get past the first round in either??? I don't get it.

Yeah ok, we did. I completely forgot about Colchester it seems so long ago now it might as well have been last season.

You said the fans need to do better in cups did you not?

We have a squad capable of 6th. We know that to be a fact. In truth, but for late equalisers we could have been even higher. At that point in the season, the pattern regularly was that we would dominate the early part of the games but then opposing managers would make changes that would see us become less effective. Bruce could never respond because essentially, he only has one tactical plan that he sets up pre game and isn't able to react mid game. However, we held on in sufficient games to have a terrific early season.

Also in those early games, the pattern was established that, Bruce wouldn't make tactical substitutions at 60-70 minutes like most managers. Instead he would make seemingly random or forced substitutions at around 80 minutes and interestingly we held the record for most goals conceded in the last 10 minutes.

Then in the second half of the season three things happened. We got unlucky with injuries. Teams knew how to play us. And we lost Bent, who was critical to Bruce's usual formation. This resulted in Bruce trying to shoehorn players into his plans that had been previous effective.

I honestly rate this squad. I don't have an "obsession" with sacking people, nor do I think our fans do. If anything I think the obsession most have is with "clear outs" of players. It makes me cringe when I read this at the moment. We have a great squad run by a manager who will always suffer from late season slumps because he's a great scout but a poor tactician. Plus he's defensive and obstinate by nature.

I think it would be a huge mistake to think we haven't moved on. We absolutely have but the next step has to be to see how these players perform under a flexible, intelligent, imaginative or tactical manager.

Players in: Bryce out. Not obsession, just a next level move.

Great post, I agree with this completely.

I think the thing people compare Moyes about, is he seems to have a cycle of 2 or 3 good seasons and a rubbish one. But the board/fans don't knee jerk.

Although listenening to the radio this season there has been Everton fans on saying he needs to go as he can't change a game tactically etc etc.

Be careful what you wish for.

Moyes is a different class to Bruce. You really can't compare the two.

in my view it will work becuase he will have learn't from mistakes made during his first 2 years. He will have a clearer direction of how to move foward, have clearer more ambitious goals, he knows the club and the fans. he will have money to spend in the summer, which is a massive plus, and we will have continuity as a club as oppossed to starting all over again. Moyes struggled in his first few seasons at Everton and what would have happened if the board had knee jerked and sacked him. You ask me to argue why he should stay and then present a weak as piss argument yerself, how old are you, 10??

:roll: You're poor at this aren't you? Is self-expression really that difficult for you? Grow up.

I think you made a fair point before your immature remark at the end.

Yeah maybe he has learned from his mistakes. However, he made mistakes last season, mistakes that we're still witnessing this season. So then I ask you, what has Bruce done this season to suggest he's learnt from the mistakes he made last season?
 
You said the fans need to do better in cups did you not?


Moyes is a different class to Bruce. You really can't compare the two.

I didn't specifically state the fans alone need to do better in the cups. The club as a whole needs to if we are ever going to do better in them. As the difference in these games is plain for all to see.

I agree Moyes is different class and that is why I wasn't comparing the two.
 
Burce finished 13th- not bad either and his 10th now. its early doors, lets stick with him and see where he takes us, it may work, chopping and changing every couple of years does not and that is evidence based.

Changing good managers every two years doesn't work, I agree. But changing poor managers does wonders. And it's evidence based.
 
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