No decent spinner and no sign of one!

[GordonMuchallNo1Fan]

You mean the ridiculous uncontested toss rule implemented by the ECB hasn’t worked?? Imagine my shock

Another glorious idea

 

[wayne entwhistle no9]

Another glorious idea

It highlights the poor quality of pitches counties prepare that teams don't even consider batting first. Sadly we are probably the worst offenders.

 

[Voice of fair play]

This might sound harsh as really hard not to like the guy!

But if Somerset had not prepared the wickets they had which were massive turners one particular season Leach would not have got the wickets he did and not been considered for selection.

I really don’t think he is the answer but I suppose similar to some off our batsman who else is there?

 

[Jack Torrance]

This might sound harsh as really hard not to like the guy!

But if Somerset had not prepared the wickets they had which were massive turners one particular season Leach would not have got the wickets he did and not been considered for selection.

I really don’t think he is the answer but I suppose similar to some off our batsman who else is there?

Hes averaging just over 25 in test cricket with the ball, he's done fine

 

[Voice of fair play]

Hes averaging just over 25 in test cricket with the ball, he's done fine

Just don’t think he is the long term answer or a good test spinner guess time will tell

 

[Mr Redknapp]

Leach is the best out out of the lot, and will be handy in the sub-continent.

 

[mackembhoy]

Leach is more than capable of playing the Ashley Giles role of keeping an end tied down and buying the odd wicket through miserly bowling, but you're right - we don't have a spinner who can do that, and run through a side.

I'd far rather have Leach than Moeen, particularly in England - but he won't bowl a side out or be too threatening.

You're definitely right about Ciderabad being a bit factor in his CC stats

Whats Virdi like?

I think the OP is a bit of an over-reaction.

Lyon is the most consistent spinner in all conditions in the world. Yet leach has performed better in the games that the two have played in the series.

 

[Ageing trundler]

Leach is fine as first choice and for now, there aren't any noticably better than Ali and Rashid when the need arises for more than 1 spinner.

 

[rentaghost]

Whats Virdi like?

I think the OP is a bit of an over-reaction.

Lyon is the most consistent spinner in all conditions in the world. Yet leach has performed better in the games that the two have played in the series.

Just going to ask that. 'The Rey' help out on that one? I also think Leach isn't as bad as being painted out. Difficult match - in the first innings there wasn't that much for him and in the second innings here there was they could attack him when they already had a huge lead.

 

[Comeback_Kenwyne]

I assume you mean we missed Ali in top form? - he was no miss in the form he was in.

I don't mind Leach but he's not going to bowl good teams out. It will all be immaterial when Simon Harmer qualifies to play for England anyway.

I think there'll be absolute hell on if they pick Harmer. The usual defences for poaching - Archer's dad, Trott and Pietersen's mum - they just do not apply. He's literally played test cricket for South Africa ffs, it's an absolute joke.

For what it's worth, I have a hunch Virdi could be the long-term answer. He's a big turner, but the way the season is currently structured gives young tweakers not a chance.

I also don't think Leach has done at all badly. I don't know what people were expecting, he was always going to be a tie an end down spinner. Ali will never be that, even when on song he's a matchwinner, an aggressive wicket-taking bowler that leaks runs. We can afford that though, with four seamers and his batting means he's worth a punt. To be honest, Leach's batting isn't really good enough, for all that he's shown great character. If you are a defensive spinner, you can't be coming in at number 11 - whole point of Giles was he would contribute with the bat too.

Just going to ask that. 'The Rey' help out on that one? I also think Leach isn't as bad as being painted out. Difficult match - in the first innings there wasn't that much for him and in the second innings here there was they could attack him when they already had a huge lead.

Big turner, bowls quite aggressive lines and looks to take wickets. A lot of promise, but atrocious batsman which isn't ideal.

 

[Voice of fair play]

I think there'll be absolute hell on if they pick Harmer. The usual defences for poaching - Archer's dad, Trott and Pietersen's mum - they just do not apply. He's literally played test cricket for South Africa ffs, it's an absolute joke.

For what it's worth, I have a hunch Virdi could be the long-term answer. He's a big turner, but the way the season is currently structured gives young tweakers not a chance.

I also don't think Leach has done at all badly. I don't know what people were expecting, he was always going to be a tie an end down spinner. Ali will never be that, even when on song he's a matchwinner, an aggressive wicket-taking bowler that leaks runs. We can afford that though, with four seamers and his batting means he's worth a punt. To be honest, Leach's batting isn't really good enough, for all that he's shown great character. If you are a defensive spinner, you can't be coming in at number 11 - whole point of Giles was he would contribute with the bat too.


Big turner, bowls quite aggressive lines and looks to take wickets. A lot of promise, but atrocious batsman which isn't ideal.

Don’t think people were exoecting too much tbh, as I agree he is a tie a end down spinner, was just saying in the op, don’t think he will take a lot of wickets and be a long term solution.

Not knocking the lad in anyway.

 

[rentaghost]

I think there'll be absolute hell on if they pick Harmer. The usual defences for poaching - Archer's dad, Trott and Pietersen's mum - they just do not apply. He's literally played test cricket for South Africa ffs, it's an absolute joke.

For what it's worth, I have a hunch Virdi could be the long-term answer. He's a big turner, but the way the season is currently structured gives young tweakers not a chance.

I also don't think Leach has done at all badly. I don't know what people were expecting, he was always going to be a tie an end down spinner. Ali will never be that, even when on song he's a matchwinner, an aggressive wicket-taking bowler that leaks runs. We can afford that though, with four seamers and his batting means he's worth a punt. To be honest, Leach's batting isn't really good enough, for all that he's shown great character. If you are a defensive spinner, you can't be coming in at number 11 - whole point of Giles was he would contribute with the bat too.


Big turner, bowls quite aggressive lines and looks to take wickets. A lot of promise, but atrocious batsman which isn't ideal.

Excellent post. Not sure I completely agree about the defensive spinner not coming in at 11 tho! It just depends on the overall make up of the side I suppose

 

[Comeback_Kenwyne]

Excellent post. Not sure I completely agree about the defensive spinner not coming in at 11 tho! It just depends on the overall make up of the side I suppose

True. You basically want a number eight who can contribute.

Going forward that is likely to be Chris Woakes at home, who you would think can put this test summer behind him (I think he just needs a rest) and replace Anderson.

It is likely to be Moeen Ali in the subcontinent, where we will be playing two spinners and three seamers (including Stokes) if not more.

But in Australia or South Africa it may be more difficult. Especially Oz. Woakes has not shown much there and I think they would probably see a pace attack of Archer, Stone and Broad as their preferred seamers. Throw Stokes in and there's a good balance to that - Broad is your line bowler, Stokes can swing and hit the deck, Stone is a fast, skiddy type (looks like he could be a natural reverse swinger to me) and Jof is a line bowler at 90mph!

Problem there is tail is really long and Moeen seems to lose his head with the Aussies. So it's a worry. I think this is why they've tried Overton twice against them now, but whilst his height is generally useful in Australia - pace isn't everything, as Chris Tremlett showed - he really has shown very little.

 

[The Breen Machine]

I think there'll be absolute hell on if they pick Harmer. The usual defences for poaching - Archer's dad, Trott and Pietersen's mum - they just do not apply. He's literally played test cricket for South Africa ffs, it's an absolute joke.

For what it's worth, I have a hunch Virdi could be the long-term answer. He's a big turner, but the way the season is currently structured gives young tweakers not a chance.

I also don't think Leach has done at all badly. I don't know what people were expecting, he was always going to be a tie an end down spinner. Ali will never be that, even when on song he's a matchwinner, an aggressive wicket-taking bowler that leaks runs. We can afford that though, with four seamers and his batting means he's worth a punt. To be honest, Leach's batting isn't really good enough, for all that he's shown great character. If you are a defensive spinner, you can't be coming in at number 11 - whole point of Giles was he would contribute with the bat too.


Big turner, bowls quite aggressive lines and looks to take wickets. A lot of promise, but atrocious batsman which isn't ideal.

I agree, I'll be hugely uncomfortable with it as well but I can absolutely see him and Olivier in the England team in the not too distant future.