New fitness type bloke at SAFC.

Maybe he’s realised this and has brought this lad to the club in an effort to change that. I’ve been yards away from them at the match mate. Some of them are blowing for a tug after 30 mins. That can’t be right. The fitter you are the better you feel.

Again, and I'm no expert here, just using anecdotal evidence from my experience I think that sometimes when things aren't going well you can see tension in players bodies. The great players with unshakeable self belief like Ronaldo never play with tension but I think you can see it with our players. I just don't believe that the fitness regime at the club with the very best facilities outside of the PL, where every fitness parameter is measured would countenance players being stones overweight or significantly below optimum fitness. It's a red herring imo. I'd argue that an appointment of (just for the sake of argument) Keane or Allardyce would have seen a quick uplift in results. Does anyone think that Liverpool's and Man City's form is down purely to fitness or even having great players....imo the winning edge they have is down to the "big characters" they have as managers. That's not to demean in any way their actual skills as managers but imo their personalities make the difference
 


No its not good. A professional athlete should be as close as possible to peak fitness. As I say though I don't think the current malaise is down to a lack of fitness. Think about when Martin O'Neil came in and this is how the results went for his first 15 games...

WLWDWWWLWDWWWLW (Premier League not L1)

The reality is the players were in a negativity loop under Ross and Phil "Mr Personality" Parkinson hasn't changed that.
As usual it’ll be a combination of multiple factors, marra. I reckon you’re spot on with what you say but also think that the players look below peak condition. Additionally I don’t think they’d be capable of playing that high output football even if they were in top shape. We’re an absolute mess.

Parkinson may be a long slow build type - and that could work over time. But the brief was apparently a short term one which, once again, calls into question the processes, abilities and downright basic intelligence of the recruitment team at Safc. That’s before you even start to delve into the deeper question about once again allowing a manager, who experience tells us will be in the job for no more than a couple of years, to completely reshape the way football operations are carried out at Safc. It honestly beggars belief.
 
Again, and I'm no expert here, just using anecdotal evidence from my experience I think that sometimes when things aren't going well you can see tension in players bodies. The great players with unshakeable self belief like Ronaldo never play with tension but I think you can see it with our players. I just don't believe that the fitness regime at the club with the very best facilities outside of the PL, where every fitness parameter is measured would countenance players being stones overweight or significantly below optimum fitness. It's a red herring imo. I'd argue that an appointment of (just for the sake of argument) Keane or Allardyce would have seen a quick uplift in results. Does anyone think that Liverpool's and Man City's form is down purely to fitness or even having great players....imo the winning edge they have is down to the "big characters" they have as managers. That's not to demean in any way their actual skills as managers but imo their personalities make the difference
I would agree up to a point mate. It’s a fact that having a charismatic leader can produce extraordinary things from ordinary people, history has shown us this, not just in sport. My argument is that some of our players lack the basic level of fitness and condition required to be professional sportsmen. That is an individual responsibility first and foremost. Not everything can be laid at the door of the manager. Especially one that hasnt been here that long. Not all footballers play for Klopp or Guardiola. How many teams above us in this league have managers that stand out as great leaders, motivators and command unearned respect? Yet their players appear for the greater part, fitter and undoubtedly better motivated. Basically I would like to see the team take some responsibility and never put in another performance like some of them did against Scunthorpe.
 
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I cannot stop thinking of when PDC was appointed. He immediately started pointing out areas where the players were unprofessional and demanded changes, like not eating ketchup. The reality of being a professional footballer is that, they should think about every little thing. Why shouldn't there be someone at SAFC reminding them of this and pointing and pushing them in the right direction? PDC quickly lost the squad, but the best thing he did for the club was waking some of the players up.

Everyone went on like he was mental with that but when you heard his reasoning about how the body was processing the sugars etc in the ketchup and how that affected performance it made total sense.
 
I would agree up to a point mate. It’s a fact that having a charismatic leader can produce extraordinary things from ordinary people, history has shown us this, not just in sport. My argument is that some of our players lack the basic level of fitness and condition required to be professional sportsmen. That is an individual responsibility first and foremost. Not everything can be laid at the door of the manager. Especially one that hasnt been here that long. Not all footballers play for Klopp or Guardiola. How many teams above us in this league have managers that stand out as great leaders, motivators and command unearned respect? Yet their players appear for the greater part, fitter and undoubtedly better motivated. Basically I would like to see the team take some responsibility and never put in another performance like some of them did against Scunthorpe.

I know I'm repeating myself but I still think it's a negativity loop rather than a lack of fitness. We've seen it many times at SAFC, even at the highest levels. A sudden change in manager or a change of expectations leads to this...


What's very interesting about that, aside from the confidence and flow of our football was that Man Utd were in that post-Fergie era where good players looked anything but.

Any excuse to post that move again :lol:
 
The reality is they aren't unfit at all. Its a different malaise affecting performance. Players lack the self belief to express themselves and the confidence to leave their comfort zone. The negative approach Ross instilled has permeated every area of the pitch, no players take risks anymore. The fans being a bit disgruntled only reinforces the negativity loop. This is why I thought we needed a "big character" as manager. In my opinion it's not fitness that's lacking, it's the self confidence to try things, make those runs and express yourself on the pitch.....which is why imo we haven't seen any improvement since Parky rocked up. He was never the right man for the task in hand and all this lack of fitness bollocks is just that, bollocks.

We hardly had any injuries under BSA he even got Kirchhoff fit

Keane all them last minute goals
 
I dont know the actual weights involved if you want to be pedantic about it

Take your pick

McGeady
McGuire
Mcnulty

Do you think they look like athletes? Trained to the highest degree? Paid thousabds a week?

Over to you Alf

You can still be physically fit to run for 90 minutes without looking like an ‘athlete’.
 
A good mate who isn't on here but watches from afar and also knows really well a couple of people at the club has something to say about this...
He agrees with a lot of what @Lord Alfred says but adds that Parkinson isn't happy with the levels as he wants to play a high pressing quicker game but they generally aren't up to it, only O'Nien has been stopping back regularly after training but recently Dobson and a couple of others have joined him (I think we can guess which ones don't) and what I didn't realise was Grigg commutes from the NW often as he lives there still! Anyway this bloke being brought in should help and the double sessions are coming so we'll see either an improvement or lots of transfer requests!
 
I'm not suggesting players can't be fitter Hank, merely that it's not the reason why we look so shite atm.

Just think they don't give a damn marra
A good mate who isn't on here but watches from afar and also knows really well a couple of people at the club has something to say about this...
He agrees with a lot of what @Lord Alfred says but adds that Parkinson isn't happy with the levels as he wants to play a high pressing quicker game but they generally aren't up to it, only O'Nien has been stopping back regularly after training but recently Dobson and a couple of others have joined him (I think we can guess which ones don't) and what I didn't realise was Grigg commutes from the NW often as he lives there still! Anyway this bloke being brought in should help and the double sessions are coming so we'll see either an improvement or lots of transfer requests!

Ahem wasn't Ross wanting the high pressing game too

Like I posted previously either unfit or couldn't give a toss
 
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I know I'm repeating myself but I still think it's a negativity loop rather than a lack of fitness. We've seen it many times at SAFC, even at the highest levels. A sudden change in manager or a change of expectations leads to this...


What's very interesting about that, aside from the confidence and flow of our football was that Man Utd were in that post-Fergie era where good players looked anything but.

Any excuse to post that move again :lol:
Fair enough marra.
 
Just think they don't give a damn marra

The psychology of losing and underperforming is a complex thing Hank. We as fans always resort to the "rotten core" argument when things aren't going well on the pitch. You can see dramatic change all of a sudden when the psychology around the group changes. If what @Kid Galahad says is true then hopefully the tweaks Parkinson wants to make and any signings he identifies will change the dynamics of the squad.
 
A good mate who isn't on here but watches from afar and also knows really well a couple of people at the club has something to say about this...
He agrees with a lot of what @Lord Alfred says but adds that Parkinson isn't happy with the levels as he wants to play a high pressing quicker game but they generally aren't up to it, only O'Nien has been stopping back regularly after training but recently Dobson and a couple of others have joined him (I think we can guess which ones don't) and what I didn't realise was Grigg commutes from the NW often as he lives there still! Anyway this bloke being brought in should help and the double sessions are coming so we'll see either an improvement or lots of transfer requests!
We really need to move Grigg on in January if possible. It’s not working here for us or him.
 
Maguire will be bricking it now
And McNulty and mcgeady
The psychology of losing and underperforming is a complex thing Hank. We as fans always resort to the "rotten core" argument when things aren't going well on the pitch. You can see dramatic change all of a sudden when the psychology around the group changes. If what @Kid Galahad says is true then hopefully the tweaks Parkinson wants to make and any signings he identifies will change the dynamics of the squad.
True mate. Meal and beer tickets for a few of these pretenders
 
Being successful on the pitch isn't all about physical fitness, but also being strong mentally. Last season there was numerous times when we went behind and the players made some sort of effort to get back into the game. This season, especially the last few games, we've capitulated when we felt threatened. Maybe its time the club appointed a mind fitness coach.
 
No its not good. A professional athlete should be as close as possible to peak fitness. As I say though I don't think the current malaise is down to a lack of fitness. Think about when Martin O'Neil came in and this is how the results went for his first 15 games...

WLWDWWWLWDWWWLW (Premier League not L1)

The reality is the players were in a negativity loop under Ross and Phil "Mr Personality" Parkinson hasn't changed that.
Thing is LA the manager isnt going anywhere in the next 6 mths at least,so what we think is meh.They arnt going to sack him after 8 games.
 

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