Just noticed another...


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Your words:-

They said: "we're 15th in Division 3 playing relegation form with a significantly worse team team than the one that failed to win promotion last season - enough is enough".

Wot does a fans forum knaa aboot coaching a professional team....
At that point in time that was all factually correct
 
Hi, Z's D. And thanks for the civil post. They're becoming a rarity on here when discussing the owners. :)

Most of the quotes have been shown to have been bollocks, mate. The only one that hasn't been that I've found so far that is arguably an untruth from SD was the "We gave Short £40m" line in the owners' first press conference, but even then he went on to say "that was the deal" directly afterwards, and we know that "the deal" was renegotiated after they took over when they realised that certain things like the Ndong situation weren't exactly how Short had presented them originally.

I don't think all people who are anti-SD are acting in bad faith, although a few certainly are. Some are just getting the wrong end of the stick and making the "right" conclusion to the wrong information.

Some folks have been reading something that isn't there into a slightly ambiguous statement (or even into a completely non-ambiguous statement but getting carried away with a few words and accidentally ignoring the rest of the paragraph), and then relaying it either on here, Twitter, FB or real life in a slightly reworded form. Like a game of Chinese Whispers.

We've seen it repeatedly with things like "transfer budget that most Championship clubs would be envious of", which was actually "budget that a lot of Championship clubs would take" during an interview where the owners made it clear they were discussing the entire playing budget, not just the transfer budget.

It has happened so many times that now some people aren't even bothering to check whether each new piece of "anti-owners" information they read on here is real before jumping in and slagging them off. Just look at the lad who signed for Hearts the other day. We had 6 pages of "I despise the owners for not paying 150k for him" from a huge number of posters before someone finally pointed out the quote had been COMPLETELY MADE UP, and by a LADS FAN on Twitter no less. And even after it had been pointed out that the entire thing was a work of fiction, you still had poster after poster joining the thread after only reading the OP to say how much the owners are chancers, skint, ruining the club for not paying 150k for this player.

So, yes, there is a little bit of "bad faith" from a handful of people, a bit of misunderstanding from quite a few others, a whole lot of Chinese Whispers, a whole lot of laziness from people not bothering to check things before diving in with their opinion, all leading to what I've been calling the Whirlwind Of Bullshit where a huge number of people are so convinced by the wealth of accusations against the owners that they don't bother fact checking ANY of it at all. After all, there's "no smoke without fire" and who cares if this point or that point aren't true, there are another 30 or 40 in the pile so at least some of it must be true surely?

Unfortunately for the owners, there's very little substance to ANY of the claims that I've managed to uncover so far. Certainly nothing worth hounding out the owners for.
Great post mate ,in fact post of the year for me take a bow.
 
I have done. Twice. More in some cases. If you have a copy of the sale agreement and bank statements from SAFC, Madrox, the owners or Ellis Short to prove whatever actually happened then I'd very much like to see them. SD said £25m was "ringfenced to pay the bank debt" (via Short iirc) and meanwhile they put £25m into the club themselves iirc. Then they renegotiated the payment plan with Short and as far as I understand it, used another £10m of the parachute payments to pay Short then took out a £10m loan themselves (from the Close brothers) and put it into the club to fund the Ndong situation. £35m out of the club (parachute payments), £35m in.

Like I said, if you have a copy of the finances of SAFC, Madrox, the owners and/or Short to show that this is incorrect, I'd very much like to see them.

What most dont know is SD used his own Wonga to pay the short fall on the Maja and Khazri deal. I dare not tell you about the payments for Catts and Oviedo, to get them off the wage books.
you think all SD has done is lie and distort the truth, that is bollocks, he has done the best he can, without selling us off and doing a runner.
you detesters just wait till we get some kind of finance company owners in, and they really try to milk it.
 
Selective analysis of stats to suit and agenda, where are we now?
Nowt selective about it within the terms of reference. I still have time for DS, feel more he is a bit out of his depth and tries to be positive. Some of his behaviour is questionable. Football fans are entitled to question his stewardship, nothing in the"statement wars" from fans has denigrated the club or city, or fellow supporters, something people running the club can't say truthfully - Methven rather than Stewart here. I think aspects of how the club has operated compromise the transfer window or how the club is perceived more than loyal supporters being upset about the position we are in (slightly improved) and criticising an owner who used them when it suited him but shut up when he didn't like honest questions, then tried to play one set of fans against the other.
 
What most dont know is SD used his own Wonga to pay the short fall on the Maja and Khazri deal. I dare not tell you about the payments for Catts and Oviedo, to get them off the wage books.
you think all SD has done is lie and distort the truth, that is bollocks, he has done the best he can, without selling us off and doing a runner.
you detesters just wait till we get some kind of finance company owners in, and they really try to milk it.

Quotes here from Donald saying Bordeaux kept some of Maja's transfer fee because we owed them it for Khazri. This would suggest we still got some money for Maja on top of what we owed Maja so there was no shortfall. In fact, the opposite.

 
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Quotes here from Donald saying Bordeaux kept some of Maja's transfer fee because we owed them it for Khazri. This would suggest we still got some money for Maja on top of what we owed Maja so there was no shortfall. In fact, the opposite.


Mate we owed them a fortune for Khazri and the pittance we got for Maja was the issue
 
Your words:-

They said: "we're 15th in Division 3 playing relegation form with a significantly worse team team than the one that failed to win promotion last season - enough is enough".

Wot does a fans forum knaa aboot coaching a professional team....


They weren't talking about coaching a team, they were making a statement about where we were in the league and how we were playing, and they were 100% factually correct.

Come on mate, this isn't difficult, you could actually try answering the point and not digressing in a fake clichéd accent.
Hi, Z's D. And thanks for the civil post. They're becoming a rarity on here when discussing the owners. :)

Most of the quotes have been shown to have been bollocks, mate. The only one that hasn't been that I've found so far that is arguably an untruth from SD was the "We gave Short £40m" line in the owners' first press conference, but even then he went on to say "that was the deal" directly afterwards, and we know that "the deal" was renegotiated after they took over when they realised that certain things like the Ndong situation weren't exactly how Short had presented them originally.

I don't think all people who are anti-SD are acting in bad faith, although a few certainly are. Some are just getting the wrong end of the stick and making the "right" conclusion to the wrong information.

Some folks have been reading something that isn't there into a slightly ambiguous statement (or even into a completely non-ambiguous statement but getting carried away with a few words and accidentally ignoring the rest of the paragraph), and then relaying it either on here, Twitter, FB or real life in a slightly reworded form. Like a game of Chinese Whispers.

We've seen it repeatedly with things like "transfer budget that most Championship clubs would be envious of", which was actually "budget that a lot of Championship clubs would take" during an interview where the owners made it clear they were discussing the entire playing budget, not just the transfer budget.

It has happened so many times that now some people aren't even bothering to check whether each new piece of "anti-owners" information they read on here is real before jumping in and slagging them off. Just look at the lad who signed for Hearts the other day. We had 6 pages of "I despise the owners for not paying 150k for him" from a huge number of posters before someone finally pointed out the quote had been COMPLETELY MADE UP, and by a LADS FAN on Twitter no less. And even after it had been pointed out that the entire thing was a work of fiction, you still had poster after poster joining the thread after only reading the OP to say how much the owners are chancers, skint, ruining the club for not paying 150k for this player.

So, yes, there is a little bit of "bad faith" from a handful of people, a bit of misunderstanding from quite a few others, a whole lot of Chinese Whispers, a whole lot of laziness from people not bothering to check things before diving in with their opinion, all leading to what I've been calling the Whirlwind Of Bullshit where a huge number of people are so convinced by the wealth of accusations against the owners that they don't bother fact checking ANY of it at all. After all, there's "no smoke without fire" and who cares if this point or that point aren't true, there are another 30 or 40 in the pile so at least some of it must be true surely?

Unfortunately for the owners, there's very little substance to ANY of the claims that I've managed to uncover so far. Certainly nothing worth hounding out the owners for.

The fact is mate they're just like you - they're SAFC fans who want the best for the club, they just have a different opinion of the owner's than you. The vast majority of those doubting the owners are actually acting in good faith because they believe its true. And they believe its true because despite the positive spin put out in radio interviews, we were shit and our form was relegation form, and those fans - like you - want better for our club than 15th in the third division.
 
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The fact is mate they're just like you - they're SAFC fans who want the best for the club, they just have a different opinion of the owner's than you. The vast majority of those doubting the owners are actually acting in good faith because they believe its true. And they believe its true because despite the positive spin put out in radio interviews, we were shit and our form was relegation form, and those fans - like you - want better for our club than 15th in the third division.

Indeed, I don't hold it against those that have got the wrong end of the stick, have misread or misheard something, have misunderstood, have only heard the Chinese Whispers version of events or have been hoodwinked by the handful who are acting in bad faith. As you say, we all want what's best for the club.

I just wish more folks would check the facts rather than just diving in with their pitchforks half-cocked.
 
They weren't talking about coaching a team, they were making a statement about where we were in the league and how we were playing, and they were 100% factually correct.

Come on mate, this isn't difficult, you could actually try answering the point and not digressing in a fake clichéd accent.

Am a Geordie sweetie, sorry if that offends....
Facts my Fookin arse....They publish a tweet on a weekly basis based upon current form/league position?
Or was it the fact the Don switched them off and it was time for a FU just b4 the transfer winda opened
 
What most dont know is SD used his own Wonga to pay the short fall on the Maja and Khazri deal. I dare not tell you about the payments for Catts and Oviedo, to get them off the wage books.
you think all SD has done is lie and distort the truth, that is bollocks, he has done the best he can, without selling us off and doing a runner.
you detesters just wait till we get some kind of finance company owners in, and they really try to milk it.
Spread the payments over a number of years... it will still come out the club's coffers. In which time sd will be hoping it's someone else's problem
 
What most dont know is SD used his own Wonga to pay the short fall on the Maja and Khazri deal. I dare not tell you about the payments for Catts and Oviedo, to get them off the wage books.
you think all SD has done is lie and distort the truth, that is bollocks, he has done the best he can, without selling us off and doing a runner.
you detesters just wait till we get some kind of finance company owners in, and they really try to milk it.

You're absolutely correct, if that has happened very few people do know it and therefore are completely unable to factor in "facts they don't know" into any judgements they make about the situation. And if it did happen and it was public knowledge then it would put a different perspective on what people think.
Am a Geordie sweetie, sorry if that offends....
Facts my Fookin arse....They publish a tweet on a weekly basis based upon current form/league position?
Or was it the fact the Don switched them off and it was time for a FU just b4 the transfer winda opened

Just because you say they weren't facts doesn't actually stop them being facts - we were 15th and showing relegation form. Posting "Facts my Fookin arse" will never change that.
 
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What most dont know is SD used his own Wonga to pay the short fall on the Maja and Khazri deal. I dare not tell you about the payments for Catts and Oviedo, to get them off the wage books.
you think all SD has done is lie and distort the truth, that is bollocks, he has done the best he can, without selling us off and doing a runner.
you detesters just wait till we get some kind of finance company owners in, and they really try to milk it.
Can you give us a source or show us evidence of this that exists in the real world and not just your imagination like most of the stuff you spout on this board.
 
You're absolutely correct, if that has happened very few people do know it and therefore are completely unable to factor in "facts they don't know" into any judgements they make about the situation. And if it did happen and it was public knowledge then it would put a different perspective on what people think.


Just because you say they weren't facts doesn't actually stop them being facts - we were 15th and showing relegation form. Posting "Facts my Fookin arse" will never change that.

They chose to further destabilise the klerb further when at its lowest ebb....

But yea.....Fans....
 
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