June 21st



That may be so, but considering it takes 12 weeks to get both then another 3 weeks for full protection, it's not fair that we all have to wait another 15 weeks for things to Start opening up


I think they could be doing a hell of a lot more. Unless they are planning the 'if you haven't taken up the offer then fuck ya' approach, they really need to be doing more to convince people to get, if we are continuing with restrictions simply because not enough of the country is protected

Therapeutics would be a good start.

If someone contracts Covid regardless whether the are vaccinated or not - but can get something over the counter that drastically diminishes effects and duration, then the hysteria would end and normality resume.
 
Even that Christina pagal suggested the other day that Sages projections were too pessimistic, and shes been massively pessimistic during this


And if not enough get vaccinated....?

Opening gets delayed.

Of course BHN will be on here creaming himself for being proved correct when in fact hes been completely blown out & everyone else has been proved correct.

Ultimately the vaccines are effective, but they're only truely effective once vast majority take it. He's just trying to carry out some weird self fulfilling prophecy


I think a single dose was more effective against earlier variants, so at the time it was a good strategy. This was also recommended by the JCVI

Another thing I've seen suggested is that had people not been vaccinated in age order & was done more randomly then current spread would have been lower.

:oops: youre actually claiming ill "cream" myself if we dont open up

Embarrassing mate

He cant make his mind up that Ferguson

 
Just from my small pool of people I have asked in real life, there is loads of under 30s not taking it. I've asked maybes 10-15 of the lads at work and probs half have said they won't. I reckon a few of them secretly will.

Does seem to be an undercurrent of attitude that's it's not 'cool' to take it
That is concerning. Hopefully the message that it is now mostly younger people filling up the covid beds, it will push more to just get sorted.

Certainly other countries banning travel will persuade a few. A friend of my mams is dead set against it for all the conspiracy reasons you can list, unless she needs it to go abroad and then she has no problem.
 
Once other countries start saying theyll only allow in the vaccinated, theyll sharp change their minds
Exactly this - once us vaxxers start to reap the freedoms ( and we should ) - the refuseniks might have a rethink.

This is why restrictions need to be placed on the non vaxxers 1) it protects the rest of us and 2) it might give them a kick up the arse to take the needle.
 
Hopefully the message that it is now mostly younger people filling up the covid beds, it will push more to just get sorted.

is that the message though?

i read my fair share on the subject and i'm not really picking that up as the message. it rarely gets mentioned that its the unvaccinated that are getting seriously ill, if that is even the case?

as far as i'm aware, the public perception was always that its older and vulnerable people who are at risk of serious illness and death, and that younger, healthier people weren't ever really at a great risk even if they caught it.

so now we have a prevailing attitude with young people that they dont really need to get vaccinated.

it almost feels like the government are doing this on purpose. why not just tell us straight up what percentage of those in hospital are those with 1 jab, 2 jabs, 3 weeks after the 2nd jab etc..

if the vaccine works then this will surely be all the message needs to be to encourage those in two minds to go and get it
 
is that the message though?

i read my fair share on the subject and i'm not really picking that up as the message. it rarely gets mentioned that its the unvaccinated that are getting seriously ill, if that is even the case?

as far as i'm aware, the public perception was always that its older and vulnerable people who are at risk of serious illness and death, and that younger, healthier people weren't ever really at a great risk even if they caught it.

so now we have a prevailing attitude with young people that they dont really need to get vaccinated.

it almost feels like the government are doing this on purpose. why not just tell us straight up what percentage of those in hospital are those with 1 jab, 2 jabs, 3 weeks after the 2nd jab etc..

if the vaccine works then this will surely be all the message needs to be to encourage those in two minds to go and get it
It is hard to say. The news articles I have read have been saying this, but you almost need to read the small print on some.

How many of us frequent this forum? Same 30-40 every day, plus a few crazies? We are here because we are interested, we read up on the news and we do a big of digging around it, so we know the numbers and who is being affected now. But, I think you are right about public perception, we are not smacking people around the head with this. There have been a couple of headlines about how well it is doing, but they are few and far between.

Some of that is the sick annoying nature of the press. Vaccines working is a success story. There is no scandal in that. You have one extreme, in the likes of the Mail who make up rubbish and blow the smallest negative thing out of proportion. Even the more impartial BBC are very selective in what they publish. I remember the build up one morning where someone like Sainsburys were going to publish their annual accounts, and it was going to be bad. That was going to be an indicator of terrible things to come. All morning on BBC Breakfast "and in an hour we expect this, it will say this and woe, etc etc.". Accounts published, showed a profit, the financial analyst said "actually this is pretty good, totally unexpected". Next news article and the rest of the show, not a mention at all. It was a positive story not a negative, so it was just dropped. If someone had missed the 2 minute announcement, they will have had the impression from the show that finances were bad, but they were not.

It really annoys me, because it feeds the thirst for negativity in society. Trying not to get political, but Brexit was all about negatives of being in the EU (real or not), very few positives were discussed. Elections are all about the negatives of the other side. Don't vote for Corbyn because, but don't vote for May/Boris because. How about doing something because it is positive and voting for someone because they will be a good leader (slim pickings I know)? How about celebrating good news? How about taking an action because it is a good idea?

I'm not sure it is the government not pushing this on purpose. I think is just the thirst for bad news and their lack of awareness. To be honest (and especially after a by-election crushing defeat) it is free positive publicity for Boris. This is my vaccine roll out and look how well it is doing. It is the one thing they have got right in this, one of the few positives and one of the times he can really stand up to show his leadership and he is not taking that bait. It is strange for someone who is happy to stand waving around kippers if it will get him on the front page.
 
Even the more impartial BBC are very selective in what they publish. I remember the build up one morning where someone like Sainsburys were going to publish their annual accounts, and it was going to be bad
Having said that, they interviewed an NHS consultant on BBC News 24 on Monday morning and asked him what the situation was actually like and he said " We are at breaking point". When it was pointed out to him that there were dozens and dozens of NHS hospitals without a single covid patient in them, he still said that they were at breaking point. This interview was dropped from the rolling news loop they have on there.
Just to show a little contrast. But your'e right about the Beeb
 
Having said that, they interviewed an NHS consultant on BBC News 24 on Monday morning and asked him what the situation was actually like and he said " We are at breaking point". When it was pointed out to him that there were dozens and dozens of NHS hospitals without a single covid patient in them, he still said that they were at breaking point. This interview was dropped from the rolling news loop they have on there.
Just to show a little contrast. But your'e right about the Beeb

Was he not talking about getting through the backlog of other stuff?

Even if covid hospital cases are quite small, the NHS are going to be snowed under for next few years trying to get on top of the waiting lists
 
Having said that, they interviewed an NHS consultant on BBC News 24 on Monday morning and asked him what the situation was actually like and he said " We are at breaking point". When it was pointed out to him that there were dozens and dozens of NHS hospitals without a single covid patient in them, he still said that they were at breaking point. This interview was dropped from the rolling news loop they have on there.
Just to show a little contrast. But your'e right about the Beeb
I think there is also the element of other agendas there too, which muddy the water.

The NHS has been stretched to it's limits the last 10 years and really struggling. Even before the pandemic they would have said they are at breaking point. Short staffed and underfunded is just the nature of the role now sadly. Breaking point doesn't mean beds full and we have seen they can go beyond breaking point (even though this may not be sustainable).

If I were a NHS boss put in front of the cameras, I'd be thinking that if I say everything is fine it does reduce public anxiety, but my requests for more funding are undermined. However if I say we are at breaking point then we get more public support and pressure on the government for more money. It is in his interests to say that.
 
That would be a massive help
Keep an eye on this page as cases and admissions are reported to rise. Chart comparing vaxxed/unvaxxed near bottom of page 8.

This will be much more useful going forward for any 'third wave' as in the last one most people were unvaccinated anyway.
 
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All you do is insult me. Shouldn’t of taken you off ignore. If you can’t talk to me reasonably don’t reply to me please

Not arsed if you have me on ignore. I don’t care if you see my replies to you, I’m just making sure that everyone else sees you being called out on your COVID bullshit.
 
I think there is also the element of other agendas there too, which muddy the water.

The NHS has been stretched to it's limits the last 10 years and really struggling. Even before the pandemic they would have said they are at breaking point. Short staffed and underfunded is just the nature of the role now sadly. Breaking point doesn't mean beds full and we have seen they can go beyond breaking point (even though this may not be sustainable).

If I were a NHS boss put in front of the cameras, I'd be thinking that if I say everything is fine it does reduce public anxiety, but my requests for more funding are undermined. However if I say we are at breaking point then we get more public support and pressure on the government for more money. It is in his interests to say that.
Every year there is a legitimate winter peak / strain on the NHS , but there's no doubt it was a political issue before COVID and it'll only increase. The December 2019 election was , second to Brexit, driven by the debate on the NHS and pictures of the young lad on the waiting room floor.

What "worries" me or that I suspect will happen, is it will be politically expedient for the Labour party to suggest or for the Tories to implement restrictions over winter to do everything to cover themselves (politically) against the usual focus. I just cannot see how restrictions won't be brought back over winter.
 

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