Interserve - the next Carillion?

Discussion in 'SMB' started by Secret Visage, Jan 17, 2018.

  1. Secret Visage

    Secret Visage Winger

  2. Frijj

    Frijj Striker Contributor

    How do these companies even come to be providing services to the state? They all seem to be experts in everything.

    Healthcare, construction, admin, school dinners

    Do they just say they’ll do it cheap as owt and do a shit job?
  3. SPUFF

    SPUFF Striker

    Asking suppliers yesterday who is owed off these firms, many contractors wont own up as they know nobody will supply them owt. Scary.
  4. Goat Eyes

    Goat Eyes Striker

    They buy the companies that have been doing it for years then just bolt them onto their business.

    They make them follow their processes and procedures which don’t always transfer and more importantly aren’t the standards the original company sold to the client.
  5. GingerNick

    GingerNick Striker

    problem with all these is they provide services at rock bottom as they ave to pay dividends to shareholders...they paid out hundreds of millions in dividends..they pissed away profits instead of making contingencies

    if they ploughed profits back into providing a better service , or employing more staff to get infrastructure projects done on time..or even finish early think how much better things would be

    capita are a prime example of this
    wilberforce and Goat Eyes like this.
  6. pavarotti1980

    pavarotti1980 Midfield

    Bishop Boy and PTR like this.
  7. Goat Eyes

    Goat Eyes Striker

    I worked for HP and they built their business up through acquisitions and although the wildly varying business types didn’t work they are a smart company to work for.

    They noticed that outsourcing and hardware etc. didn’t go together so split the company out.

    The government needs to intervene in these cases and force a split if that is possible.
  8. yorkyexile

    yorkyexile Striker

    Nailed it. Shit job, take as much as ppossible from the public pot thereby reducing money available for services then fuck off. O difference between them and the career unemployed imo
  9. Power and money corrupts unfortunately. When I started in construction supplies in the 80s we dealt a lot with bloated inefficient and expensive local councils. Jobs for the boys and senior staff all on the take but at least the employment and the money stayed local and a lot of people benefitted.

    It was all handed over to the private sector who were cheaper and more efficient but over time they've got greedy with massive salaries, bonuses and dividends and none of the little people benefit from any of that. Thatcher's law.
  10. Hardyman's Yugo

    Hardyman's Yugo Striker

    My (fortunately) limited experience of being involved in a public sector procurement process (working for an organisation who were part public funded) taught me it's like a massive machine with very little human intervention. All the information goes in at one end and a supplier comes out the other. It's almost like 'machine says this one'. The only human intervention there was seemed to be the procurement team checking that proper process was followed, value for money or relationship management never came into it.

    There is an art to bidding for the major projects and the big organisations know how it works. Big multi disciplinary projects go out to tender probably because they are perceived by the public sector to be easier to manage.

    What I don't understand is why the civil service or other public sector managers of the projects don't appear to have systems in place to ensure the suppliers were behaving in accordance with good business practice and government guidelines on things like paying sub contractors. Back in 1994 the government published something called the Latham report which focused on construction, but brought forward suggested contract changes and best practice for paying the sub contractors. Why things like 120 day payments are still in sub contracts when the government or local authority are the main contracting party is beyond me, its disgraceful. The government are getting a kicking over this, but if the civil service and local authorities set up and managed contracts properly the risk of failures like the Carillion one would reduce
    Billy Rocket and daveydavey like this.
  11. carldp1989

    carldp1989 Midfield

    Yep and they probably know someone in government.

    Crooks the lot of em
  12. Market Where?

    Market Where? Striker

    This is a golden opportunity for the government to buy out PFI contracts for pennies in the pound and make the private sector take the hit.
    They won’t.
  13. sexymuffin

    sexymuffin Midfield

  14. Paddy O'Dors

    Paddy O'Dors Striker

    Was listening to a woman who ran a flooring business yesterday talking about Carillion. Apparently they changed her business to 120 day payments without any negotiation (like it or lump it) then Carillion had the cheek to ask for a sizeable discount if they paid her earlier than the 120 days.
  15. box2box

    box2box Striker

    All the FM companies operate on very low margins so you end up with directors reducing their prices during the bid process simply to win the business and grow their revenues then worry about delivering the service later......

    Also historically FM companies have either been hard or soft services orientated, but to grow revenues most have become ‘total’ FM companies which results in layers of sub contractors chasing an ever decreasing margin.

    I do think the out source model is still valid if done right as it should bring economies of scale and innovation to the service.

    Carillon are definitely not alone in these challenges
    Mackem Al likes this.
  16. Secret Visage

    Secret Visage Winger

    Part of why our company wouldn't deal direct with Carillion.
    One of our customers has lost some work with them and therefore not taking some of our hire kit.

    We only have a small liability with Interserve, as have them on strict 60 days.
    Not worth the exposure for SME's like us.
  17. Probably one reason why they refused to help Carillion

    They get all the outsourced shit back
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  18. Teed

    Teed Striker

    Basically, that's about the sum of it.
    Bishop Boy likes this.
  19. Mackem Al

    Mackem Al Central Defender

    As good a summarisation of the position that I've seen.
    box2box likes this.
  20. Geronimo

    Geronimo Striker

    You forget the private IT companies bidding for Govt contracts for DWP, HMRC & NHS

    Worked for quite a few of the private companies on Govt contracts for ALL of the above industries for 20 years.

    The govt get ripped off right, left & centre on cost, delivery dates, what is actually produced etc etc.

    The main reason IMO was that the Govt departments awarding the contracts (and high placed individuals in particular) had no business acumen. They had been nowhere & done nothing except for being civil servants. Their due diligence is no more lip-service in most cases

    We rang ring around them on cost, deliverables, timescales .

    I don't work for them now but it seems nothing has changed.

    Gravy train
    peil and Frijj like this.

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