How long to sort out this mess

[Wearson]

We need to get relegated and clear the decks, then win loads of games in the lower league and power back to the Prem.

We have cleared the decks , and as usual replaced largely with worse.
It’s called the “Sunderland Way”
We certainly can’t afford going into L2, but we can still go up this season if we have an exceptional Jan window .
Big if ....

 

[Gaz]

I don’t believe we’ll go up this season, after that with a drop in income / crowds will potentially drop off / lot of players out of contract etc. then it could take years imo

 

[foolish prophet]

I don’t believe we’ll go up this season, after that with a drop in income / crowds will potentially drop off / lot of players out of contract etc. then it could take years imo

I’m sure things will improve on the pitch, especially with January coming up. Very unlikely we go up this season under PP, unless we scrape through visa the playoffs somehow.

I wonder what another couple of years would do to the finances? Has SD given color to how the finances look if we fail to go to this year?

 

[Gaz]

I’m sure things will improve on the pitch, especially with January coming up. Very unlikely we go up this season under PP, unless we scrape through visa the playoffs somehow.

I wonder what another couple of years would do to the finances? Has SD given color to how the finances look if we fail to go to this year?

not sure, @Grumpy Old Man any ideas?

 

[Father Jack Hackett]

Parkinson is shite, but this just isn't true with these fuckers. they're absolutely cack.

We were perilously close a few months ago til we bottled it. Only Cattermole who was a regular starter not still here.
No-one person can tell me man-to-man that Wycombe have a better squad than us.

 

[Giddup Sausage!]

I see what you’re saying, but in fairness, we did clear the decks and there was an opportunity to build from the bottom.A decent window last January and then again this summer would’ve had us in a good position to push on but the recruitment has let us down massively. The likes of Leicester, Southampton, Wolves, Leeds have all needed a “reset” and it’s done them Good for the longer term. Our problem is with the decision makers at the club and it has been for a long time

Yes, but there was absolutely zero reason why we couldn't do that in the Premiership and still have the money and status to bring in better players. Going down was an absolute disaster. Just because the Mags done so and walked it got our fans frothing at the mouth that we could replicate it and so many were actually wishing we would be relegated.

 

[Fetch Fletch]

We were perilously close a few months ago til we bottled it. Only Cattermole who was a regular starter not still here.
No-one person can tell me man-to-man that Wycombe have a better squad than us.

We bottled it in January. When we lost James, Oviedo, Maja...our first half of last season cannot be underestimated.
I honestly think this bunch are absolute dogshit mate.

 

[englishman abroad]

I don't rate him at all but I think that was the idea behind his signing. Someone we can bring in and improve

I think your right, still young enough to get better, however under current regime he's going backwards as a player, as are Hume & O' Nein,

 

[Father Jack Hackett]

We bottled it in January. When we lost James, Oviedo, Maja...our first half of last season cannot be underestimated.
I honestly think this bunch are absolute dogshit mate.

We were 2 points behind Barnsley with 5/6 games to go and with 2 games in hand mate. We'd only lost 2 all season and lost 3 of the last 5. We bottled it at the end.
We were also given a gift after 3 minutes at Wembley and had the Championship in our hands before bottling it again.
That shows me these players are definitely capable of play-offs minimum. We just need a half-competent managernif which Parkinsonnis nowhere near.

 

[Grumpy Old Man]

not sure, @Grumpy Old Man any ideas?

I'm probably going to get more accusations of fans' fault here, but never mind. If people stay away in large numbers, it's not great. The nature of our infrastructure means that there's a fairly high level of fixed costs just with running it. The main source of income is going to be gate money, and every 1,000 off the gate will cost around £400k in income. Given the salary cap, that means a £240k reduction in allowable player wage costs. That will inevitably impact what incoming players may be offered. Further redundancies and mothballing of more areas of the stadium will probably have to happen. It's a very nasty vicious circle. Poor performances mean people stay away, but people staying away makes it harder to improve the team. It may need some truly creative recruitment, and possibly a young coach able to operate on a shoestring. People look at solely at our income as the being the highest in the division, and forget that we also have the highest overheads.

 

[Father Jack Hackett]

I'm probably going to get more accusations of fans' fault here, but never mind. If people stay away in large numbers, it's not great. The nature of our infrastructure means that there's a fairly high level of fixed costs just with running it. The main source of income is going to be gate money, and every 1,000 off the gate will cost around £400k in income. Given the salary cap, that means a £240k reduction in allowable player wage costs. That will inevitably impact what incoming players may be offered. Further redundancies and mothballing of more areas of the stadium will probably have to happen. It's a very nasty vicious circle. Poor performances mean people stay away, but people staying away makes it harder to improve the team. It may need some truly creative recruitment, and possibly a young coach able to operate on a shoestring. People look at solely at our income as the being the highest in the division, and forget that we also have the highest overheads.

and that is a by-product of Stewart Donald's ineptitude. No-one can expect to be still getting 30k+ crowds with what is on sale at the minute.
This is a very low income area and I'm sure many make sacrifices to attend. Why should they if the owner is making such a pig's ear of everything?

 

[foolish prophet]

I'm probably going to get more accusations of fans' fault here, but never mind. If people stay away in large numbers, it's not great. The nature of our infrastructure means that there's a fairly high level of fixed costs just with running it. The main source of income is going to be gate money, and every 1,000 off the gate will cost around £400k in income. Given the salary cap, that means a £240k reduction in allowable player wage costs. That will inevitably impact what incoming players may be offered. Further redundancies and mothballing of more areas of the stadium will probably have to happen. It's a very nasty vicious circle. Poor performances mean people stay away, but people staying away makes it harder to improve the team. It may need some truly creative recruitment, and possibly a young coach able to operate on a shoestring. People look at solely at our income as the being the highest in the division, and forget that we also have the highest overheads.

Appreciate all the above. I would have thought the impact would have been a bit more profound than that, although as you mentioned it’s hard to quantify it all until you see the knock on affects of poor performances.

Would you know roughly what the operating loss would be per annum in that scenario given the lack of parachute payments?

 

[naughtynose]

A decent manager would get this squad up now even from this point.

 

[Grumpy Old Man]

Appreciate all the above. I would have thought the impact would have been a bit more profound than that, although as you mentioned it’s hard to quantify it all until you see the knock on affects of poor performances.

Would you know roughly what the operating loss would be per annum in that scenario given the lack of parachute payments?

Not off the top of my head, because I don't know what inroads they've made in cutting fixed costs. Bear in mind that's £400k/1,000. If 10,000 stay away, that's £4m.

 

[chriswallace85]

Unless something drastic happens out of the blue, we'll not be back in the Premier League for at least 10 years.

 

[Kevsgreat]

Giving PP funding to shape this team in his eyes could take a few transfer windows to unwind. This season is a write off, he'll be sacked by March and will leave a thoroughly demoralised wreckage of a squad. Guessing 1 further year to sort out

Agree in that I think Parkinson will be gone by March having wasted the transfer budget. Not so sure it'll only extend our stay here another year though.

 

[Macho]

The biggest mess is the ownership. They took a gamble and it failed.

 

[chriswallace85]

I'm probably going to get more accusations of fans' fault here, but never mind. If people stay away in large numbers, it's not great. The nature of our infrastructure means that there's a fairly high level of fixed costs just with running it. The main source of income is going to be gate money, and every 1,000 off the gate will cost around £400k in income. Given the salary cap, that means a £240k reduction in allowable player wage costs. That will inevitably impact what incoming players may be offered. Further redundancies and mothballing of more areas of the stadium will probably have to happen. It's a very nasty vicious circle. Poor performances mean people stay away, but people staying away makes it harder to improve the team. It may need some truly creative recruitment, and possibly a young coach able to operate on a shoestring. People look at solely at our income as the being the highest in the division, and forget that we also have the highest overheads.

This is precisely what's been worrying me all along.

 

[The Beautiful Game]

Yes, but there was absolutely zero reason why we couldn't do that in the Premiership and still have the money and status to bring in better players. Going down was an absolute disaster. Just because the Mags done so and walked it got our fans frothing at the mouth that we could replicate it and so many were actually wishing we would be relegated.

We couldn’t do it in the premier league though because we had a squad full of players no one wanted and we were making a loss every year. We couldn’t afford anywhere near the amount of investment required into the side to make us competitive at that level. Going down meant the 40% wage bill reduction, players being more open to leaving for reduced terms and parachute payments for the next three years. We’ve just wasted it.

 

[chriswallace85]

I see what you’re saying, but in fairness, we did clear the decks and there was an opportunity to build from the bottom.A decent window last January and then again this summer would’ve had us in a good position to push on but the recruitment has let us down massively. The likes of Leicester, Southampton, Wolves, Leeds have all needed a “reset” and it’s done them Good for the longer term. Our problem is with the decision makers at the club and it has been for a long time

They all had some proper money behind them though. Leeds have been a mess for years and are still f***ing about outside the Premier League - they are not something to aspire to, but as a model for relative success theirs is probably the best we could hope for at the minute.