mackembhoy
Striker
Nothing to do with margin of error he says
Hawkeye founder on 'Umpires Call'
- Thread starter mackembhoy
- Start date
Lumley End
Goalkeeper
I thought when it first came out they had said it helps cover the margin of error, but then also let slip that it was basically there to still give the umpires some sort of purpose.
Jacksnuts
Midfield
seaham ftm
Winger
The more i think about it umpires call should be gotten rid of or where it's pitching and where the impact to the batsman is. Those things are factual 100% and the technology is surely better than the human eye to be able to judge that.
Lumley End
Goalkeeper
That’s how it is anyway isn’t it? Isnt that what the issue was with the Root wicket the other day? People were complaining about why it wasn’t umpires call for where the ball pitched and the reason was because it’s not used for pitching and hitting?
Harry Gates
Midfield
A hat stand would get in the way shirley?
This already happens in tennis at the US and Oz opens and will be rolled out for the whole tour next year. No line judges and challenges any more. The tech just beeps the umpire if it’s out. No technical reason not to do the same in cricket.
Lumley End
Goalkeeper
I see a load of Aussies on Twitter are complaining about it without knowing the laws now. Lyon hit Ravindra full on the toe, because the ball hasn’t pitched, the ball tracking can’t predict the exact pitch and spin so it just sends it in the exact same trajectory it came. That of course meant the ball didn’t spin and didn’t hit the wickets. Tears from the Aussies.
What I get from that is that there is still room for umpires call, but that the margin of error is much narrower. Probably what will happen is that if the umpires call margin is shrunk down to the actual margin of error in the technology, then the number of instances will drop to such a negligible amount that it will seem as if it had been abolished
- game management. Someone has to be there to deal with tempers flaring, delaying tactics etc
- wides. Especially with batsmen moving around the crease and switch-hitting. You could conceivably see that one day a trained AI model might be able to do this in real time but at the end of the day it’s still has an element of subjectivity that’s going to be hard to automate
Even if DRS becomes 100% accurate (and it’s close to being that with advances in both path prediction as well as chips in balls) there are 2 remaining reasons for umpires.
- game management. Someone has to be there to deal with tempers flaring, delaying tactics etc
- wides. Especially with batsmen moving around the crease and switch-hitting. You could conceivably see that one day a trained AI model might be able to do this in real time but at the end of the day it’s still has an element of subjectivity that’s going to be hard to automate
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Randy Ostrich
Striker
The issue is that DRS was there for the howler. You back the on field umpire unless there is a reason not to. Umpire's call does that. There was a moment in the last Test when England were criticised for not reviewing an LBW shout on the half volley. There is no way things like that should be given out, no matter what ball tracking says. If a ball has just bounced you can't be sure what will happen next and the benefit of any doubt should go to the batsman.
Just look at how it's paralysed rugby refereeing in the six nations when umpires are scared of making decisions.
Just look at how it's paralysed rugby refereeing in the six nations when umpires are scared of making decisions.
brandon
Striker
I still think umpires have purpose as game managers - although I have my reservations about how willing they are to get/keep the game moving as it should - irrespective of whether decisions are out of their hands or not.
I think there’s a margin of error with his comments. He’s bound to say that really, but I’m still hugely doubtful that the technology is as precise as he wants people to believe. There are several examples out there of ‘anomalies’ or ‘bad code’ within the DRS process.
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True, those anomalies usually favour India.
DRS Was only there for the howler at first, because it took quite a lot of time to arrive at each decision, so we used it on a challenge basis. But it’s a legitimate question to ask if it’s now so quick that we don’t need to do it on a challenge basis anymore but can run it in real time.
Tennis has made/ is making this transition on line calls. And Football uses goalline technology in real time and is probably not far away from being able to do the same for offside. We wouldn’t advocate moving football to a situation where the linesman still gave marginal goal line decisions, and the technology was only used on a challenge basis. And we would think it plain crackers, even if we did, if such a system failed to overturn a lino who gave a goal when the ball was 53% over the line, because that was “near enough”.
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brandon
Striker
Joking aside, because it’s a hugely contentious issue - I’ve seen many decisions go for us which I’ve shook my head at and even decisions which ultimately I’ve thought were right but have been puzzled by how the technology has got to where it has.
My point is that there’s too much variance with the technology in my view and I don’t believe the bloke when he preaches about how accurate his technology is.
It's easy to joke with recent events, but I expect every team can point to decisions that have gone for them and that have gone against, and in relatively recent times. That's why I don't think it can replace the umpire yet.
Also the comparison with tennis doesn't really work, the technology there is used to determine in a split second where the ball actually landed, whereas with cricket there's always the need to predict where the ball will go next, and while the technology clearly does that very well, the doubt will always be there, and IMHO fans would rather have that job judged by a human than a computer.
DRS may not be perfect, but it is more accurate than umpires and is not affected by player histrionics.
brandon
Striker
Sillypoint
Full Back
seen a few counties are training with that ball tracker AI used on a mobile, wouldnt surprise me, if DRS appeared in County Cricket and even league cricket soon enough using similar tech
