Gender equality at festivals

[HellsBells]

Have a guess

Perhaps women don’t feel they’ll succeed in the industry because there are too many barriers, such as a lack of flexible working, or there aren’t other successful women in the industry so they don’t easily see themselves doing those roles. But I’m just using my experience of being a woman in a male industry and the barriers I have faced, to have an educated guess. I may be totally wrong.

There’s been female role models for ever man. Carol Kaye was a f***ing awesome session bass guitarist, there’s been women only bands since the 60’s The liverbirds, fanny, the slits, the go go’s etc. The thing is have a fantastic drum kit in the house, the boy plays it most days and the daughter ignores it. I’ve spent equal time brainwashing them both with all type of bands from birth. Despite our best efforts, the daughter has gravitated towards shitty chart music. Maybe just maybe the majority of girls are just not f***ing interested.

Or maybe the majority of girls don’t have enough role models. I didn’t say there are none. I say they are under represented.

 

[Aituk7]

Perhaps women don’t feel they’ll succeed in the industry because there are too many barriers, such as a lack of flexible working, or there aren’t other successful women in the industry so they don’t easily see themselves doing those roles. But I’m just using my experience of being a woman in a male industry and the barriers I have faced, to have an educated guess. I may be totally wrong.

Or maybe the majority of girls don’t have enough role models. I didn’t say there are none. I say they are under represented.

But half the roles in biology are filled by women. Obviously it hasn't bothered them.

 

[HellsBells]

But half the roles in biology are filled by women. Obviously it hasn't bothered them.

Not according to the links I posted and the ones you referenced?

 

[Aituk7]

Not according to the links I posted and the ones you referenced?

I'm just reading back over what you've said.

You mentioned lack of flexible hours. That's my point aswell btw. It's that women are on average a lot more picky about what they are willing to do for a living.

 

[HellsBells]

I'm just reading back over what you've said.

You mentioned lack of flexible hours. That's my point aswell btw. It's that women are on average a lot more picky about what they are willing to do for a living.

The links I posted and the ones you agreed with state that women are under represented in biology.

And flexible hours isn’t about being picky. It’s about still being primary carers and needing flexible hours, on the whole.

 

[Aituk7]

The links I posted and the ones you agreed with state that women are under represented in biology.

And flexible hours isn’t about being picky. It’s about still being primary carers and needing flexible hours, on the whole.

Which means they will always be at a disadvantage in the jobs market.

However to bring you back to my earlier point. Biochemists and rockstars are fairly niche when it comes to the working environment.

When you look at the vast majority of discrepancy in wealth between men and women you'll find it exists largely at the lower end of the jobs market relative to education.

There's a reason the most dangerous, grimy, filthy jobs happen to be the better paid ones and there's a reason they are dominated by men.

Women don't want to do them. Men don't either by the way, they are just willing to do shitter jobs.

 

[HellsBells]

Which means they will always be at a disadvantage in the jobs market.

However to bring you back to my earlier point. Biochemists and rockstars are fairly niche when it comes to the working environment.

When you look at the vast majority of discrepancy in wealth between men and women you'll find it exists largely at the lower end of the jobs market relative to education.

There's a reason the most dangerous, grimy, filthy jobs happen to be the better paid ones and there's a reason they are dominated by men.

Women don't want to do them. Men don't either by the way, they are just willing to do shitter jobs.

I don’t really think that men want to do them either.

it’s just that gender norms have dictated they do them. Same as women more generally do roles like wiping arses and vomit at care homes. I’m sure they don’t want to do those roles either.

If we get gender equality right, it’ll benefit everyone, from the rockstars to the binmen (and women).

 

[Aituk7]

I don’t really think that men want to do them either.

it’s just that gender norms have dictated they do them. Same as women more generally do roles like wiping arses and vomit at care homes. I’m sure they don’t want to do those roles either.

If we get gender equality right, it’ll benefit everyone, from the rockstars to the binmen (and women).

And it'll never happen.

This idea that it should be the goal of society to have everything represented equally along however many lines is not achievable and an awful lot of time and money is going to be wasted in pursuit of it as it already has been.

I just do not buy this idea that women and girls are wallflowers that need constant help to get the most out of their lives, nor do I believe they are secretly wanting to do all of these things but just feel they cant for lack of other females doing it before them.

There are cases of sexism in all ares of life I've no doubt, but I don't believe the answer for why there isn't 50% of females in every single field is simply sexism.

I spent two years working with stemwise and they've changed tack completely over the last few years as theyve realised they simply are not going to get anywhere near the number of girls into engineering and science roles they expected or hoped to. Girls just aren't interested.

And I don;t think it's necessarily a bad thing, if the goal of life is to be happy then let them do what they want.

That's not to say they can't by the way, I hope any girl who wants to succeeds at the highest level ofcourse.

Diversified thinking is always valued at all stages of any engineering process.

 

[Seaham Towny]

From a government point of view I do wonder why some 'womens' jobs are undervalued. Nurses in particular have to go through university, start with shit pay, do shit hours in often traumatic circumstances. More women probably chose to do this in general because of this human interaction, but because they generally start in the NHS it's the government that deems this occupation to be of low financial value.

The physical thing I agree with but there will still always be a difference. Even just yesterday a lass at work asked me to carry a box into the office as it was too heavy for her. She does a similar job to me.

Slightly off topic, my boss is a woman, good at her job sure... as smart as I am? Definitely.

When we had to move floors the other day though, despite having had many conversations about how men and women should be absolutely equal...

‘Can one of you lads carry this table upstairs for me?’

 

[mad cyril]

There’s been female role models for ever man. Carol Kaye was a f***ing awesome session bass guitarist, there’s been women only bands since the 60’s The liverbirds, fanny, the slits, the go go’s etc. The thing is have a fantastic drum kit in the house, the boy plays it most days and the daughter ignores it. I’ve spent equal time brainwashing them both with all type of bands from birth. Despite our best efforts, the daughter has gravitated towards shitty chart music. Maybe just maybe the majority of girls are just not f***ing interested.

my post above is exactly this, we even have the drum kit also.
lasses are less interested hence less female musicians and absolutely nothing the matter with that.

 

[I'm Spartacus]

my post above is exactly this, we even have the drum kit also.
lasses are less interested hence less female musicians and absolutely nothing the matter with that.

It’s like demanding the women’s institute have equal representation. They wouldn’t get it because the majority of blokes just aren’t f***ing interested.

 

[mad cyril]

It’s like demanding the women’s institute have equal representation. They wouldn’t get it because the majority of blokes just aren’t f***ing interested.

Its certainly not a criticism but I certainly think it’s fact. There’s fewer role models because theres lower interest in picking up instruments.
there’s no underlying or underhand issues here that I can see.

 

[Aituk7]

Its certainly not a criticism but I certainly think it’s fact. There’s fewer role models because theres lower interest in picking up instruments.
there’s no underlying or underhand issues here that I can see.

Exactly, lasses just aren't as interested.

I don't get why it's a problem. Just let them crack on with what they enjoy doing. If they want to pick up an instrument and practice it, absolutely nothing topping them

 

[Morphey]

My opinion is that aye its kind of shit for young lasses growing up (14-20) and seeing festivals dominated by men in a world, largely run by men. But it's not gonna change overnight and they don't need to make a song and dance about how they're going to make it more equal.

It's in industry problem and it'll take time for the music bosses, most likely blokes, to find these lasses that we find equally as talented as the blokes. They are already out there

 

[wash]

So where is Edina Sheeran or Louise Capaldi

 

[Slow joe]

I'd much rather watch an all male group rocking the place than some cutesy wutsy little mix shite with their dancing and tits hanging out.

 

[I'm Spartacus]

Or maybe the majority of girls don’t have enough role models. I didn’t say there are none. I say they are under represented.

Or maybe they’re picking the wrong role models. Maybe if they aspired to be something other than clones of narcissistic orange fat lipped internet airheads they might be more coming through.

 

[HellsBells]

Or maybe they’re picking the wrong role models. Maybe if they aspired to be something other than clones of narcissistic orange fat lipped internet airheads they might be more coming through.

Maybe if they had more female role models who weren’t like that, you know some actual rock stars at festivals, then there would be more role models to choose from?

 

[I'm Spartacus]

Maybe if they had more female role models who weren’t like that, you know some actual rock stars at festivals, then there would be more role models to choose from?

And where’s those female role models coming from when most young girls are welded to their f***ing phones idolising orange plastic gods? I think it’s time for women to get off their f***ing arses and take responsibility for themselves to be honest. I’ve got several all female bands on my Spotify playlists and enjoy them immensely but I’m fucked if I’m paying top dollar to watch shite just to tick boxes.

 

[The Great MES]

Just watching the 6 music festival which tonight has an all female line up (in recognition of world Women's Day) and Kim Gordon was absolutely amazing. Our old friend Kate Tempest is on next