France bans the Burka


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And for why? Cos some people don't like it? Or feel scared by it? Well, many more people feel threatened by drunk white men, so shall we ban public drinking?

Great point that. Should have curfews for teenagers as well, because a lot of older folk feel threatened by them. And so on.
 
Different kettle of fish altogether.

Becoming a nun is a fully voluntary act.

And also they don't cover the face, but never mind you stick with it anyway.

And women aren't voluntarily muslims? :lol:

I'm not talking about the covering of the face, because you specifically turned the argument into one about religious dress codes.
 
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It's only shit because nobody bothers with it. If people made as much fuss about it than Guinness Promo day then it would be a decent day out.

Killing a dragon would rank bigger than telling snakes to piss off as well, in my eyes. Who's the real hero here?
 
Different kettle of fish altogether.

Becoming a nun is a fully voluntary act.

And also they don't cover the face, but never mind you stick with it anyway.

Not fully. A lot of nuns are forced into it by parents, especially in the Catholic church.

It's a fair comparison. If your issue is women having to cover themselves for religious reasons, why is it only the face that upsets you?

What about the act of circumcision in the Jewish faith? That's a pretty barbaric relic of a bygone age. Ban that too?
 
Feeling threatened FFS. :lol:

They don't threaten me. I'm not scared of them.

They don't threaten me either, you daft twat.

I was merely echoing the point that if banning covered faces is fair enough because it makes people feel threatened, then this is no different, it's just a logical extension of the same argument. I don't actually advocate it.
 
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Not fully. A lot of nuns are forced into it by parents, especially in the Catholic church.

It's a fair comparison. If your issue is women having to cover themselves for religious reasons, why is it only the face that upsets you?

What about the act of circumcision in the Jewish faith? That's a pretty barbaric relic of a bygone age. Ban that too
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They don't. Nothing in the bible about wearing them.

And yes I would.

So you objection is purely about the freedoms of women?

Yes.
 
Not fully. A lot of nuns are forced into it by parents, especially in the Catholic church.

It's a fair comparison. If your issue is women having to cover themselves for religious reasons, why is it only the face that upsets you?

What about the act of circumcision in the Jewish faith? That's a pretty barbaric relic of a bygone age. Ban that too?

Female circumcision is actively campaigned against mind, though it's different cos it takes place when you're older I think, and is actively about removing the prospect of enjoying sex to a degree. Just a wee bit of info as an aside.
 
Female circumcision is actively campaigned against mind, though it's different cos it takes place when you're older I think, and is actively about removing the prospect of enjoying sex to a degree. Just a wee bit of info as an aside.

Male circumcision has its benefits. Female circumcision has none and is a truly barbaric act.
 

So where you do you draw the line?

If it's women you're concerned about, the 'glass ceiling' is a bigger and more provable form of oppression than the burqa, so would you support state-controlled positive discrimination?

And if it's about religious oppression generally, would you favour the state banning other oppressive religious acts, such as male circumcision, the act of confession due to religiously defined 'sin', the lack of access to electrical goods and machinery afforded to orthadox jews on sabbath, etc.?
 
I went to a fundraiser about it (the prevention thereof), seemed nasty and oppressive yes

I watched an Unreported World episode or Despatches (can't remember which, but a show like that) which covered the practice. Truly harrowing.

Evidently going to a fundraiser was a bit more proactive than me sitting watching a documentary feeling bad though. Good on ya!
 
I watched an Unreported World episode or Despatches (can't remember which, but a show like that) which covered the practice. Truly harrowing.

Evidently going to a fundraiser was a bit more proactive than me sitting watching a documentary feeling bad though. Good on ya!

My wife is a saint and I get carried along in her pious wake. Otherwise, despite wanting to considered a moral and good person, I think I would be too lazy :neutral:
 
My wife is a saint and I get carried along in her pious wake. Otherwise, despite wanting to considered a moral and good person, I think I would be too lazy :neutral:

My issue. I go on about various things, watch various docs and programmes that expose all of this horrific stuff but do very little about it other than feel bad that it goes on.
 
It would be much more preferable if these Muslims simply respected British culture and social norms and did not cover their face in public. Surely respecting the culture of the country you're in is more important than your own beliefs?
 
:neutral:Should we follow suit

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...arrested-in-France-as-burka-ban-comes-in.html

The muslim lads I know say there is no need for it in their faith

I don't think we should follow France in this or many other stances they tend to take. Their secularism seems very principled on the face of it but I think it's a convenient philosophy for them to hide behind when they just want an excuse to ban something "foreign".

The Burkha doesn't seem very nice for women or particularly relevant to the 21st (or 20th) century. I'm sure it made a bit more sense in Arabia 1400 years ago, which was a pretty lawless, wild and ignorant place (a bit like a middle-eastern version of Spennymoor these days) but after one and half millennia the world ought to be moving on.

Having said that, there's lots of things I think are antiquated and unacceptable: The Pope, The Monarchy, the FA - but I wouldn't seek to ban them either.

The new law in France will needlessly radicalise people currently in the political mainstream particularly when burqa wearers start getting fined and (inevitably) some will refuse to pay the fine and get sent to prison. Needlessly creating martyrs over something quite trivial in the grand scheme of things - we are talking about an item of clothing here.

Far more important steps towards social cohesion include no state funding of faith schools, christian or muslim and an enforced minimum standard of english for jobs in public service (particularly if someone has been resident in the UK for more than say, 2 years). Those are far more important than banning the burqa.

I believe most English people don't like the burqa but are prepared tolerate other people's right to wear it. I may be wrong.

I also think the French are more intolerant.
 
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It would be much more preferable if these Muslims simply respected British culture and social norms and did not cover their face in public. Surely respecting the culture of the country you're in is more important than your own beliefs?

How is covering your face "not accepted in British culture"? Why consider banning covering your face, if its not an issue? Ie, people don't do it...oh except a small minority of muslim women? :roll:
 
How is covering your face "not accepted in British culture"? Why consider banning covering your face, if its not an issue? Ie, people don't do it...oh except a small minority of muslim women? :roll:

Because it is how we identify each other. It's tacit in that it's just an understood and accepted part of culture and social norm that you would not cover your face in public. People don't walk around in balaclavas and if they did they would be lifted.

Do we need a ban? Probably not no. But it's still disrespecting British culture. Wherever I travel I learn about their customs and culture and try to follow and respect that. I would expect people to do the same coming here.
 
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